Question for the legal eagles?

celinepatricia

Seeing as my other post has been closed, can I ask how, asking a question is being a bully???

mizzbiz

Regardless of whether or not the poster in question was correct or incorrect in what they said, I think hunting them down by name on the open forum in order to humiliate them is out of order. And when you came to ask advice too! That's definitely a form of bullying in my book and I think it right that the thread was closed down.

celinepatricia

Why was it humiliating to them?

dickydonkin

when_will_it_end wrote: »

hi all dpassmore i have found some of your information to be helpfull

can you explain the section 3 of the HSA to me please or provide a post i am interested for my own benifit

op i do think a risk assesment should have been documented in your OH case, good luck

Hi when will it end.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I am thinking you may be referring to regulation 3 of the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations as opposed to section 3 of the Health & Safety at Work Act - the former which refers to the requirements of risk assessments and the latter relates to a duty of care owed to 'others' not in a duty holders employment such as contractors/shop customers/students etc who may be affected by working activities.

Many are very familiar with the Health & Safety at Work Act, however, the 'Management Regs' requires employers to ensure health & safety arrangements are in place including of course the requirement of risk assesments which regulation 3 specifies.

As this thread makes references to risk assessments, I suspect it will be the management regulations you are referring to.

This may have more affect than Nytol - but will give you more information (if you need it of course). The ACOP sections (Approved Code Of Practice) provide good information in 'reasonably' understandable terminology - take a look at regulation 3 and hopefully it will provide a good understanding of the requirements of the regulation.

On your last point I do agree that in the case of the OP's partner, I would certainly concur that someone returning to work after a very serious illness should have had a risk assessment carried out prior to commencement as I would imagine that there would be 'significant findings' that would need to be recorded, however, as already highlighted, whether that would have had any bearing of the tribunal outcome is open to debate - although I suspect it wouldn't.

Hope that is helpful.

dickydonkin

aright56 wrote: »

3 people on the ignore list....Bliss!

Isn't that Googlewhacker's signature?

when_will_it_end

dpassmore wrote: »

Hi when will it end.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I am thinking you may be referring to regulation 3 of the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations as opposed to section 3 of the Health & Safety at Work Act - the former which refers to the requirements of risk assessments and the latter relates to a duty of care owed to 'others' not in a duty holders employment such as contractors/shop customers/students etc who may be affected by working activities.

Many are very familiar with the Health & Safety at Work Act, however, the 'Management Regs' requires employers to ensure health & safety arrangements are in place including of course the requirement of risk assesments which regulation 3 specifies.

As this thread makes references to risk assessments, I suspect it will be the management regulations you are referring to.

This may have more affect than Nytol - but will give you more information (if you need it of course). The ACOP sections (Approved Code Of Practice) provide good information in 'reasonably' understandable terminology - take a look at regulation 3 and hopefully it will provide a good understanding of the requirements of the regulation.

On your last point I do agree that in the case of the OP's partner, I would certainly concur that someone returning to work after a very serious illness should have had a risk assessment carried out prior to commencement as I would imagine that there would be 'significant findings' that would need to be recorded, however, as already highlighted, whether that would have had any bearing of the tribunal outcome is open to debate - although I suspect it wouldn't.

Hope that is helpful.

thanks for this

just a few questions though if you can help

am i able to ask for a copy of the last risk assesment that was carried out and something i have never found the answer to when should a general risk assesment be carried out is there like a time line for the first one i have worked for the company for 2 years and only just had one due to an injury, i am not saying work caused this as i have no solid proof but i believe work contributed to it making it worse but it could have been solved 8 months ago had i had one one the injury was first brought to there attention

thanks

dickydonkin

when_will_it_end wrote: »

thanks for this

just a few questions though if you can help

am i able to ask for a copy of the last risk assesment that was carried out and something i have never found the answer to when should a general risk assesment be carried out is there like a time line for the first one i have worked for the company for 2 years and only just had one due to an injury, i am not saying work caused this as i have no solid proof but i believe work contributed to it making it worse but it could have been solved 8 months ago had i had one one the injury was first brought to there attention

thanks

I will attempt to go some way to provide answers without going into great detail.

1) Am I able to ask for a copy of the last risk assesment that was carried out?

Yes you are well within your rights to see any risk assessments that have been carried out in your workplace - although any significant findings from the risk assessments should have been communicated to you before you commenced employment - ideally at the induction stage.

You should have been informed of any hazard you may encounter during your work and what controls (precautions) the company have implemented to reduce the risk of harm to you and your colleagues.

From those risk assessments, the company should have implemented a safe system of work for the tasks you will be carrying out and this should be incorporated into your 'on the job' training.

2) When should a general risk assesment be carried out and is there a time line for the first one?

A risk assessment should be carried on any process, task, premises, substance, activity etc. that has the potential to cause harm and should ideally be carried out before the employee is exposed to the hazard.

3) I have worked for the company for 2 years and only just had one due to an injury.

Am I correct in thinking that your employer has carried out a risk assessment AFTER an accident. It is certainly good practice to review an assessment after an incident, however, it seems that there is a case of horse and stable door if I understand you correctly.

If there was no risk assessment in place prior to your injury, then the company are potentially liable, however, there is insufficient detail in your post as to what caused your injury and as you stated that you are unsure that work was the causation, it would be difficult to comment on it really.

Bearing in mind the topic of this thread, can it be that you have had an underlying condition (work related or otherwise) and you have informed your employer but he has failed to assess or make adjustments with the result that your injury has worsened?

It would help if you detailed the injury and if you had any previous medical attention because of it.

Sorry I cannot help much on your last point, but I hope my responses on your first two points will be of assistance.

when_will_it_end

[QUOTE=dpassmore;42412008
3) I have worked for the company for 2 years and only just had one due to an injury.

Am I correct in thinking that your employer has carried out a risk assessment AFTER an accident. It is certainly good practice to review an assessment after an incident, however, it seems that there is a case of horse and stable door if I understand you correctly.

If there was no risk assessment in place prior to your injury, then the company are potentially liable, however, there is insufficient detail in your post as to what caused your injury and as you stated that you are unsure that work was the causation, it would be difficult to comment on it really.

Bearing in mind the topic of this thread, can it be that you have had an underlying condition (work related or otherwise) and you have informed your employer but he has failed to assess or make adjustments with the result that your injury has worsened?

It would help if you detailed the injury and if you had any previous medical attention because of it.

Sorry I cannot help much on your last point, but I hope my responses on your first two points will be of assistance.[/QUOTE]


i feel i should start a new thread but i will quickly answer here

last feb i started with back ache thought nothing of it
went to the dr after a few weeks was given pain killers
in july i could no longer cope so dr gave me a fit not unable to work for 2 weeks
on my return my back to work note stated assisstance for 4 weeks was needed i could not work alone
assistance was given
i then paid myself for a chiropractotor it helped a littled improved my ability to work for a while, money ran out so i stoppede after 6 sessions
i november pain came back worse wrote a letter to HR asking for reasonable adjustments to my counter and a suitable chair
i was sent in jan to BUPA by work by this time i had been signed off for 4 weeks
they said i was unfit for work and a risk assesment was needed
one was compleated in early feb, io had to ask for one on my work premisis as they wanted me to move to another shop further away to do it
she was discusted with working conditions and asked for all the adjustments i had asked for
i had to get another 4 week fit note
i recieved a new chair ordered on 14th march and counter was adjusted
i am now on a phased return to work i must admit that these small adjustments have made my life easier but i had to have 10 weeks from the begiig of this yr off work

the only change last feb was i was asked to manage this shop because the manager was asked to leave it ment i had a differet work station had lots of other responceabilities (sp) this was for 3 moths and i told the area manager on many occasions i needed some one else to help as in a manager, i had only been with the compay 1 yr i did not really have the ability to do the job but i worked on initiative and imo i did a good job with the shop,

i have had test after test and am due my MRI on friday susspect a buldging disc

so i can not prove that work caused this but i am phsyically worse than i was this time last yr an financially as i was only entitled to ssp

i want to start a grievence, any tips will be of great help

when_will_it_end

the greivence will be on the ground of i feel that if i had recieved a risk assessment last july/august the reasonable adjust ments will have been made and i may not have ended up in more pain and finacialy i would have been ok

dickydonkin

when will it end

As you have clarified what your ailment actually is and indicated that your work involves a lot of sitting I can understand that you will be suffering discomfort.

A bulging disc can be caused by heavy lifting, impact from an accident or can just be degenerative, however there can be other causes as well. When the 'popped out' disk presses on nerves, it will be very painful.

Whether your work caused your problem or exacerbated an existing one only medical professionals could determine I suspect, however your employer should take into consideration your condition but in a worst case scenario, if your employer determines that you are incapable of carrying out your normal duties, then they may have to dismiss you - but let's not go there.

I did notice the following quotes from your post:

"On my return my back to work note stated assisstance for 4 weeks was needed i could not work alone
assistance was given".

"I was sent in jan to BUPA by work".

"They said i was unfit for work and a risk assesment was needed
one was compleated in early feb"

"I recieved a new chair ordered on 14th march and counter was adjusted"

"I am now on a phased return to work i must admit that these small adjustments have made my life easier"

Without dismissing your situation outright, it would seem that the company have been reasonable in accommodating your requirements to be fair.

They carried out a risk assessment as soon as you informed them of your condition, they sent you to BUPA, they replaced a chair, adjusted your desk and they are phasing your return to work.

They seem to have been very reasonable and as you have stated, their adjustments have 'made your life easier' so I just cannot see what else they can do.

Your condition is painful and there is no workstation in the world that will take away the agony, but if I understand the jist of you post, it seems your grievance is based on the absence of a risk assessment in July, but some could argue it would not have made much (if any) difference due to your condition as they could do no more.

I did state earlier in an answer to one of your questions that risk assessments should be carried out ideally before any working activity, process etc.... commences, however, with a workstation assessment (DSE Regulations) these can be problematic insomuch that a workstation may have all the modern equipment, space and appear ergonomically sound, but everyones body is different and without going into anthropometry and other ergonomic issues, it is quite possible that a very modern workstation may still cause problems for the user.

That is why it is wise to carry out DSE assessments regularly as any problem may take some time to manifest (however don't forget that the common sense action would be to inform your manager immediately if you believe your workstation is causing problems) - although from experience - people will sufffer in silence when a simple adjustment of a chair or provision of a footrest will solve a problem.

A risk assessment was carried out in February (when your backache started) and since then, the company have made reasonable adjustments in my opinion, however perhaps some HR person could clarify if that is the case.

I understand the financial implications of your condition - unfortunately we all suffer ailments during the course of our working lives - some make provisions for such events - however, as I mentioned earlier, the company could decide that you are unfit to carry out your normal duties - all I am attempting to suggest that a grievance might not help your cause.