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a third of brits lived in council housing
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The 1977 act changed all that. Whereas before, being an alcoholic or a single mum or unemployed or a refugee would have excluded you from public housing, with no new stock, being unstable or unemployed or unemployable or mentally ill or drug addicted or having lots of children by different fathers would now privilege you on the housing list - housing had become a ‘right’ and not a ‘reward’.
I quite see that excluding these "undesirable" people makes it much more likely that the council estate will become a thriving community and a great place to live. I also see that there's a moral hazard in giving preference to those whose lifestyles aren't constructive to society.
Nevertheless, I don't think a return to picky housing officers would solve the problem of the ghettos. Where would all the unemployable and drug addicted live? They'd end up in some kind of ghetto somewhere, even if it wasn't a council estate. The programme left me wondering how it worked in the 60s and 70s. Where did people live if they didn't meet the council estate's criteria? What happened to people who broke the rules in those tenants' handbooks? Were they evicted, and if so then where did they go?Do you know anyone who's bereaved? Point them to https://www.AtaLoss.org which does for bereavement support what MSE does for financial services, providing links to support organisations relevant to the circumstances of the loss & the local area. (Link permitted by forum team)
Tyre performance in the wet deteriorates rapidly below about 3mm tread - change yours when they get dangerous, not just when they are nearly illegal (1.6mm).
Oh, and wear your seatbelt. My kids are only alive because they were wearing theirs when somebody else was driving in wet weather with worn tyres.
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michael collins in the bbc doc came to a similar conclusion. however he also implied that the removal of lifetime tenancies would have the same impact if not worse.
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I haven't seen the documentary.
But I'm not sure why he thinks the removal of secure tenancies would increase social problems. Was a reason given?
Essentially, the majority of new social housing tenants get their tenancies because they are identified as a priority for housing through homelessness, disability, dependents.
Because they receive secure tenancies it further chokes off the supply of tenancies for other households in crisis.
Households get a lifetime tenancy for mainly short to medium term social issues - since the supply and churn is so low, it makes sense to change tenancies to being as interim emergency accommodation rather than take this stock out of supply for anything up to two generations of the household?0 -
I haven't seen the documentary.
But I'm not sure why he thinks the removal of secure tenancies would increase social problems. Was a reason given?
Essentially, the majority of new social housing tenants get their tenancies because they are identified as a priority for housing through homelessness, disability, dependents.
Because they receive secure tenancies it further chokes off the supply of tenancies for other households in crisis.
Households get a lifetime tenancy for mainly short to medium term social issues - since the supply and churn is so low, it makes sense to change tenancies to being as interim emergency accommodation rather than take this stock out of supply for anything up to two generations of the household?
He didn’t say that it would increase social problems just that the council estates would become worse.0 -
I haven't seen the documentary.
But I'm not sure why he thinks the removal of secure tenancies would increase social problems. Was a reason given?
He said that the lifetime tenancies gave council tenants a feeling of rootedness and security that fostered community. I'm sure that's true of the vetted, employed and responsible tenants pre-1977. However, I'm not sure that community is particularly fostered by giving lifetime tenancies on the basis of the kinds of things that qualify people for priority for social housing now. You can only build that kind of community identity if you have a critical mass of people with the right attitude for it, and current policies don't tend that way - which is particularly hard for those people who do have that kind of attitude but happen to have found themselves in circumstances where they need social housing.Do you know anyone who's bereaved? Point them to https://www.AtaLoss.org which does for bereavement support what MSE does for financial services, providing links to support organisations relevant to the circumstances of the loss & the local area. (Link permitted by forum team)
Tyre performance in the wet deteriorates rapidly below about 3mm tread - change yours when they get dangerous, not just when they are nearly illegal (1.6mm).
Oh, and wear your seatbelt. My kids are only alive because they were wearing theirs when somebody else was driving in wet weather with worn tyres.0 -
This is how we housed the undesirables 150 years ago:
During the late 18th and 19th centuries, large numbers of convicts were transported to the various Australian penal colonies by the British government. One of the primary reasons for the British settlement of Australia was the establishment of a penal colony to alleviate pressure on their overburdened correctional facilities. Over the 80 years more than 165,000 convicts were transported to Australia.[1]
We are still housing a similar number (allowing for deaths in Australia) back home in the UK:
Population and Capacity Briefing for 08 April 2011TotalPrisonsPopulation
85,36184,812Male population54981,12080,571Female population5494,2414,2410
Useable Operational Capacity (+male immigrant detainees numbering 594)
87,135594
Home Detention Curfew caseload2,735 0 -
I haven't seen the documentary.
But I'm not sure why he thinks the removal of secure tenancies would increase social problems. Was a reason given?
for the same reason that the labour change of policy to favouring those most "in need" created problems.
if you remove tenancies from people who have jobs / have improved their circumstances then council housing will be left to the unemployed / most desperate / those with biggest social problems.Those who will not reason, are bigots, those who cannot, are fools, and those who dare not, are slaves. - Lord Byron0 -
I think you are referring to prefabrecated housing (see below) and I doubt any of that is still standing. I thing the majority of rehousing developments in the 50's and 60's had a much longer life expectancy.
There are loads of pre-fabs still around. Retro-chic, now!...much enquiry having been made concerning a gentleman, who had quitted a company where Johnson was, and no information being obtained; at last Johnson observed, that 'he did not care to speak ill of any man behind his back, but he believed the gentleman was an attorney'.0 -
but we know we are not talking about houses with solid oak kitchens. i agree old doesn't mean bad but the reality is most kitchens 20 years ago were not built to last. i'd argue that the age of the kitchen / bathroom is a good average indicator of the condition of the property and when it was last renovated.
We could well be talking about exactly that. We're talking about all private rentals, here.
These include a kitchen no more than 20 years old with “reasonable space and layout”, a bathroom less than 30 years old and good insulation against noise plus energy efficient features.
that's just daft. My sister's next-door neighours live in a house with a kitchen that's 30 years old (and better than most modern fitted kitchens that are a year old), and has rubbish noise insulation and no energy efficient "features", because it's Grade Two listed.So that house is one of those 41% that are in "poor" condition!...much enquiry having been made concerning a gentleman, who had quitted a company where Johnson was, and no information being obtained; at last Johnson observed, that 'he did not care to speak ill of any man behind his back, but he believed the gentleman was an attorney'.0 -
I loved visiting my childhood friend in her pre-fab. It was so well fitted out and everything had a place. Bliss compared to the back to backs with an outside lav. Its a pity they were ever demolished, it felt like an oasis when all around was rubble and squalor
http://www.mersey-gateway.org/server.php?show=ConNarrative.1830 -
I wonder why Thatcher is always condemned / praised for starting the sell-off?
there were large council housing sell offs in the 1970s, incl by the GLC....much enquiry having been made concerning a gentleman, who had quitted a company where Johnson was, and no information being obtained; at last Johnson observed, that 'he did not care to speak ill of any man behind his back, but he believed the gentleman was an attorney'.0
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