Tax Credit Overpayments, now interview with Inland Revenue (Negilence)?

internetuser_2

Question from a friend.


She knows she has being over paid, she even rang them to say she was getting too muchy now intend to carry out an enquiry to ensure that she has received the correct amount of credits!

they have asked for:
P60 for year 2003/2004
all payslips from April 2003 todate
contracts of employment for all jobs since April 2003
bank/building society statements from April 2003 todate!

That was in October.


Now she has recived a letter from the Inland Revenue people etc,
asking to come out to ask a few questions, before they can complete
the case.


Any idea what this means ? or intails


back ground


she went from being an agency worker with variable pay low pay 7k a year, which the 2003/4 claim was based on, to contract work (around 14k a year) (they told her not to change her initial claim as she did not know how much she would get each month, anything from 30 hours to 120 hours a month) and she ended up with more over time each month than her initial amouint she quoted them.

Then she got a new job (Feb 04), and told them she was earning 19k a year. they recored this as 1300 a year on the system, and resulted in a load of hassle getting this corrected. All via the phone.

She also moved house and in with somebody in this time. (Around 18k a year) She told them but is worried that if they have not stored the correct salary they may not have this down on the system, and is going to end up with a huge fine or somthing or a day in court.

Since this if for the 2003/2004 year, she is worried they will fine her, etc for that year, then the following year for 2004/2005 do the same again, as they take that long to sort things out.

As on the 04/05 form they asked for the prior years p60. which was 14k, even though her new job was 19k, which they should already have a record off.

internetuser_2

forgot to say the interview is on tuesday at 4:30

fairenoughclough

Sounds like a complicated case.

They've still not sorted out their overpayment to me, a very straightforward case with 1 change of circumstance in three years, nearly three years down the line I'm still disputing their decision not to take the blame and they've paid me compensation twice so far!

Meanwhile the overpayment, over £3000 sits in the bank earning interest.

I don't think the interview is anything to worry about, your friend should take the stance "it's all their fault".

A little backgroung to use as ammunition:-

1. They had tons of problems with the computer system whenever a change was made to a claim.

2. They were overrun with calls early on and didn't respond to callback requests.

3. They brought in agency staff and didn't train them properly.

Do not at all costs admit to doing anything wrong, just tell them "I did what they told me on the helpline" and they haven't a leg to stand on.

irs101

internetuser

Firstly your friend shouldn't worry, it could simply be a random enquiry. More likely, your friend has been turned up by the system as high risk because of the numerous changes in circumstance. Still nothing to worry about, the crucial thing is to be clear how and when she told IR each piece of information - they should have dates of phone calls on her record, so will be able to track back.

The information IR hold on your friend for 03/04 will have been played back to her on her annual declaraion. Get her to check it. That will confirm whether they have the information about her partner.

As for the ongoing award, I think there is a possibility that they will have based her current award on the lower income. Tell your friend to check her award notice and call IR to check.

And wish her good luck from me......


fairenough
Your advice is incorrect and unhelpful. For a start, the new tax credits have only existed for two years, so how you can have an overpayment going back 3 years is confusing me. Presumably it must be something to do with WFTC, which was a completely different system.

Furthermore, "it's all their fault" isn't going to wash if someone has given the wrong information or if an IR mistake is clearly visible on the award notice or annual return.

The lines of attack you suggest are wrong too. It looks to me that this person's problems all started some time after IR sorted out the computer system and the call capacity problems. Admittedly there were some calculation problems, but IR identified cases where this was the case and rectified them - they will know if internetuser's friend was affected by this problem. Finally, what is your evidence for IR using untrained agency staff? As far as I'm aware they only used agency staff for answering calls, not in processing claims, and they were only able to give information out - they weren't able to make changes to people's records.

Advising people to treat IR in this way is silly. They have got many legs to stand on (there are 70,000 of them after all ) - they record calls for a start so will be able to trace exactly what the call centres tell people. The best advice is, keep records of your interactions with IR. If you realise you have made a mistake, admit it, and hopefully they will be lenient.

irs

internetuser_2

the problem is she is not sure when she rang them, to change things. she also rang from variuous numbers etc.

So if they have logged wrong information, or not bothered logging it (change of address took a while) they might not have a proper audit trail of all the calls.

in terms of fine or repayments how would they handle that ?

internetuser_2

oh, she also pays 470 a month child care costs.

Kevin_AdviceNI

I would add that if an overpayment does arise: and this overpayment is as a result of a Revenue mistake (or hardship would result if the Revenue sought recovery), then you should be aware that you can challenge recovery through the Revenue complaints procedure - taking the case to the Adjudicator or the Ombudsman if necessary.

irs101

Kevin

That's true, but if they decided that it was a mistake that the claimant should have noticed (i.e. it was obvious) they won't write it off.

irs

irs101

internetuser

Each time you call they ask for your National Insurance number, so calls are logged according to that, not according to the phone number you are calling from.

On their call management system (which is separate from the tax credit record) they will categorise the main reason for the call (within some broad categories). So if your friend can recall the approximate date she called, they should be able to trace it, hopefully the call log will say that she called to inform a change of circumstance. They will then be able to see on her tax credit record whether a change was actually made.

This cross-checking works in theory. I'd be interested to hear whether they do this in practice - but your friend should ask them to do it and show her the records if there is any doubt. A request under the Data Protection Act might be in order if they refused.

irs

fairenoughclough

fairenough
Your advice is incorrect and unhelpful. For a start, the new tax credits have only existed for two years, so how you can have an overpayment going back 3 years is confusing me. Presumably it must be something to do with WFTC, which was a completely different system.

Furthermore, "it's all their fault" isn't going to wash if someone has given the wrong information or if an IR mistake is clearly visible on the award notice or annual return.

The lines of attack you suggest are wrong too. It looks to me that this person's problems all started some time after IR sorted out the computer system and the call capacity problems. Admittedly there were some calculation problems, but IR identified cases where this was the case and rectified them - they will know if internetuser's friend was affected by this problem. Finally, what is your evidence for IR using untrained agency staff? As far as I'm aware they only used agency staff for answering calls, not in processing claims, and they were only able to give information out - they weren't able to make changes to people's records.

Advising people to treat IR in this way is silly. They have got many legs to stand on (there are 70,000 of them after all ) - they record calls for a start so will be able to trace exactly what the call centres tell people. The best advice is, keep records of your interactions with IR. If you realise you have made a mistake, admit it, and hopefully they will be lenient.

irs[/QUOTE]



Sorry you were right about the three years, It was October 2002 my issues began, when I registered on the internet.

Do they really record calls ?

If they do, can I get access to these calls to show them how many times I told them they'd got it wrong ?

Also data protection act, will they show me the information that led to them sending me 20 award notices for a period that included only 1 change of circumstance ?

stuwilky

fairenoughclough wrote:

fairenough
Your advice is incorrect and unhelpful. For a start, the new tax credits have only existed for two years, so how you can have an overpayment going back 3 years is confusing me. Presumably it must be something to do with WFTC, which was a completely different system.

Furthermore, "it's all their fault" isn't going to wash if someone has given the wrong information or if an IR mistake is clearly visible on the award notice or annual return.

The lines of attack you suggest are wrong too. It looks to me that this person's problems all started some time after IR sorted out the computer system and the call capacity problems. Admittedly there were some calculation problems, but IR identified cases where this was the case and rectified them - they will know if internetuser's friend was affected by this problem. Finally, what is your evidence for IR using untrained agency staff? As far as I'm aware they only used agency staff for answering calls, not in processing claims, and they were only able to give information out - they weren't able to make changes to people's records.

Advising people to treat IR in this way is silly. They have got many legs to stand on (there are 70,000 of them after all ) - they record calls for a start so will be able to trace exactly what the call centres tell people. The best advice is, keep records of your interactions with IR. If you realise you have made a mistake, admit it, and hopefully they will be lenient.

irs

Sorry you were right about the three years, It was October 2002 my issues began, when I registered on the internet.

Do they really record calls ?

If they do, can I get access to these calls to show them how many times I told them they'd got it wrong ?

Also data protection act, will they show me the information that led to them sending me 20 award notices for a period that included only 1 change of circumstance ?

They do really record calls. Can you get access to them? Probably not - but try and Subject Data Protection Request - but do voice calls count? Im not sure.

And as for your third point, I received 36 notifications (18 each for me and mrs stuwilky) and I asked why, and they send me some interesting info.... which showed theyd ****ed up

...edit October 2002? - didnt the new system only start in April 2003?