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Selling property owned with ex
diet_pepsi
Posts: 35 Forumite
I need some advice on what is reasonable. I’ll try and stick to the point:
I own a property with my ex, bought in Sept 2006 for £214k.
We split up a couple of years ago (amicable – it just wasn’t working, and he decided he didn’t love me any more), and he didn’t want to move out as he had too much stuff, but didn’t want to buy me out either. I didn’t earn enough to buy him out.
We agreed that I’d move out, and he’d “rent” the property at 80% of market rental value (100% occupancy, and he would look after the property nicely!), then we’d get half the “rent” each. We both then paid half the repayment mortgage each, and the initial deposit was 50/50 too, just to keep it simple.
I broached the subject of selling a year ago, and again, he didn’t want to sell, as he wasn’t ready to either move or buy me out, but had plans to move abroad at some point in the future. As I was then pregnant, I agreed to continue with the current “rental” situation rather than push him to sell, as I didn’t want the stress.
He’s now decided he’s moving abroad, so is ready to sell. Hurrah! We’ve signed up with an EA, and things are progressing.
My issue is the timing and his attitude towards the sale.
He doesn’t want to move out until mid-July, but also refuses to pay any rent after the end of July.
1. I would have liked him to pay rent until the property was sold, as it’s him that didn’t want it sold over 2 years ago, but he refuses. If I were in his shoes, then I would have continued paying, so am I being unreasonable expecting this?
2. The EA thinks that a realistic selling price is £220k to £235k. Given that he won’t be continuing paying rent, then I think that ANY offer around the £220k mark should be accepted. He thinks we can get more for it, and wants to hang on for an offer nearer the £235k mark. I disagree with this, as I don’t want to end up with the property being empty, and him not paying any rent. What do people think is reasonable?
3. Once the property is empty, then personally I think the offers will become lower, as it will give an impression of a sale required due to desperation! He disagrees (!). Am I right???
Sorry if I waffled. I feel I’ve been very fair up until now, but he seems to see it as it's him that's had to make all the sacrifices, so it would be nice to hear other (neutral!) points of view!
Oh, one more question:
4. If he moves abroad, then would he have to come back to the UK to sign anything, or can it all be done by scanning/faxing?
I own a property with my ex, bought in Sept 2006 for £214k.
We split up a couple of years ago (amicable – it just wasn’t working, and he decided he didn’t love me any more), and he didn’t want to move out as he had too much stuff, but didn’t want to buy me out either. I didn’t earn enough to buy him out.
We agreed that I’d move out, and he’d “rent” the property at 80% of market rental value (100% occupancy, and he would look after the property nicely!), then we’d get half the “rent” each. We both then paid half the repayment mortgage each, and the initial deposit was 50/50 too, just to keep it simple.
I broached the subject of selling a year ago, and again, he didn’t want to sell, as he wasn’t ready to either move or buy me out, but had plans to move abroad at some point in the future. As I was then pregnant, I agreed to continue with the current “rental” situation rather than push him to sell, as I didn’t want the stress.
He’s now decided he’s moving abroad, so is ready to sell. Hurrah! We’ve signed up with an EA, and things are progressing.
My issue is the timing and his attitude towards the sale.
He doesn’t want to move out until mid-July, but also refuses to pay any rent after the end of July.
1. I would have liked him to pay rent until the property was sold, as it’s him that didn’t want it sold over 2 years ago, but he refuses. If I were in his shoes, then I would have continued paying, so am I being unreasonable expecting this?
2. The EA thinks that a realistic selling price is £220k to £235k. Given that he won’t be continuing paying rent, then I think that ANY offer around the £220k mark should be accepted. He thinks we can get more for it, and wants to hang on for an offer nearer the £235k mark. I disagree with this, as I don’t want to end up with the property being empty, and him not paying any rent. What do people think is reasonable?
3. Once the property is empty, then personally I think the offers will become lower, as it will give an impression of a sale required due to desperation! He disagrees (!). Am I right???
Sorry if I waffled. I feel I’ve been very fair up until now, but he seems to see it as it's him that's had to make all the sacrifices, so it would be nice to hear other (neutral!) points of view!
Oh, one more question:
4. If he moves abroad, then would he have to come back to the UK to sign anything, or can it all be done by scanning/faxing?
0
Comments
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diet_pepsi wrote: »I own a property with my ex, bought in Sept 2006 for £214k.
2. The EA thinks that a realistic selling price is £220k to £235k. Given that he won’t be continuing paying rent, then I think that ANY offer around the £220k mark should be accepted. He thinks we can get more for it, and wants to hang on for an offer nearer the £235k mark. I disagree with this, as I don’t want to end up with the property being empty, and him not paying any rent. What do people think is reasonable?
You ex needs a clip round the ear as you have been astoundingly accomodating so far! Only half joking....
I'm puzzled by the EA's assertion that 235K is a realistic AP in the current climate. Unless.....have you carried out significant changes to the property which would explain its increase in value since Sept 2006?
If you consult the Nationwide's house price calculator http://www.nationwide.co.uk/mortgages/calculators/housepriceworth.htm
it states that "
A property located in UK which was valued at £214,000 in Q4 of 2006, would be worth approximately £201,954 in Q1 of 2011. This is equivalent to a change of -5.63%."
Obviously the above doesn't take into account your specific location nor whether the price you paid in 2006 was significantly less than the property was actually worth. Likely the EA just wants to allow for substantial wiggle room/ negotiation. As long as your ex understand this all is well.
">3. Once the property is empty, then personally I think the offers will become lower, as it will give an impression of a sale required due to desperation! He disagrees (!). Am I right???>
I wouldn't necessarily interpret an empty property as the vendor being "desperate" ....but yes, my offer WOULD be decidedly more cheeky.
Be that as it may...if it was me, I'd have a VERY candid exchange with the ex.0 -
Pay rent? I don't understand - he's a home owner. Do you mean he refuses to pay the mortgage when he goes overseas? Does he live in the property with a lodger? If you do not or cannot contribute to the mortgage when he refuses to continue to pay, the lender may repossess it, plus persue you or him (you, realistically, since he won't be in the UK) for the arrears, any shortfall in equity, etc.
Stop using the words 'rent'!
So you've been subsidising his stay in the property until such time it was convenient for him to leave it, and then he simply decided that he wasn't going to fulfill his obligation as a joint owner, that he wouldn't pay his share of the mortgage but is intent on retaining the equity for it... He had you over a barrel,didn't he - he's had the use of the property all that time on the excuse that he had 'too much stuff' (trivial).
How about moving back into the property when he leaves!! Tell him that you've outgrown your current property (you've too much stuff) and you will sell it when it is convenient to your personal plans. Or tell him that you are not now going to pay towards the mortgage as you don't enjoy the use of it.
What are properties in your area actually selling for? Check the house price websites for Sold property prices.0 -
1. I agree entirely. You'll be hard-pressed to sell by July and the timing has been entirely his decision. You've been very accomodating so far and the current arrangement should continue till it's sold. Why is he refusing to pay after then end of July?
2. He can't have his cake and eat it. If he wants to hold on for a better price, he needs to pay while you hang around. If he's so certain why not sell him your half for £110k, he can then sell independently and keep the extra if he gets it.
3. I would offer less on an empty property for exactly the reason you suggest. What sacrifices has he made? He decided he didn't love you anymore, stayed in the house (like a gentleman), decides the timing of the sale, threatens to stop paying and move abroad.
4. I think you should sell before either of you leaves the country otherwise this is gonna get even more messy.
5. I quite like Jowos idea above. You could just let him leave the country and move in yourself.
5. Good luck.0 -
Pay rent? I don't understand - he's a home owner. Do you mean he refuses to pay the mortgage when he goes overseas? Does he live in the property with a lodger? If you do not or cannot contribute to the mortgage when he refuses to continue to pay, the lender may repossess it, plus persue you or him (you, realistically, since he won't be in the UK) for the arrears, any shortfall in equity, etc.
I probably didn't explain that very well, as it is somewhat complicated.
Me and ex pay half the (repayment) mortgage each. Rather than renting it out through an EA, and given he needed somewhere to live, we agreed that he would continue living in the property, and would "rent" it from me and him.So you've been subsidising his stay in the property until such time it was convenient for him to leave it, and then he simply decided that he wasn't going to fulfill his obligation as a joint owner, that he wouldn't pay his share of the mortgage but is intent on retaining the equity for it... He had you over a barrel,didn't he - he's had the use of the property all that time on the excuse that he had 'too much stuff' (trivial).
We agreed on 80% of market rental value, as if it had been rented out with an EA, there would have been fees to pay, change the mortgage to BTL, potentially vacant periods etc... and I didn't particularly want to be a LL! To be fair to him, he has looked after the property well, and sorted out any issues.
I had just assumed (perhaps stupidly!) that he would be responsible for "renting" the property until it was sold. We will both still be paying our halves of the mortgage. As I am on maternity leave, I somewhat rely on my half of the rent to pay my half of the mortgage. I have savings so can carry on paying my half (even if interest rates go up), but it just means making sacrifices.How about moving back into the property when he leaves!! Tell him that you've outgrown your current property (you've too much stuff) and you will sell it when it is convenient to your personal plans. Or tell him that you are not now going to pay towards the mortgage as you don't enjoy the use of it.
I now live with my OH in his house, with our dog and our baby, so not really an option moving back in, and I love living where I live now.0 -
I'm puzzled by the EA's assertion that 235K is a realistic AP in the current climate. Unless.....have you carried out significant changes to the property which would explain its increase in value since Sept 2006?
If you consult the Nationwide's house price calculator it states that
"A property located in UK which was valued at £214,000 in Q4 of 2006, would be worth approximately £201,954 in Q1 of 2011. This is equivalent to a change of -5.63%."
Obviously the above doesn't take into account your specific location nor whether the price you paid in 2006 was significantly less than the property was actually worth. Likely the EA just wants to allow for substantial wiggle room/ negotiation. As long as your ex understand this all is well.
The property is in an area that has hardly been touched by the recession, and rents have risen, so it's still worth what we paid for it, and a bit more... (going on a neighbouring property that has recently sold too).
The EA fees have been negotiated so that it's VERY low below the bottom valuation, and they get a VERY healthy fee above this, so they seemed quite confident they could get a reasonable amount for it.0 -
DannyboyMidlands wrote: »
1. I agree entirely. You'll be hard-pressed to sell by July and the timing has been entirely his decision. You've been very accomodating so far and the current arrangement should continue till it's sold. Why is he refusing to pay after then end of July?
- He'll be moving abroad at the end of July, so doesn't see why he should pay rent any more if he's not living there. I think this is unfair, as he's the one dictating such tight time lines over the sale, and refusing to move out until mid-July.
2. He can't have his cake and eat it. If he wants to hold on for a better price, he needs to pay while you hang around. If he's so certain why not sell him your half for £110k, he can then sell independently and keep the extra if he gets it.
- I suggested that if he turned down an offer of £220k and it then sold for less than this, then it should only be his share that takes a hit. It didn't go down too well!
3. I would offer less on an empty property for exactly the reason you suggest. What sacrifices has he made? He decided he didn't love you anymore, stayed in the house (like a gentleman), decides the timing of the sale, threatens to stop paying and move abroad.
- To be fair, I was happy to move out. He was the jealous type, and when we split up, I realised I hardly recognised myself and wasn't me any more. I'd almost become a hermit due to his jealousy, as it was easier not to have a social life rather than run the gauntlet of accusations and suspicion. I am now VERY happy, with a wonderful guy who lets me be me! Money is not important to me, hence I just want it sold!
4. I think you should sell before either of you leaves the country otherwise this is gonna get even more messy.
- yup! Hence my frustration about his idea that we can "hold on" for a big offer!
5. Good luck.
I think I need a lot of luck!0 -
So, 4.5 months on, 20 odd viewings later, only positive comments other than location being too far from the centre (huh? so why view??), but not even a cheeky offer.
I thought putting in low offers was all the rage?
Another flat in the block is also for sale, and they're clearly quite desperate to sell, and have dropped the price to £185k, so I'm quite sure ours is not going to sell unless we drop our price to the same, which the ex isn't willing to do.
I need some advice as to what to do next!! I see the options as:
1) Drop the price.
2) I could buy him out. If we're going to have to sell at £185k, then I think I'd rather have it myself at that price, and I can get hold of the cash to buy him out, then let the property out as a long term thing. It would acheive about £850/month rent. This would cut the financial tie with the ex, and I could move on with my life.
3) Ex and I could rent it out for a while, as it seems that property just isn't selling, regardless of price. This still leaves me financially tied to my ex.
4) Try a different agent. Someone else who tried to sell at the same time has gone back to renting it, as they had no viewings in 4 months, so it goes to show that some agents are much better than others. Incidentally, the flat at £185k is with an agent better known for renting than selling. But I'm thinking regardless of agent, with the other flat at £185k, we won't get much more than that.
Any other suggestions?0 -
What are you marketing the property for now?
If the similar property is on the market at the moment for £185k, then that really does gauge that is where the property should be.
Also sounds like the agent that was chosen really over-valued it.
One thing you don't want to do is rent the property out. What happens for example, when the boiler goes and you need to fork out £2000, will your ex pay towards it.
I would change the agent and change the price.0 -
What are you marketing the property for now?
If the similar property is on the market at the moment for £185k, then that really does gauge that is where the property should be.
Also sounds like the agent that was chosen really over-valued it.
One thing you don't want to do is rent the property out. What happens for example, when the boiler goes and you need to fork out £2000, will your ex pay towards it.
I would change the agent and change the price.
Ours is at £210k (bought for £214k in Sept 06).
Another flat in the block (1 bed, no parking) sold 5 months ago at £190k (bought £190k in March 07).
The one at £185k is 2 bed with parking. If the other one sold for £190k, I can only presume that no one wants to buy at the moment, and they're desperate to sell, thus having to lower price so much.
To be honest, if we have to lower to £190k, I'd rather have it myself at that price, as that would be a 5.3% yield on rent, which isn't too bad is it?? (and no EA fees if I bought my ex out!).0 -
Then I would buy OH out and get rid of him. That way you can do what you want to the price or rent it out without him being awkward.0
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