Husband's employer is getting cheeky

DeeMarie89

Hey all.
My husband works for a well known pub chain, and has had to take some time off work at various points. He had two weeks of in January to look after my son and myself after I was rushed into hospital with appendicitis. I couldn't walk properly for a week afterwards, and my husband had to cook for me, look after my son, and help me to the toilet etc.
He came hone early one day in March when I had to go to hospital because they rang me and needed to see me within the hour, and I wouldn't have been able to look after my son, and I couldn't arrange alternative care.
He also came home early on Monday (18th) as I had suddenly become ill, and was vomiting and dizzy, and unable to summon the strength to get upstairs to the toilet, let alone look after an 11 month old.

When he went to work today, he was told to apologise to his manager for telling him he had to go home on Monday. (My husband said "I'm really sorry, boss, my wife is ill, my son is screaming, she can't move much and I have to go look after them", so he wasn't being rude) apparently my husband should have asked permission, and if told no, should have stayed at work.
He was then told that on Monday he was going to be told he was being put on a course to do his licensing training, but as he had gone home early, there is doubt as to whether they will put him forward for this course now.

His employers are fairly bad, he often works 30+ mins over, unpaid, but if he tried to go home on time, it would be very much frowned upon. He gets paid until 11, but punters then have 30 mins "drinking up time" which hubby is never paid for. However, if the pub closes 30 mins early, hubby gets docked wages.

Also, when I had appendicitis, hubby was told he should have worked, and left our son with the chef, as she had offered to babysit. Well, firstly, I needed looking after too. Secondly, I do not know this chef very well, and from what I do know of her, I do not like her, and would not trust her with my son.

What should we do about this situation, as the stress is piling up in us both?

ceridwen

Don't know if theres any answers as such to this situation - but just to say "Sorry to hear this". That 2 weeks off obviously cant come into the equation - as everyone needs to take their holiday time at some point - and what they use that holiday for is totally their business.

It WAS only 2 occasions, from what you say, that were in worktime and due to the combination of your illness/the baby's needs. I'm simply not interested in children personally - but if I were your hubby's employer - I would not have considered it at all unreasonable to let him have those couple of occasions off to deal with an emergency situation (as this was) if he had said politely what was happening and why. I think it would have been wise for him to phrase the request to leave specifically as "Sorry - boss - but an emergency has come up (give details). I really need to deal with this. Is it okay for me to go and do so please?"

Just a slight difference of phrasing - as I know that many peeps would not want to be told "I AM going...", but have it phrased as "Is it okay ....please?". A reasonable employer would not refuse a request to deal with a one-off (in this case - two-off) emergency situation like this.

It would appear that the employer is not reasonable - from all the times you say he is expected to work on unpaid for half an hour after his shift ends - and that is a different matter - and may mean that he doesnt fall within the National Minimum Wage provisions - ie getting paid at least NMW per hour for ALL the hours worked (including the unpaid time). That is something that he needs to think about - as a separate issue.

Certainly also - it is not reasonable to expect any parent to leave her child being looked after by someone she does not approve of. Obviously anyone doing any childcare for a parent needs to be someone the parent can trust and the sheer fact that you dont like this woman is reason enough to have accepted that it was not a practical solution to have your child left with them.

Do you have friends or family nearby who could look after you and/or your child in the event of any further emergencies? Are there any doting grannies or grandpas who would be happy to step into the breach if anything happens again? Playing devils advocate here - in fairness - I would say that most employers would expect that parents WOULD have nearby friends/family that could help out and feel that that wasnt their business to wonder about a prolonged period of childcare needing doing...

Emmzi

Our organisation grants 5 days a year dependants leave. This is to organmise emergency care, not do the caring - so in your case, arrange for a family member or a nurse or similar to stay with you (or leave you in the hospital if unable!) Yes this is not easy, but that isn't the emplyer's problem and I thionk a fortnight is incredibly generous before the other events.

Not offering a value judgement but 2 weeks with follow up absences would make many employers question his commitment.

Long hours are just par for the course in the pub trade. Maybe he is better suited to a different career?

ceridwen

In fairness - I would imagine that 2 weeks off was 2 weeks holiday. Hence there would appear to have only been those odd 2 occasions that went into "work time". Also - in fairness - appendicitis is not a recurring type illness - so I would imagine its over and done with now (cured).

Forwandert

It sounds more like the OP and her husband are the ones being cheeky tbh,

OP your husband can't have time off whenever he wants or whenever it suits you, being sick is no reason to drag your husband home to care for you or your child, what happens if you are both ill? Who looks after your child then? when you had appendicitis your husband had no right to take two weeks off and should've used the first day off to find suitable childcare arrangements to go back to work, it's also the same for the hospital appointment no right to time off for this, if I was your husband I would be going into work and apologising for any situations he has caused at work by failing to finish shifts, explain things like this won't be happening again and hope they keep him employed.

Tiddlywinks

You do need to appreciate that your husband's employer relies on staff to attend in order to provide a service - short notice absences are really difficult to handle and should be requested in an emergency only.

You are putting your husband in an impossible position by expecting him to come home at your whim - yet you clearly don't recognise that fact.

To be honest, you sound a bit needy and seem to feel that the employer should accommodate your family rather than seeing that your husband has a responsibility to attend to do his job. Calling him home because you are being sick? Why? Women everyday manage to look after an 11 month old whilst ill (some with a lot worse conditions than just throwing up).

As someone else has said, dependants leave is there to allow for care arrangement to be put in place NOT to take days at a time to actually provide the care itself.

As to working past 11pm - that is the pub business; the same applies to shops, restaurants etc.

Tiddlywinks

DeeMarie89 wrote: »

.... He had two weeks of in January to look after my son and myself after I was rushed into hospital with appendicitis.

.... He came hone early one day in March when I had to go to hospital because they rang me and needed to see me within the hour, and I wouldn't have been able to look after my son, and I couldn't arrange alternative care.

.... He also came home early on Monday (18th) as I had suddenly become ill, and was vomiting and dizzy, and unable to summon the strength to get upstairs to the toilet, (am I the only one that finds this a bit melodramatic?) let alone look after an 11 month old.

ceridwen wrote: »

In fairness - I would imagine that 2 weeks off was 2 weeks holiday. Hence there would appear to have only been those odd 2 occasions that went into "work time".

The two week absence appears to have been at the drop of a hat - really difficult to cover that length of time at such short notice. Shifts for everyone else would have needed changing etc

Yes, it was an emergency so take a couple of days to deal with the immediate situation but two weeks?

As to the other two occasions - not convinced that the hubby needed to rush home. OP could have gone to the hospital appointment alone and taken the child with her and this week could just have thrown up on her own until OH came home.

GothicStirling

As for the loss of the license training, I don't blame them. Saying 'I'm going home' would mark you down in my book as unreliable and cheeky. Why should I pay for your husband to go on an expensive training course when he's been known to leave me in the !!!! at the last moment? It's a shame because your husband would have had that license for 10 years, and would have easily got himself a management job.

I don't see how you're upset by the 'drinking up time.' Not only is it law, I bet you've been in pubs with a few drinks lined up at the last minute.

DeeMarie89

Ok.
So, firstly, the two weeks off with appendicitis he did use his holiday time for. I could not have stayed in hospital, and alternative childcare arrangements could not be made. The only family I have nearby is my dad, who works all hours of the day, and could not have taken any time off whilst I was in hospital, and we couldn't afford professional childcare.

Secondly, the two occasions I called him home from work were necessary. The first time when I had an emergency hospital appointment, I couldn't bring my son, as there was a large possibility of rushing me into theatre if their fears from my blood test results were confirmed. (it was believed to be either an ectopic pregnancy, or an incomplete appendicectomy) so having my son with me would have been a tad impractical.
The time on Monday, I was very being pregnant, I suffer with morning sickness quite a bit, and it's more than copable. However, on Monday I was suffering quite badly with food poisoning. I got quite weak and dizzy, and passed out twice before calling my husband home. It wasn't a case of "I feel iffy, come home so I can lounge about"

And I haven't got a problem with him working late at all, my issue here is him not getting paid for the overtime he does. Surely, he should be paid for any time he is physically working?

I also don't think it's fair that he is being discriminated against for having a few hours off when it was necessary. Any time I have called him home, I have always called friends and family first. Unfortunately? The majority of our friends and family are spread out across the UK, so there are very few people I can ask.

DeeMarie89

And I would also like to add that at no point does my husband expect or ask to be paid for any of the time he takes off, and he has never ever phoned in sick or taken any unauthorised absences.

ohreally

DeeMarie89 wrote: »

My husband works for a well known pub chain

I think your husband should establish what the employers policy is re both parental leave and emergency leave...
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworkentitlements/WorkAndFamilies/Parentalleaveandflexibleworking/DG_10029416
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/Timeoffandholidays/DG_10026555

If this is a large chain, there may well be collective agreements in place. If this is the case then the employer may a duty to provide this information to their employees - http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/employment_and_social_policy/employment_rights_and_work_organisation/c10811_en.htm

He should consider joining a trade union if not already a member.