Survey disputed by vendors

monniemae

Hello, we are first time buyers trying to buy a 3bed victorian terrace in London. A family member carried out a structural survey for us (qualified to do so, he is a chartered surveyor) and said there was a problem with the loft. The loft hasn't been fully converted but it has been partially floored, lighting and drop-ladder access added. Our surveyor said the lateral bracing had been removed and the purlins running along front and rear of roof space are bowed (I could see this). There were some bits of wood wedged between the purlanes and the floor of the space - one of which just fell out when touched. There are some cracks in the rest of the house which our surveyor suggested could be related to the weight of the roof pressing down on the house because it is not structurally sound. He advised us the house would not be mortgageable unless RSJs inserted to support the weight of the roof.
The vendors were initially reasonable and said they would get a structural engineer to assess the problem and if necessary they would pay for any work needed before proceeding with sale. However they since asked an architect (friend?) to take a look and the architect said the lateral bracing could not have been removed as there never had been any lateral bracing and that the purlins were hardly bowed at all (though I saw this myself) and any bowing was due to the original slate roof being replaced by heavier concrete tiles.
So they now say there's no problem and we should pay for another sturctural survey from an RICS chartered surveyor (although of course our surveyor was registered etc - they're implying he didn't know what he was talking about).
We really want the house. But we honestly don't know what to do. Is it possible the architect could be right about the roof not being a problem? If so we would consider the second survey. Though Our surveyor is adamant his assessment is correct and says we should walk away. We're conflicted because the other problem is the vendors told us they had the work done to the loft (which we reflected in our offer) but are now saying the loft was done by the previous owners and their own purchase survey said it was all fine.
Lots of other niggly things in the survey they refuted - so we can't decide what to do, if it's worth going any further with this house, or if we should just walk away instead of getting involved in second surveys and all that..
ANy advice? sorry for the long post!

bandofbrothers

Walk away.

justjohn

Walk or down your offer simple, but all depends how bad you want it.

globalds

ANy advice? sorry for the long post!

Maybe better not to buy the house.

celyn90

I'd walk away too - I wouldn't be prepared to take such a risk if there was even a hint of a structural problem or if the vendors started being evasive about who did what DIY work when or started picking holes themselves in the work of a qualified surveryor.

I'd be curious about what a second totally independent survey would say, but not curious enough to foot the bill for it or curious enough to take on a house where someone qualified had already taken a look and had concerns. Those concerns would always be at the back of my mind. I don't think I would want to be stuck with a house with a potential quite seriuos problem that would be flagged again if I tried to sell it later down the line.

What would you do if you had a second survey done and it came back the same as the first? Would you still want it?

Burridge60

Slate is light compared to replacement concrete tiles. Did the company that replaced the roof survey it properly to establish the roof timber could bear the additional weight? Do the sellers even know?

Buy the house and you then have the problem when you come to sell it and are even more removed from the time when the property was improved.

What does your Solicitor recommend? Have you sent him a copy of the report?

If you trust the advice of your surveyor why would you seek more advice just to convince you to buy what the other surveyor suggests is a potentially defective property.

Put it on the back burner and look at more properties. This property probably wont rush out of the EA's door if you take your time to look around.

Peek in the loft too if needs be!

sonastin

Even if it is down to the replacement of the tiles and not the partial conversion of the loft, work has been done which is affecting the structural integrity of the roof. If you want to buy this house, the price you pay should reflect the fact that work is needed to correct this problem. If the vendor doesn't agree that work needs doing, you're unlikely to come to agreement on purchase price.

If you're still interested, I suggest that you and the vendor jointly instruct a 3rd independent survey (i.e. share the cost with him). If that surveyor agrees that there is a problem, you can negotiate. If he doesn't think there is a problem, I'd be tempted to walk away.

DVardysShadow

monniemae wrote: »

The vendors were initially reasonable and said they would get a structural engineer to assess the problem and if necessary they would pay for any work needed before proceeding with sale.
[1] However they since asked an architect (friend?) to take a look

and the architect said

[2] the lateral bracing could not have been removed as there never had been any lateral bracing

[3] and that the purlins were hardly bowed at all (though I saw this myself) and any bowing was due to the original slate roof being replaced by heavier concrete tiles.
So they now say there's no problem and we should pay for another sturctural survey from an RICS chartered surveyor (although of course our surveyor was registered etc - they're implying he didn't know what he was talking about).
We really want the house. But we honestly don't know what to do. Is it possible the architect could be right about the roof not being a problem? If so we would consider the second survey. Though Our surveyor is adamant his assessment is correct and says we should walk away. We're conflicted because the other problem is
[4] the vendors told us they had the work done to the loft (which we reflected in our offer) but are now saying the loft was done by the previous owners and their own purchase survey said it was all fine.
Lots of other niggly things in the survey they refuted - so we can't decide what to do, if it's worth going any further with this house, or if we should just walk away instead of getting involved in second surveys and all that..
ANy advice? sorry for the long post!

3 surveys already in play and plenty of warning signs highlighted. You don't need another survey. Just ask them [through the Agent] for sight of their purchase survey and for written evidence to back up the survey of this particular issue done by their friend. Tell the Agent that without this, you will walk. And my bet is neither will materialise. At which, you need to walk.

Damaged

if you really want it, get a third opinion. If he is most like most UK engineers, he'll over think things.
Otherwise, trust your friend and walk away, its only a house

slummymummyof3

Are you happy to potentially face having a bill to replace the concrete tiles on the roof back to slate?

mpet

What the sellers surveyor is saying could well be correct. We used to live in a Victorian terrace with a slate roof. This had to be replaced with concrete tiles, but our roofers also added extra supporting roof struts to take the extra weight.

However, to put right the damage done by not having this done, could be pricey - you may want to rethink whether you want to take on a house in this condition. -