Section 21 advice pls!

clprincess

Hi Everyone, I have never posted on a forum before so I will try and keep it as short as possible....
I am currently renting a property and my tennacy expries on 18th June. Back in March I was issued a section 21 from my estate agent as my landlady is wanting to sell. The section 21 has given me until 18th June to vacate. I understand that this is not the offcial date I have to move as its just a notice that she wishes to seek pocession. My local council paid for my bond and I am in recept of housing benefit. My housing department have told me I have to sit tight until I receive the baliffs letter and then they will "consider" re homing me!
I have deceided that I am going to move out of the area and move in with my partner. I know once I do this my local council will not help me but I am not worried about that.
What I wanted to ask was, if I was to stay in the property after the section 21 and tennacy runs out (18th June) do I have to stay until it goes through the courts or do I have a right to leave before court procedings end. I have a daughter at nursery so wanted to stay until end of July when she finishes nursery. I am then happy to move in with my partner ready for her to start school in Sept.
Does any one know if I can stay and then give my landlady notice while court procedings are on going? And also, would I be liable for court costs?
Thanks for any help. Hope I have made it clear.....Was quite hard trying to word what I wanted to say!!!!!!!!!

taxsaver

Why don't you just try to talk to your LL in the first instance?

She will quite probably be happy to oblige rather than going to court, especially if you offer to allow the house to be put on the market and permit reasonable access for viewings.

Naturally you should also continue to pay rent that falls due, even after the 18th.

Hump

(Assuming you live in England/Wales) You can stay right up until the day the bailiff arrives to evict you - 2 important points - you remain liable for rent until you leave (so no rent free periods!) - and the landlord will probably ask the judge to make an order that you pay the landlord's costs in relation to obtaining the order (which is going to be at least a couple of hundred quid).

So speak with the landlord and see if they will hold off going to court until the end of July - and then only if you've broken your promise and not moved out - you'll both save money.

Werdnal

Welcome to the forum.

I would second the advice above. Your LL may be happy for you to stay on for the extra 6 weeks, particularly as they are looking to sell, so won't have another tenant lined up to come in. It would be much better to approach them and ask, than sit tight and let them start court proceedings, as ultimately you are intending to "go quietly" anyway!

You could obviously suggest that you would be happy to accept any viewings that come up in the meantime, and for estate agents to visit and photograph/measure the property etc. So long as you are open and honest, the LL may be only too happy to accept your suggestion and gain a few extra weeks rent into the bargain.

clprincess

Hi,
Thanks for your replies.
I am more than happy for people to come and view if she wants to put property on the market.
If I was to ask her to hold off until July do I just sign a new tennacy agreement with the estate agent? and will the council still pay my housing benefit?
If I sign a new ta will it be a year like I had before? And I assume I would have to give her the normal notice to quit?

may_fair

clprincess wrote: »

Hi Everyone, I have never posted on a forum before so I will try and keep it as short as possible....
I am currently renting a property and my tennacy expries on 18th June. Back in March I was issued a section 21 from my estate agent as my landlady is wanting to sell. The section 21 has given me until 18th June to vacate....

What I wanted to ask was, if I was to stay in the property after the section 21 and tennacy runs out (18th June) do I have to stay until it goes through the courts or do I have a right to leave before court procedings end.

If you remain in occupation after fixed term expiry, then a statutory periodic AST will automatically arise; the terms of the expired contract carry through into the periodic tenancy (e.g. rent payable), except for any provisions relating to notice.

As you know, a s.21 is not a notice to quit; it does not end the tenancy nor oblige you to vacate. Nor does it affect your entitlement to unilaterally end the tenancy either by vacating at fixed term expiry, or by serving notice to quit once the tenancy has become periodic.

As from 19th June you would have to serve at least one month's notice, also expiring at the end of a tenancy period. The periods will begin on 19th June*, and their length is based on the frequency with which rent is payable; so, if you pay rent monthly, then the periods will run 19th - 18th of the month and your NTQ would have to expire on the 18th of the month.

* Are you certain 18th June is the last day of the fixed term? What date did the term commence (dd/mm/yy), what is the length of the term, and does the contract specify an 'end' date?

clprincess

In reply to may_fair.
My tennacy started on the 19th June for 12 months and runs until 18th June. It states on my ta "a term certain of 12 months, from 19th June 2010 to 18th June 2011. The section 21 states tennacy start and end date and says procession of the property on or after 18th June.
I have been in the property for 4 years and just been signing a new ta every year.

Werdnal

You do not need to sign a new agreement every year, and definately do not sign another 12 month term, otherwise you will be bound for 12 months rent!

When a fixed term AST expires, if no one has given notice, it automatically becomes a statutory periodic tenancy, requiring you to only give 1 month's notice to leave, and your LL needing to give 2 month's. For the last 4 years in fact, there was absolutely no need for you to renew anything, you could still have remained in residence under the terms of the first tenancy you signed, only the notice periods change.

However, as LL has issued notice in this case, the theory is that after notice expires, your LL will apply to court for possession. Your tenancy continues until that possession is granted and baillifs arrive on your doorstep. You are also still liable for rent and bound by all other terms of the tenancy agreement. As you want to negotiate an extension to the notice given, you only need speak to your LL, and if they agree, continue as normal, paying rent up to the last day your have agreed on the extension. LL may choose to issue another S21, as after granting an extension, the original one is invalid, so to cover themselves, they may issue a new one with the later date showing when they will apply to court.

Hope this makes sense!

G_M

These things are always best resolved amicably rather than through the courts.

The LL wants to sell, so a) wants the property empty and b) wants to be able to show people round.

You want to leave too. It makes sense for you to both agree on a mutually acceptable leaving date. As said above, if you agree to viewings it benefits the LL (who also gets a bit more rent) as well as you.

You do not need to sign a new 6 or 12 month agreement. Just agree between you when you will leave, and how much notice you'd like before the LL brings buyers round.

The courts are only needed where you and the LL fail to agree. And the courts are stressful and cost money, so best avoided.

clprincess

Hi Werdnal,
thank you for your replies.....Not sure if I am being a bit thick but am still a lttle confused......Does that mean I do not have to deal with my estate agent once my ta runs out? I will not have to sign anything at all so myself and my ll will have nothing in writing? Or will I need something in writing from her if she does agree to the extension? Also, my rent is paid direct to estate agent via my local council, so do you know if that would still happen? As normally every year I have to send them a copy of the new ta.
Sorry for sounding so thick and silly and for asking new questions...Just wanted to make sure I was 100% certain so when I call my LL I will be able to expalin it all to her and have the answers to any questions she may ask......
I cant see her saying no, as we have quite a good relationship and have always been honest with each other. I am more than happy to do all I can to help her sell and I am sure will be happy for me to stay for extra 6 weeks (as she will know it is for my daughters sake) If I can assure her that doing this will be in her best interests and she will save money on court costs etc then i know she will be ok with it.

G_M

It's always a good idea to get any agreement in writing - but it can be very informal. Just a note from the LL saying you can stay till XXX (he may issue another S21 as said above just to cover the possibility of you note leaving at that time) and a not from you about viewings.

If the agent draws up a contract or agreement, doubtless they will charge a fee to you and/or the LL for doing so! Not necessary.

Housing Benefit should continue, and if it goes to the agent, the agent will continue to pass it to the LL - that's what he pays them for!