Help! Creditor would rather harrass than let me pay

Voyager2002

It would help if you could say whether you are both in the same country now. If so, then I suggest a face to face meeting where you hand over the money in front of a witness.

The law in England gives you protection from harrassment: there is plenty of information on this web site about what she is and is not allowed to do, and how the police can protect you.

I suggest you organise all the information that you have about the loan; about the payments that you have made; and about her instructions to make payments to other people. Since she does not agree with you about the amount outstanding, it might be necessary to ask a court to settle the matter. If this happens, you need to have all the papers available so that you can demonstrate what was originally agreed, what payments you made, and why.

JasX

Let her take you to court, pay the money in accordance with the court order within 30 days and your credit file will be unaffected. Plus she'll have no comeback or be able to claim payments were not made as the court will have overseen it

chesky369

Send her a cheque, so she can pay it into any of her own bank accounts in any country. Then there's a paper trail. If it were me, I'd have gotten a lawyer ages ago and I think you should too. She needs a good stiff letter from a UK lawyer, telling her where to get off in no uncertain terms.

wasntgoodenough

I can't send a cheque because I'm sure she'll say she never got it.
I think I have enough to make a solid case against her, but I would feel more comfortable to do that once I have already paid back the amount I owe.

Face to face meetings, however civilized, were a sham. The harrassment only got worse afterwards. She has access to expensive lawyers, and that is why I didnt go to a lawyer from the start.

However, you are right, it would be better to have a court decide if I owe anything else.

In a court of law, I wonder though what to expect in terms of her claims of sickness, anxiety and stress due to my "never" making payments. I just don't know what else she will try to claim I did to her. I am hoping her written denials and my original bankslips are enough to discredit her.

But does anyone see other things she could accuse me of, if this came to court - I mean, I have done nothing *to* her except try to avoid her as much as I can and pay as much as i can.

Since she has claimed so many false things already, I just do not know what to expect if I were to take her to court.

JasX

wasntgoodenough wrote: »

In a court of law, I wonder though what to expect in terms of her claims of sickness, anxiety and stress due to my "never" making payments. I just don't know what else she will try to claim I did to her. I am hoping her written denials and my original bankslips are enough to discredit her.

But does anyone see other things she could accuse me of, if this came to court - I mean, I have done nothing *to* her except try to avoid her as much as I can and pay as much as i can.

Since she has claimed so many false things already, I just do not know what to expect if I were to take her to court.

Basically not much, if anything the court might be interested in whether she was charging interest and if so confirming she is properly licensed to operate as a money lender and is not operating as an illegal loan shark (harassing debtors, not acting properly and reasonably at all times etc etc).

There are no grounds for 'stress' arising from non payment etc

paddyrg

Yep - this belongs in court - or belonged in court ages ago by the sounds of things. Where in Asia are you? The Singaporean courts are very similar to the English ones, the Japanese may be a bit different, etc. What does your loan agreement say you will use as a jurisdiction? English law? With your bank statements - does the statement show the transaction details (specifically which account they were transferred to)? If not, before you get to court, get a letter from the bank itemising the account that each of those payments went into, the dates, amount etc. An English court will not accept 'stress' for moneylenders, or you can betcha the payday loans companies would be perpetually 'stressed' and ask for more... ;-)

wasntgoodenough

paddyrg wrote: »

An English court will not accept 'stress' for moneylenders, or you can betcha the payday loans companies would be perpetually 'stressed' and ask for more... ;-)

Thank you! I feel like I can breathe now finally.
I plan to pursue everything in London, so that there can be no complications or delays due to foreign laws.
It was a cash loan, no documents, no loan agreement in writing. Everything was verbal.
Now, I think I have a better idea how to go about things.
But Id like to say more about the history of this loan, maybe you can see possible complications if I take her to court.
This lady was an acquaintance who actively pursued getting to know me, meeting me, presenting herself as a private citizen who likes to help people in need. A sort of quiet philanthropist. At the time I just graduated from fine art. She helped me with odd jobs for a couple of years and I was very grateful to her. In those days I was extremely depressed about not being able to get jobs in spite of having been able to do my dream (studying art). Now I know I should have just taken any lowly job and at least had my expenses under control. Sometimes I paid rent with credit cards - that was how irresponsible and clueless I was at the time.

One day she showed me (without any prompting from me) a bank statement of hers for an "Advance account" with Barclays. She told me that she never used this account personally. It was an account she only used to give loans - to "help" friends in need. She didn't worry about interest because it was interest free. So I said, was it like an Interest Free overdraft? she said yes. It was worth 7k. She told me she could lend me all this indefinitely, to help give me time to sort myself out. She wanted to be "instrumental in my success". To prove her sincerity, she would ask for no agreement in writing. And there was no agreed repayment amount or schedule. Because it was supposedly interest free, and it was an account she never used anyway - it had always been something she used for helping others.

Being an idiot, I went with it. She sent me and her representative to the bank with a withdrawal form with her signature, and upon withdrawal that person gave me the cash.

After that, the craziness started. She denied the very first repayment, etc. When the harrassment reached a point of harrassing even my housemates when I wasn't there, I asked for advice from other people she had "helped" - who it turned out were in a similar trap. I followed their advice, I moved house.

It's been four years, and now I am ready to finish repaying that 7k. Since she has been denying payments, she never gave updates of my balance.

Instead- here's my other problem - she has been continually sending my parents bank statements for that Advance account in her name, which was now being charged some interest.

She is charging me all this interest, and much much more. Forex rates too, because she says she has businesses in a foreign country that got affected by my loan.

She has threatened to sue me and have the court make available to her all my bank and credit card statements.

1)Could she have my bank statements opened up even if I'm not denying the loan?
2) Am I liable to pay those interest charges? I didn't know about them - she told me it was interest free - and I didn't take over her advance account. All I understood was I was liable for the cash.

She had asked me not to put my repayments into the Advance account. So I paid into another account of hers. After I while, I stopped paying due to her denials. So any interest charges were not in my control.

3) I made repayments not by bank transfer but in cash, using the deposit slips in the bank (the ones they keep on a ledge where there's a pen too). Though they are stamped and dated, they don't have my name on them, since these deposit slips only ask for the breakdown of cash and total cash being paid in. But that's what I have as proof of over 1k worth of early payments. If those cash payments had been hers- as she claims - why are the original deposit slips with me? ---So I am hoping these deposit slips would be enough to prove the earliest denied payments. (However, I do have other proof of her denials in her contradictory letters).

Well, I hope for clarification on the 3 points above. I do apologise for the longwindedness. Thank you in advance - your responses have been a big, big help.

Voyager2002

Please say which country you are in. Most people here know something about the law in England and Scotland, but if you are in the Philippines (you mentioned Peso, and the whole story sounds very filipino) then there is little useful that we can say.

Anyway, if you are in Britain then the law is mainly on your side. You agreed to accept an interest-free loan, and so she cannot turn round after the event and charge you interest. The court that would hear this kind of case is a civil court, completely different from the process used to try criminal suspects. All that the court would be interested in would be how much you originally borrowed; how much you have repaid; how much is left. Since you have the paying-in slips the court is likely to believe you, rather than her.

As for her behaviour to force you to pay, that sounds like harrassment and is a criminal offence. You can seek assistance from the police, assuming you are in the UK.

Mallotum_X

Sounds like shes an illegal loan shark rather than anything else. I'd contact the police...

dancingfairy

She sounds bad indeed. Just how is she going to prove that the money was a loan to you? there apparently is no paperwork signed by either side? If it was a loan does she have the correct authorisation/registration to give you a proper loan? undoubtedly not. otherwise it could be considered just a gift.
You have a) contradictory letters written by her , b ) a record of your payments, c) others who have also been victims of hers?

It really does sound like she is acting as an illegal loan shark. Wanting money paid into a third persons bank account? hmmm , wanting it paid in foreign money?
She has closed the bank account you paid money into before - why? I'm sure the authorities would be interested.
Harrassment of other tenants?
In England she clearly does not have a legal leg to stand on. I am tempted to think she is a very clever con women who relies on either her charm or threats to get the money back. I doubt very much she would take you to court over this matter as she is relying on her threats etc.
I think you really need to report her to the police, preferably with as much evidence as you have got, from your previous housemates, from others that have said things about her etc - you collectively need to stand up to her to stop her doing these things again.
I don't know whether you can phone the police anoymously to report this if you fear reprisals - you can say that you think it has happened to - (mention yourself here, and other people) but you don't necessarily have to identify yourself.
I obviously can't comment with regards to laws in other countries as I have no knoweldge of them.
df