Advice Needed - Family Loan repayments

robbie75

Hi All,

I am in need of some advice for my brother.

After 10 years of marriage he has split from his wife. During their marriage a lot of money issues happened, which led to them getting £45k into debt, losing their house and more issues.
During that time of money problems, to get them out of a situation, her father took out a loan for the pair of them to assist them financially. This was for around £16k. Since that loan was taken out it has been repayed by my brother and only him. His ex wife has payed nothing, not even anything towards the debt repayment plan that was also set up and has been running for 7 years, it has been all down to my brother (even though they both built up the debts), but this has been the situation throughout the whole marriage, he earns it, she spends it and has never contributed towards anything or even bothered to go out and get work for most of the marriage.

The point is and this is where I need advice for him. He has said that he is no longer going to repay the loan to her father, which has an outstanding amount of £3.5k and that it is about time that she paid something back to her father, especially as he has paid for the whole amount to date and it was taken out for the benefit of the pair of them as a married couple, not just my brother.

Her father is now demanding the whole amount be paid or the repayment continue as agreed. He is now threatening court action in small claims court for the outstanding amount, an attachment of earnings order and costs added to it.

As this loan is in the father in laws name, not in my brothers, never has been and is not co signed by him or attached to him legally, whats the chances of this actually making it to a court room and being found in the father in laws favour?

I have told my brother that the father in law does not stand a chance as it is in his name and not in my brothers. I have told him that he does not have to reply to the email his father in law has sent him demanding a response and demanding that the agreement by completed.

Where does he stand legally. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Regards

Tixy

Any written agreement between father-in-law and brother & ex wife to state that this was a loan?
Will f-i-l have any written evidence where brother admits that he owes f-i-l any money (letters, emails, text messages anything?) or where brother has said I don't want to pay anymore and wife should pay the rest etc?

If none of the above exists chances of obtaining a CCJ are likely to be minimal.
How it would be dealt with in the divorce is another matter but presumably it will be looked at along with all other assets & liabilites etc.

robbie75

This is where it all becomes a little complicated for me and advising him.

My brother tells me that he sent an email not that long ago telling his F-I-L that he would keep up the repayments on the loan even if a seperation was on the cards. The F-I-L has quoted this email in his email to my brother and says that this is enough to warrant a court granting him a win and the attachment to earnings order.

This email was sent to the F-I-L, during a time of high pressure and distress for my brother and I told him that I did not think that it could be relied upon or used to show any legal stance in regards to the loan that is not in his name and that of course an email can be altered to show anything that the person wants it to show.

robbie75

I should have also mentioned that there was no written agreement between my brother and his ex wife and the F-I-L. The loan is solely in the F-I-L's name and not in my brothers or his ex wifes. They couldnt even get credit on a stamp back then and still cannot now.

Tixy

That email could be submitted as evidence and would strengthens f-i-l case. So it is possible that he could obtain a judgement against brother. But if a CCJ is granted that doesn't necessarily lead to an attachment of earnings. If brother asks to pay the CCJ in installments that he can afford then the judge should not order him to pay more than he can afford. Only if brother didn't keep up with these court ordered payments could fil consider other ways to recoup the debt (which could include an attachment of earnings.

Re post #4 - Just as a point there are 2 independant loans here. Brother is in no way responsible for the loan between fil and bank and has nothing at all to do with that loan. All fil has to prove is that he loaned money to brother (+ex-wife).

Xbigman

This isn't the only issue. There will be other debts, some in joint names and some in single names. Any solution to this issue is going to need to take into account all the debts.

As to the specific problem you bring up. An email is a notoriously poor method of proving anything because it can be edited. Of more significance is a paper trail proving that payments have been made by your brother over an extended period, or a paper trail that FIL paid over a lump sum at some point.

I'd arrange a meeting between everyone and sort out who's going to pay what. Otherwise its a free for all.





X

catfish50

At first glance, perhaps your father could negotiate with FIL to reduce his (brother's) liability to 50% of the amount he and his wife borrowed from FIL? It would seem reasonable for ex-wife to be responsible for the other 50%

Apples2

catfish50 wrote: »

It would seem reasonable for ex-wife to be responsible for the other 50%

Reasonable..... Ex Wife?? :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

catfish50

Apples2 wrote: »

Reasonable..... Ex Wife??

Why not? I'm an ex-wife. I'm a reasonable person. I pay my debts.

robbie75

The ex has not been at all reasonable with anything.

My brother was paying maintenance for the two girls and on a monthly basis. She decided this wasnt enough (to fund her lifestyle) and took him to the CSA who awarded her almost £500 per month and attached it to his earnings at her request.
All debts that were incurred jointly have been passed to my brother, because almost all debts in the household were in his name, even though she had a second card on most accounts etc. (Bunch of cowboys the CSA, they wouldnt take into account any debts, unless they could be proven and she agreed that they were hers or run up whilst together, she said no, they awarded money to her, a joke)

There is no being reasonable with her in any way, because all she wants is money money money(and always has done) and she seems to think that he has loads of it and he earns thousands of pounds per month, which he doesnt. He has things to pay for now, like rent, car, expenses, food and so on, but she does not give two hoots. He has already paid more than 3/4's of this debt and hse has never paid it, so i think she should step up and take responsibility instead of dumping it all on my brothers shoulders as she always has done.

The divorce is about to go through, but there is nothing that either wants from the other party, they just want to be seperated. The house is rented, my brother has all he wants from the house and they are not tied financially (or not supposed to be), so when it happens it should all go swimmingly, allegedly).

I still do not think that he should pay anymore money and should tell the F-I-L to go seek the money elsewhere, namely the daughter and be lucky that he has paid all what he has paid.

Apples2

catfish50 wrote: »

Why not? I'm an ex-wife. I'm a reasonable person. I pay my debts.

Definintely not mine lol.

Robbie75's tale sounds spookily similar to my experience.