What happens if you plant veg too close together?

valk_scot

fimonkey wrote: »

... but what's 'bolting'?

Running to seed prematurely. For example a beetroot will throw up a flower stem when the root is still small and it will make the root woody.

Lotus-eater

I think I'll mostly agree with the others. You can sow some things closer and some things not. You have to learn what works best for you and the way you use the vegetables.

When you do plant closer, you run the risk of disease and pest problems, which love shady damp places. Not to mention plants that just grow properly, sometimes it's better to give one plant decent space so you get one good crop and not three plants the same space and get half of the crop from all plants, you would get from one healthy one.

fimonkey

valk_scot wrote: »

Running to seed prematurely. For example a beetroot will throw up a flower stem when the root is still small and it will make the root woody.

Thanks. ... Are the only plants that bolt the ones where you do not want flowers then? (i.e Not toms or strawbs) or do strawbs and toms etc also bolt? If the latter - how do you know they're bolting and not just getting ready to set fruit? Also if they do 'bolt; is it not just a case of remove the flower head?

Also I am growing rocket leaves on the kitchen windowsill and they had flower heads yesterday. I just pulled them off, but does this mean they have bolted? Or does it mean I've left them too long? I ate a bit of rocket last night and it was much stronger than the leaves I'm used to from the supermarket. I thought that was because it was home grown but now I'm thinking its not meant to taste so strong, so have I done somehting wrong?

Next year I will be much better with my spacing. My problem is that having grown from seed I cannot then bear to thin out the seedlings and throw them away! - I am attached to them having cared so lovingly for them. I did thin out quite a few and planted in small pots to give away to friends etc but I didn't want to give away too much as I also wanted to experiment with what I had.

Sambucus_Nigra

fimonkey wrote: »

Thanks. ... Are the only plants that bolt the ones where you do not want flowers then? (i.e Not toms or strawbs) or do strawbs and toms etc also bolt? If the latter - how do you know they're bolting and not just getting ready to set fruit? Also if they do 'bolt; is it not just a case of remove the flower head?

Also I am growing rocket leaves on the kitchen windowsill and they had flower heads yesterday. I just pulled them off, but does this mean they have bolted? Or does it mean I've left them too long? I ate a bit of rocket last night and it was much stronger than the leaves I'm used to from the supermarket. I thought that was because it was home grown but now I'm thinking its not meant to taste so strong, so have I done somehting wrong?

Next year I will be much better with my spacing. My problem is that having grown from seed I cannot then bear to thin out the seedlings and throw them away! - I am attached to them having cared so lovingly for them. I did thin out quite a few and planted in small pots to give away to friends etc but I didn't want to give away too much as I also wanted to experiment with what I had.

Tomatoes have their seeds on the inside of the fruit, and they set their fruit after the flowers; and strawbs also form after the flowers and have their seeds on the outside. Fruiting plants don't bolt!!! If you remove the flowerhead from these you won't get any fruit at all.

Rocket will taste stronger as it's fresh. And yes, rocket bolts as soon as it gets warm. Keep them as cool as possible, well watered and sow another batch after 21st June.

If you don't like thinning, and I never do - either sow less seed or grow things in pots and transplant the strongest seedlings and throw away just the weakest ones. It's only really root veg like carrots, parsnips, salsify that should be sown in-situ.

newsgroup_monkey

My experience is that Cabbage and Lettuces are the most prone to bolting

splodger_seedswapper

splodger seedswapper I'd be interested know your way of doing potatoes as this year I'm growing in differently, that is not in long rows but short "widths" so that when I harvest I have a nice block space to start sowing again.

kittie wrote: »

I would like to know too please. I think blocks is a very good idea and something I will do next year, maybe 4 in a block. I need the space too

because i like to grow my spuds closer together (blocks & rows) i can't earth up in the traditional way (because there is not enough room) but i don't really like earthing up (it doesn't agree with my body / disability) also, i see all too often really poor earthing up techniques used on the allotment sites that i frequent - it's as if people know that they should earth up, but don' really understand why they are doing it

anyway, i am a great believer in looking after the soil - so i make lots of compost - and instead of drawing up the soil around the plants - i just add my homemade compost etc instead - basically in the same way that you would add compost if you were growing spuds in a bag or something - just on a much larger scale

there are quite a few advantages to growing spuds in this way - the foliage (on mature plants) creates a lovely shaded area beneath the canopy - so the soil stays cool and retains more moisture. the foliage also stands upright for longer. the dense canopy helps to keep the weeds down too. the spuds are lovely and clean when harvested, so no need to clean off soil and risk damaging the skin when preparing them for storage - in contrast spuds grown in rows that are quite wide apart, can't create the close canopy, the soil bakes in the sun and dries out really quickly - mature plants also tend to flop over all too easily and that can have negative effects on the crop

and as i add compost i am also feeding the soil for next crop / season - when i run out of compost - i use soil conditioner produced by the local council green waste site (about £6 for a cubic meter)


so basically i grow them closer together because it saves me much effort and time in the long term - (no labourious earthing up, less need to water and weed, improves the soil for next season, keeps the spuds clean and the plants healthy)

you can also use other mediums like straw instead of compost / soil instead of earthing up - but i prefer to use compost

hope that helps

ALIBOBSY

Whilst there are some risks to planting closer , you also have to bear in mind the spacings on most seed packets and in many books are based on planting in old fashioned rows on an open allotment/plot. Many are now growing in rasied beds/pots in smaller areas where you can get away with closer planting.
I don't thin in the traditional way, I sow carrots and spring onions as thinly as I can, then take some out when small and tasty to eat in salads. I am in effect thinning, but I can't stand the thought of throwing stuff away-although now we have the chickens they will love any seedlings that need to go lol.

I have seen both Geoff hamilton and monty don (amongst other well known gardners) grow clumps of spring onions/beetroots/globe carrots. Plant a few seeds in each section in one of those sectional seed trays then plant out as a clump. they grow and push each other out slightly to create a small bunch of young tasty veg.

Ali x

ALIBOBSY

Slodger-your method for spud growing sounds good. I have planted some in a rasied bed and they are a bit close together to earth up in the traditional way. I had thought about compost or straw, but I am wondering about something else. We have chickens so produce a fair bit of chicken muck mixed in with staw. I have a compost bin full of this from last year (and a new lot on the way lol). Wonder if this would be ok as it will cover the spuds then feed the ground-or will it be too rich for the spuds?

ali x

splodger_seedswapper

ALIBOBSY wrote: »

Slodger-your method for spud growing sounds good. I have planted some in a rasied bed and they are a bit close together to earth up in the traditional way. I had thought about compost or straw, but I am wondering about something else. We have chickens so produce a fair bit of chicken muck mixed in with staw. I have a compost bin full of this from last year (and a new lot on the way lol). Wonder if this would be ok as it will cover the spuds then feed the ground-or will it be too rich for the spuds?

ali x

old chicken muck should be ok - fresh stuff tends to be a bit strong for most plants - if too rich - the soil might get high in nitrogen - which will give you masses of top growth but less underneath (for spuds) - i have added a bit of chicken muck to my spuds this year (and a bit of old wood ash and leaf mold) i personally like to use friable material and nothing too wet or sticky as it has a tendency to dry in big lumps on top of the soil and that will be of no use as far as earthing up is concerned - a chap on my site used grass clippings last year - and that worked quite well for him

ALIBOBSY

Hmm may go with grass clippings then as we have a large lawn at the front and usually just put the clipping in the council bin to take away as its far too much to compost here, may mix in some of the chicken muck as well. How thick a layer will I need?
Thinks the rest will go on the bed that the cukes/courgettes etc will be going in. If I put it on now it will keep the weeds down and break down a bit before the plants go in, in May-still seedlings as yet. Thanks for the reply.

Ali x