How does one take a bank to court?

MrRedundant

Lord_Snoopy wrote: »

MrRedundant are you secretly Peter our naughty Business Manager from 2006?

The bank don't have anything authorizing the loan .. 5 or 6 months I've been asking 'til I'm blue in the face for this signed doc.

It may be they don't have a signed document. Not everything has to be signed for. Also how exactly do you know your partner hasnt signed?

Maybe I'm thicker than I already thought I was, but shouldn't I have had the chance to sign a document and then have a couple of weeks 'cooling off' to mull over and see if this was what I/we really wanted?

Yes you are. No such rights exist in law.

and yes the O.D. incurred a lot of interest but we, hopefully, with a bit of hard work and luck, could have zero'd it in 2 years.

So your calculations and offer will have factored in the OD amount and all this interest?

I get shafted by a 15 year long business partner for the full outstanding debt, I then enquire who signed for this loan, as I knew I hadn't .. I find out that nobody's signed for this loan!
Couldn't this just simply be some kind of 'weird universal' wrong being righted?

No because you are talking utter. You benefitted from the loan, clearly knew it was in place and are now trying to use a loophole to get out of your contractual obligations. Your partner probably has signed it and secondly if you had any concern about joint and several liability or the loan you should have raised these the second the first payment came out and not a second later.

You quite clearly where happy with a loan until your partner did a runner and left you liable for it. This is between you and the partner. Not the bank.

student_84

Lord Snoopy; this is only offered as general advice and is what I spotted in a textbook during revision for an exam, please do not take this a gospel truth. There is a requirement of form relating to Consumer Credit Agreements i.e. they have to be written, the relevent area is copied below along with a case that enforces this and guidelines from the oft. I do not know if this will apply to your case and you should consult a specialist in this area.

Consumer Credit Act 1974 c. 39
Part VI MATTERS ARISING DURING CURRENCY OF CREDIT OR HIRE AGREEMENTS
This version in force from: May 26, 2008 to present
(version 3 of 3)
77.— Duty to give information to debtor under fixed-sum credit agreement.
(1) The creditor under a regulated agreement for fixed-sum credit, within the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of [£1]1 [...]1, shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, together with a statement signed by or on behalf of the creditor showing, according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer,—
(a) the total sum paid under the agreement by the debtor;
(b) the total sum which has become payable under the agreement by the debtor but remains unpaid, and the various amounts comprised in that total sum, with the date when each became due; and
(c) the total sum which is to become payable under the agreement by the debtor, and the various amounts comprised in that total sum, with the date, or mode of determining the date, when each becomes due.
(2) If the creditor possesses insufficient information to enable him to ascertain the amounts and dates mentioned in subsection (1)(c), he shall be taken to comply with that paragraph if his statement under subsection (1) gives the basis on which, under the regulated agreement, they would fall to be ascertained.
(3) Subsection (1) does not apply to—
(a) an agreement under which no sum is, or will or may become, payable by the debtor, or
(b) a request made less than one month after a previous request under that subsection relating to the same agreement was complied with.
(4) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—
(a) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement [.]2
[...]2
(5) This section does not apply to a non-commercial agreement.

Along with: McGuffick v Royal Bank of Scotland Plc [2009] EWHC 2386 (Comm)

http://www.oft.gov.uk/about-the-oft/legal-powers/legal/cca/agreements/

ILW

Business loans do not fall under the consumer credit act.

student_84

That is why I wasn't sure whether it could apply since I can't find a definition of 'consumer'....until I looked in s.8
8.— Consumer credit agreements.
(1) A [consumer]1 credit agreement is an agreement between an individual (“the debtor”) and any other person (“the creditor”) by which the creditor provides the debtor with credit of any amount.

Sorry

~Brock~

student_84 wrote: »

I do not know if this will apply to your case and you should consult a specialist in this area.

I think that most of this area's 'specialists' are currently keeping a low profile, with their advance fee fraud money sitting in offshore bank accounts, waiting for the heat to die down........

Jeff_Bridges_hair

If you have this much difficulty in creating posts that are legible and not all over the place trying to explain what has happened id hate to see your court case preparation

billymadbiker

reminds me of a laugh I had a few years back..
Needed to buy a work van so,
Took out a regular, unsecured bank loan (from my normal bank, done in person in the branch) for 10k to repay back over 3 years

2 1/2 years later I get called in by the inland revenue to have my tax returns looked at (i'm self-employed)

I had wrongly been putting my monthly loan repayments down as expenses. The nice tax man told me that I could claim the intrest on the loan as an expense but not the repayments, he nicly said that he would work it all out for me he just needed to see the loan aggrement...

I could not find my copy anywhere so rang the branch, no problem they said, we will fax it to you.
Never arrived and after a few weeks the taxman was on my back so (after lots of phoning the bank) I wrote a recorded letter requesting a copy of it. They wrote back telling me it was in 'paper arcives' and it would cost me £12 to have a photocopy of it.
I sent off a cheque for £12.
They sent the check back, letter said 'sorry we can not provide the information you are looing for at this time'

A mate of mine who was studing law at the time and fancied a laugh then wrote a letter on my behalf demanding to know what the £360 p/m payments they were taking out of my account over the last 32 mths were for and, if they could not prove I had aggreed to them could they please refund them with intrest.

It all then got a bit serious and the banks law dept accused me of theft of the £10k that they had originally paid into my account.

End result, they aggreed that if I repayed the £10k they would refund my repayments.
As I had cleared the amount I got a refund of nearly £1500 and the rest of the loan wiped off.

So, they need to have proof of you aggreeing to it. If you want to see the proof they do have the right to charge you for it. If they don't provide proof or resolve the situating within a reasonable timeframe goto the banking ombusman.

~Brock~

billymadbiker wrote: »

So, they need to have proof of you aggreeing to it. If you want to see the proof they do have the right to charge you for it. If they don't provide proof or resolve the situating within a reasonable timeframe goto the banking ombusman.

Follow the above advice at your peril.....

1. The playing field has changed. The courts have since given 100% clarity to the 'game' that the above poster has admitted to playing.

a) Banks do not need to provide 'proof' of an original copy of a credit agreement, a reconstituted copy will do nicely.
b) they can continue to report your account to CRA's and royally screw up your credit rating if you decide, on the basis of advice from the archetypal man in the pub, that you do not have to pay your credit.
c) In the past, banks have tended to avoid costly legal battles over this subject because their opponents were typically try-it-on merchants with little or no personal assets from which to claim costs.....things have changed now because there is now clear legal guidance as the result of high court rulings.

2. Banking ombudsman I presume means the FOS. They will not get involved in CCA unenforcability disputes, and rightly so.