Possible redundancy

adonis10

Quick overview:
- Trainee accoutant, 19 months at current firm.
- Two trainees, similar pay and experience (other person here for 4 years, me 19 months)
- Lack of work = one of us must be made redundant. Meeting with boss tomorrow.

I personally wouldn't mind as I'm commitment free and actively looking for other jobs anyway. However, as we are trainee accountants our firm pays the fees for training/exams etc. so we both 'owe' in the region of £2-2.5k. In return for lower pay, I may add.

I think they want one of us to volunteer. Would this change our rights in any way, ie. from compulsory to voluntary?

If they said "you are going, no fees are repayable" I'd sign on the dotted line and move on. However, as they're skint, I'm not sure this will happen. This is my only concern. Anyone have any knowledge/experience in this area?

It's going to happen asap so I'm ignoring the fact that I'm 5 months off stautory redundancy pay. Admittedly, I could stay and they could do the same in, say, 6 months, but who knows.

crazygal27

Did you sign anything to agree that in return for them paying the fees you would back x% if you left within x number of years? If so, have a look at that and see if it states anything about not being enforced if you are made redundant. In my experience it has never made a difference if someone volunteered or if it was compulsory - if the company was making them redundant then the fees have never been reclaimed.

I'd let them know that before you can indicate if you want to volunteer you need clarification that the fees will be written off.

adonis10

crazygal27 wrote: »

Did you sign anything to agree that in return for them paying the fees you would back x% if you left within x number of years? If so, have a look at that and see if it states anything about not being enforced if you are made redundant. In my experience it has never made a difference if someone volunteered or if it was compulsory - if the company was making them redundant then the fees have never been reclaimed.

I'd let them know that before you can indicate if you want to volunteer you need clarification that the fees will be written off.

There is a clause but it doesn't specify x% in xyears. It basically says "if the employee leaves employment within 2 years of qualifying (not yet qualified) the employee will repay all costs relating to his training...."

How important do you think the word in bold is? Do you think 'leaves' encompasses redundancy/dismissal or resignation. To me it seems like a grey area which would require confirmation from a legal mind.

adonis10

Also, re the below:
"Redundancy notice periods

If your employer has selected you for redundancy you must be given a notice period before your employment ends. The statutory redundancy notice periods are:

• at least one week’s notice if you have been employed between one month and two years
• one week’s notice for each year if employed between two and 12 years
• 12 weeks’ notice if employed for 12 years or more

However, you should also check your contract of employment because your employer could have set out longer notice periods."


My contract doesn't mention redundancy but states that the employer will give 4 weeks notice. Does this superseed the 1 week for up to 2 years' service note?

adonis10

crazygal27 wrote: »

Did you sign anything to agree that in return for them paying the fees you would back x% if you left within x number of years? If so, have a look at that and see if it states anything about not being enforced if you are made redundant. In my experience it has never made a difference if someone volunteered or if it was compulsory - if the company was making them redundant then the fees have never been reclaimed.

I'd let them know that before you can indicate if you want to volunteer you need clarification that the fees will be written off.

Had the meeting and we will find out tomorrow.

No mention of training fees was made but the boss did say "the person will go tomorrow and be paid in lieu of notice period + any redundancy pay that is due". Another employee has it on good authority that they will not be asking for it back.

Now, do you think the situation will change if I pop back in and say "as it happens I'm looking for a new job anyway so bear that in mind", or words to that effect. Effectively volunteering for want of a better word.

lucylucky

adonis10 wrote: »

Had the meeting and we will find out tomorrow.

No mention of training fees was made but the boss did say "the person will go tomorrow and be paid in lieu of notice period + any redundancy pay that is due". Another employee has it on good authority that they will not be asking for it back.

Now, do you think the situation will change if I pop back in and say "as it happens I'm looking for a new job anyway so bear that in mind", or words to that effect. Effectively volunteering for want of a better word.

If you want to volunteer then just do it, don't fanny about.

Depending on what criteria they are using to select people, all that might happen is one person leaves through redundancy and they hope you will leave too. Then they can get the training money back from you and will have saved two salaries.

adonis10

lucylucky wrote: »

If you want to volunteer then just do it, don't fanny about.

Depending on what criteria they are using to select people, all that might happen is one person leaves through redundancy and they hope you will leave too. Then they can get the training money back from you and will have saved two salaries.

This is my concern. Even if I go in and say "looking for new job etc., the other employee has a mortgage, I don't, bear it in mind, nudge nudge, wink wink". They may acknowledge it but get rid of the other anyway, leaving me screwed because I badly want out and this is potentially my chance to get out of the fees. They save, I save, everyone is happy.

I guess it's a case of spin the wheel and take the gamble.