start a non profit or just be self empoyed?

Stefka_2

Hello I am hopnig for a bit of advice. I am hoping to start a theatre class for young people but I am torn between trying to start a non-profit or just setting up on my own and being self employed.

I would like to be in a position to offer some bursaries and I am aiming to keep the classes as cheap as possible without them costing me money. However I would also like to be able to give myself a wage - just the going rate for a freaelance drama teacher.

Starting a non-profit seems very complicated however and I feel shy about trying to get people to be trustees etc when I plan to pay myself a wage. It would mean I might be able to get some funding to offer bursaries though. If I am self employed and just run it for myself I can make enough money to pay myself as long as I fill the classes to capacity but I wouldn't have money to offer free places unless I put the cost up for others.

I have never done anything like this before but would love to give it a go so any advice about which direction to go in would be great.

Annisele

A "non-profit" isn't really a legal structure in England and Wales. You can be self-employed, you can set up a partnership, or you can set up a limited company. All of those can make (or fail to make!) a profit, and they can choose to reinvest any profits they do make wherever they like. There are few variations on those themes (LLP, PLC) but they're the basics.

I'm a bit worried by your "I've never done anything like this before" comment. Do you mean you've never worked as a drama teacher, or just that you've never tried to set up a business? If the latter, I'd just start off being self-employed and see how it goes.

If you've never worked as a drama teacher before, do you have the qualifications you need / know about CRB checks / all that sort of stuff?

Stefka_2

I am qualified drama teacher but have always worked for others. I just want to do something for myself so that I can have some creative control for once. Fully CRB checked etc so all that is covered. I think self employed is the way to go, I suppose if I make extra money then I could use that to offer a free place to someone. I really want it to be accessable but don't want to end up out of pocket.

Annisele

Stefka wrote: »

I am qualified drama teacher

In that case, my apologies. We get quite a few posts on here along the lines of "how can I set up a call centre in India" or some such from people with absolutely zero experience of their chosen industry. Just wanted to check that that wasn't you - if it was, then legal structure is irrelevant.

Would your current employer be happy with you running the classes on a part-time basis whilst you kept your current job?

Stefka_2

Ah, well now you have mentioned call centres in India maybe I will go off and do that instead!

I am going to be working part time in my school anyway so I was planning to do this one evening a week as well. I don't get much freedom at my school and it frustrates me so think this will keep me sane. I am just torn between having something that will make me a few pennies and having something that is going to be accessable to young people in the area some of whom do not have a lot of money. Some of these stage school type affairs can be very expensive although now that I am costing it all I am starting to see why!

pleasedelete

Your crb only covers you when working the employer it was done for, when self employed you need to get another one. I have 5! You need to find an umbrella organisation to do it.

You also need public liability and indemnity insurance (try hiscox) which will be hefty for a business of that kind.

Savvy_Sue

Stefka wrote: »

I am going to be working part time in my school anyway so I was planning to do this one evening a week as well. I don't get much freedom at my school and it frustrates me so think this will keep me sane.

The normal advice is to check with your current employer that they don't mind you running your own business in your spare time - I would imagine it's not unusual for drama teachers to have several different contracts / lines of work on the go, but probably still worth making them aware.

Stefka wrote: »

I am just torn between having something that will make me a few pennies and having something that is going to be accessable to young people in the area some of whom do not have a lot of money.

Very few people make more than 'a few pennies' in the performing arts, but I guess you know that!

Stefka wrote: »

Some of these stage school type affairs can be very expensive although now that I am costing it all I am starting to see why!

:rotfl:

Going off on a tangent, are there existing clubs / theatre groups you could get involved in? Even if they don't seem very accessible at the moment, could you - with a bit of enthusiasm and a fresh set of contacts - open them up to the kinds of young people you're aware of?

Mind you, that might not lead to paid work, I guess it depends what's more important to you.

GilbertGradgrind

If you start a charity then you need to get trustees. It is not something that you can be shy about. The role of the Trustees is not just to be a benevolent presence - they have a really quite hard headed function.

Setting up a charity has quite a bit of guidance from the Charity Commission but it is not a simple one stop shop affair (http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Publications/cc21.aspx). Have you considered creating a community interest company - which is less onerous than a charity. This could be done with a charity being named as your "Community Interest". This would have the added advantage (while requiring effort on your part) of giving you an external guiding set of existing trustees. Which might help with your "shyness" and also give a structure for ongoing safeguarding requirements.

This might allow you to apply, for example, to the Lottery Awards for All to bring together your chosen charity (check theatres in your local area - lots have charity status), yourself and some business advice (your local economic development office at your local council might exist and might be able to help) to develop something around community engagement, theatre workshops and 'distractionary activities' which would allow the Police to give you small pots of money to run one off workshops within community centres. For that you would need to justify drama as a form of personal self development that persuades (particularly male 13-21) people to pursue a law abiding life. Oliver Reed apart, that should not be too difficult. This might give a way to channel money towards people who would benefit from drama without having to be independently wealthy.

Your employer can object to you running your own business in your spare time but that would need justification to avoid the impression that it was restraint of trade. Your employer only has control over the hours they pay you for regardless of what they think. To be perfectly honest, most employers objecting to "other enterprises" are probably better off being replaced - but only in my opinion.

Stefka_2

Thank you so much for all the replies! It's great to talk this through with people.

I hear you about the CRB checks! I have so many I could wall paper my house with them, they drive me nuts.

What is indemnity insurance? Not heard of that one.

There are existing groups, did try to get involved in one but it was quite a closed shop. They are good but they don't really work in the way that I want to. Kids have to audition to get in and they focus on putting on big shows, I want to look more at devising and helping young people to create their own work. I love the idea of doing community projects too though. I will look into the community interest stuff too.

I am thinking just a wee class for now and see if anyone wants to actually do it and hope that I can run it without ending up out of pocket! Advertising it is going to be the next issue as I called the local paper the other day and I had no idea how expensive advertising was! It's a steep learning curve all of this!

HappyMJ

Stefka wrote: »

What is indemnity insurance? Not heard of that one.

Taking on staff to help you then you'll need Employers Liability (EL) insurance to cover them against workplace injuries.

You need to have Public Liability (PL) insurance to cover the public against any injuries you may cause them.

Professional Imdemnity (PI) is optional and insurance against claims for a poor product or service provided. You either need to choose between giving a full refund or fighting it in court. The PI insurance will pay the costs.

mitch161

starting up always makes people worry. but some people think its soo expensive to start up.

sit down and truly think about the costs involved. in my eyes the only costs are:

petrol to get you to the hall/studio (if in your town its gonna only be £2)

and renting the hall for an hour. work out how much this is going to cost you.

then double the figure. this will become your base hourly COST yes you can call the cost the original half price and still break even but if you base that the costs are more then you think. then you will always be in pocket when meeting the costs.

indemnity insurance. as a teacher you should already have something inplace if something happened under your supervision. find out the details of this and if it also covers you when not in school hours. (this is why i didnt include this in the costs)

most village halls, afterschool gyms dont charge that much for a hours use. i know of a village hall that charges £100 a day so works out as £10 a hour.

so for instance on that basis £10 + fuel x 2= £24. if i was to charge parents £6 a hour for each child/student i would only need to find 4 students to be in profit.

now comes the fun part of you finding them. ask around the school and other performing arts venues and youthclubs about who would be interested.

start with the people you know. dont just hand out leaflets. ask them direct if they would be interested. this guages how much interest there is and also gets your idea stuck in their minds more then a piece of paper.

once you have atleast .. lets say 8 interested students. use EG £12 of your own money (actual costs) to hire a hall space for a hour and offer a open evening, a free first lesson for all. advertise this in as many places as you can. local theatre halls noticeboards, gym noticeboards, schools, youthclubs etc.

then on day. just see who turns up.

this will be your judgement day of how well it can be. hopefully you will get enough people to want to go at the same time everyweek.

EG 8 people per hour want to go between 4pm-5pm monday
8 want to go between 5pm-6pm monday

so then using my figures if you only charged £6 a hour for 16 students= 96 income.. then deduct actual costs leaves you with £74 for 2 hours work.

remember to work out actual costs then double it. reason why. well if it means you need 4 students to break even on the doubled amount this means you will still be UP even if one student cant make it due to illness or lazyness.

avoid thinking your costsa are just £12 and you need only 2 students to break even and 3 students to give you a £6 income. DOUBLE IT. double costs to guage minimum student numbers and you will be safe:D

never base costs as actual costs and fight just to achieve the minimum.. always think of doubling all the numbers as your minimums.

once you have minimum students you wont have to worry about raising the hourly rate so a free student can "enroll" as all of your costs are already covered.

goodluck hope this helps give u something to work with