Its Depressing

scorpio_princess

lynzpower wrote:

hey scorpio princess

The thing is the OP said that he wanted "a house" hence the statement buy a house in the cap part of town, or whatever he said.

As lots of people say, its not vitally important that everyone OWN thier own house, indeed for many its preferable to rent, be it from a housing association ( these are good if you can get hold of one of these the security of tenure is unrivalled) the council ( what there is left) or from a private landlord.

its much better VFM to rent cheaper than a mortgage than pay out hunreds of pounds in interest to the bank every month.

I do think OWNING our own homes is a weird aspiration. "I really really want to be in a 100k debt, and servicing this for the next 25 years " seems like madness in retrospect to me, I wanted it badly then realised the hollowness it all.

I do actually agree with what you're saying - my rent at the moment is far, far cheaper than a mortgage would be, so that suits me now. But what about when I get to retirement age? I know the government would have us all working til we're 90, but I like to think that one day I could retire - but that won't be possible if I'm still paying rent! What ever will rents be like in 40 years time! Actually, whatever will house prices be doing in 40 years time!

I'm not trying to question why house prices are so bonkers right now - it's way beyond my knowledge of economics and financial stuff. Besides, it's pointless - my opinion alone won't change a thing! I was simply questioning some attitudes towards young people who are priced out. Although the OP said 'house', I think this is probably just another word for 'home' - my sister lives in a flat, but calls it her 'house' (wishful thinking on her part I think!)

BTW, how's your house sale going Lynz? Have you exchanged yet - or is that a sore point?

Doozergirl

meanmachine wrote:

Scorpio, some of the posters on here *have* to caricature FTBers as stupid, greedy or wasteful otherwise their arguments fall down.

Basically they want you to buy their homes for more than they could ever afford and for far more than they paid.

That's it. End of story.

As I showed a few weeks ago, in 2001 int rates were at 5%, like today, but house prices half what they are now. So it's often been much easier to buy than it is today.

They don't care about that. They just want you to shut up and pay their stupid prices.

No wonder you're angry.

I take great offense to this post, meanmachine. :mad:

Princess scorpio's post was aimed directly at me and your reply appears, therefore to also be aimed at me.

My opinion of the OPs situation is that they could in fact almost afford a flat if they wanted one, that we're not all entitled to 'houses' straight away like I wasn't when I bought in London 7 years ago!

And those who sell also have to shut up and pay stupid prices when they buy, so we're all in the same boat together.

Doozergirl

scorpio_princess wrote:

No offence, but I don't understand why some posters on here always assume that those that can't afford to buy a home are desperate to buy a '3 bed semi'. How do you draw this conclusion?

Not getting at you personally Doozer, just trying to give the other side of the story.

You'll find princess, that I am not really one for generalisations and that my actual opinion was based on the OP's circumstances. You will also see that I mentioned that there are real crises where people on average wages (c £20k +) can't buy a flat at 7x salary!

My comment about 3 bed semis was based on the OP wanting a house and also a poster quite long time ago who was complaining about 'the state of this country' and that he couldn't afford a 3 bed semi for £70,000 on a salary of £21,000. It wound me up no end because he is, in fact one of the lucky ones. :wall:

Yes, house prices are completely unbelievable in many areas, but sometimes you see people complain when they jump on the 'it's not fair' bandwagon when they live in a relatively afordable area and have the opportunities associated with youth to save and buy a house if that is their choice. Some people really don't have a choice. I grew up in a Housing Association flat and I turned out okay!

meanmachine_2

Doozergirl, don't take offence. I don't think I had your post specifically in mind.

But there are others on this site who do use the same old "stop buying ipods", "stop being greedy" argument and, as scorpio says, it's incredibly insulting, patronising and smug.

trets77

Something has to give in this market though.

if it is any help to the OP you can blame one set of people and one day in recent history
The was day September 16th 1992.
And the people were the Conservative government

"Black Wednesday" caused a sharp downward movement in the housing market that has been adjusted over a smaller amount of time than would otherwise have been a gradule adjustment. prices went up so fast in the very late 90's and early 00's because they were artficially low when the ecomony improved. of cause wages and inflation of other things have not.

the thing that will give in the end won,t be the prices but the lending restrictions. my auntie lives in Holland and took out a 75 year mortgage in her late 40's !!!!. my cousins won,t inheriate the house they will inheriate the loan on it. yet this is now standard in Holland i,m told. In Japan i believe you get 150 year mortgages. it,s already started ! it will only continue to get longer and longer that you are given to pay off the mortgage

My advice is your expectations are too high. buy the flat at £70,000 and hold tight. nobody ( not me for sure) buys the the last house they aim to own 1st time. it called the property ladder and you need to start at the bottom. hell £70,000 is cheap if you ask me they are more like £90K around here and this just a plain as anything area

BargainAholic_2

I couldn't afford to buy a house either so I rented as much as I could for £500p/m. I live in a 3 bed terraced with my fella & 2 cats so we do rattle around a bit.

Coming up to my 2nd year in this house. Its private rent so no council or property developer etc

In February this year we asked our landlord if he wanted to sell it to us & he amazingly said yes. We got turned down for a mortgage because we had far too many outgoings, we had 2 cars (one on finance) & 17k worth of debt.

After using this site, selling the car that was on finance on ebay & repaying the finance company, rejiggling our debts to 0% balance transfers credit cards with no fee, we have now been given the ok for a mortgage of £100k & date of exchange is 14th December.

Yeah sure I would love to live in a 4/5 bed detatched house with a double garage & electric gates on the front & a tree out the back, but I'm happy where I am now.

I have only just turned 26 by the way & I only earn £15.5k.

I left home at 18 & have rented since then in. I started with a cold unheated room in a house I didnt want to be in with people I didn't like for £25 per week. I have also relocated to Scotland from sunny Stoke on Trent so I could be in the countryside.

Work your way up like I have done. Sure you dont jump on the ladder as soon as you leave home, its hard to do especially now. Also if you live on your own & not with the parents, you learn the value of money & thats the best lesson you could ever learn.

Doozergirl

trets77 wrote:

The thing that will give in the end won't be the prices but the lending restrictions.

You're right so far

lynzpower

scorpio_princess wrote:

I do actually agree with what you're saying - my rent at the moment is far, far cheaper than a mortgage would be, so that suits me now. But what about when I get to retirement age? I know the government would have us all working til we're 90, but I like to think that one day I could retire - but that won't be possible if I'm still paying rent! What ever will rents be like in 40 years time! Actually, whatever will house prices be doing in 40 years time!

I'm not trying to question why house prices are so bonkers right now - it's way beyond my knowledge of economics and financial stuff. Besides, it's pointless - my opinion alone won't change a thing! I was simply questioning some attitudes towards young people who are priced out. Although the OP said 'house', I think this is probably just another word for 'home' - my sister lives in a flat, but calls it her 'house' (wishful thinking on her part I think!)

BTW, how's your house sale going Lynz? Have you exchanged yet - or is that a sore point?

Well I dunno about this whole retirement argument. Many many pensioners rent adn have housing benefit pay their rent now, hell, my nan had HB pay her rent, when she was recieving her state pension before she passed on

In 40 years when Im looking to retire, things will be exceptionally different. Im ccertianly not going to waste whats left of my 20s worrying about whats going to happen in 40 years

There was a brill point made by another MSEr ( was it you hereward) that if you rent- and save everything that you would have spent on maintainence, you would be able to buy a property outright in todays market if you had been renting for 20 years. given its not that unusual to spend 5k on a bathroom or 10k on a kitchen this cash can stack up.

I woner whether this is a savings challenge for me for the next year at least

Yes, exhchange is a sorre point! Was meant to happen yesterday & didnt - lets hope for monday

dawsonio

Debt_Free_Chick wrote:

Is it? Isn't paying the bank a lot of interest over 25

Is there any reason to own a house, other than to pass something on to your kids? Even then, if you saved the difference between owning & renting, over the duration of an average mortgage, you could still pass on hard cash to your kids.

Just curious ... why do you want to own?

Ive just been reading this thread and before i was desparate to get a house of my own, but after reading this comment ive realised that there is no real need to own a house. Like many of you say the money saved by renting can be saved and you will have a nice cash reserve for the future. Prices are bound to fall in time. Just look at whats happening in America and when they do you will be in an ideal situation to pounce.

If you think about it a £700 monthly outgoing on a 25 year mortgage around 400-500 of that will just be clearing off interest, so if you could rent for around 400-500 you would be best off going for that option.

I know my opinions have now changed when ive actually sat down to think about it.

tomstickland

Renting is dead money compared with living at home with parents.

In the 'old days' my parents only afforded a house because they bought together, they lived on upturned boxes, and had no appliances. Yet I imagine you are looking to buy a swish place in a nice area on your own on a starter salary. Soz chap but its just not possible. Why would you think it is possible??! Everything in life takes time and requires work, the faster you learn this the better! But there is good news, if you work hard, in time you will get what you want - no probs.

That's a bit of an assumption. Round the Gloucester area £75K buys a small flat in a moderately run down area of town. £90-95K will buy a 1 bed flat in a nicer location. £120K for a 2 bed flat.

I agree with the MSE-frugal-saving lifestyle though. It is a path to happiness.

I'd advise the OP to sit tight and save as much as possible and watch the market with interest.