MSE News: 'Poor families must get fair energy deal'

tgroom57

I could manage my money well enough when the children were at home and I got child benefit. When they left home (and all child allowances stopped) is when things became difficult. As soon as they left, suddenly the govt was handing out free laptops to all (the poor) families with children, extra winter fuel payments to all (the poor) families with children... you get the idea.

But one GOOD thing.
I am with Swalec. They do a concessionary tariff for households who spend more than 10% (I think it is 10%) of their household income on electricity. I am borderline, but when they 'estimated' my electricity usage -based on when the teenagers were at home- it took me into the qualifying zone. I am not going to argue - I am on it for a year now.

Harriat

Joyful wrote: »

The people that I think should be helped is single people on benefits. They have a lot less money coming in than those with children. Anyway doesn't the government give Child tax credits to bring poor families up to an acceptable amount of money to live on?

I quite agree. I was made redundant through Government cutbacks on immigration. Because I get contribution based allowance I cannot claim for reading glasses, cold weather payments etc. Those on income based allowance get extra payments - Does the Government think its cheaper to heat my home because i've paid the contributions, I think not

dougz_2

Ken68 wrote: »

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/wms/?id=2010-12-02a.86WS.1

The proposal appears to be redirecting money from those whose age indicates they have increased need to keep warm to survive, to those who qualify for means tested benefits such as 'pension credit'. Is that not just an additional £130pa disincentive to save for your own retirement?

Also, can someone explain to me why the definition of 'fuel poverty' is not complete nonsense?

Households that need to spend 10% or more of their income to adequately heat their homes are defined as being in fuel poverty.

I would argue that the retired banker with a £200,000pa pension who spends £20,000pa to heat his mansion is in no sort of poverty at all.

Joyful

Through work today I have spoken to 2 customers and a case worker. One was getting £51 pw and putting £30 on her electric meter as she has economy 7 storage heaters. This case worker advised the customer had to choose to eat or heat the house.

The other had Gas heating and advised she could not afford the £20 per fortnight to barely heat her house as she also received only £50.

Surely the Government needs to recognise that on this income people need extra help to heat the house? It seems people are being penalised for not having children or being older.

CharlieBilly

I agree but I do thing some families with children suffer to sometimes its neglect because of selfish parents others its genuine, but also there are childless couples, oap (still) and single people. Not everyone is for sure but when money is tight it hits the poorest first and its not right some people choose to eat or heat and its shameful if that happens

Joyful wrote: »

Through work today I have spoken to 2 customers and a case worker. One was getting £51 pw and putting £30 on her electric meter as she has economy 7 storage heaters. This case worker advised the customer had to choose to eat or heat the house.

The other had Gas heating and advised she could not afford the £20 per fortnight to barely heat her house as she also received only £50.

Surely the Government needs to recognise that on this income people need extra help to heat the house? It seems people are being penalised for not having children or being older.

KimYeovil

dougz wrote: »

Also, can someone explain to me why the definition of 'fuel poverty' is not complete nonsense?
I would argue that the retired banker with a £200,000pa pension who spends £20,000pa to heat his mansion is in no sort of poverty at all.

More significant is the in-practice application of the schemes whereby one has to SPEND 10% or 15% of your gross income to qualify. It is only those wealthy enough to heat their homes in the first place who can qualify. Plus, being based on gross income, those in social housing only have to spend a fraction of what someone privately renting has to use.

The vast majority of people who are genuinely too poor to adequately warm their homes in the first place are completely disenfranchised. (And, it seems, censored from contributing to this forum.)

spiro

Joyful wrote: »

Through work today I have spoken to 2 customers and a case worker. One was getting £51 pw and putting £30 on her electric meter as she has economy 7 storage heaters. This case worker advised the customer had to choose to eat or heat the house.

The other had Gas heating and advised she could not afford the £20 per fortnight to barely heat her house as she also received only £50.

Surely the Government needs to recognise that on this income people need extra help to heat the house? It seems people are being penalised for not having children or being older.

There may be many younger people on this forum but I am in my early fifties and when I was a child growing up there was not such thing as central heating, the most you had was an open fire. In winter you wrapped up warm and if it was very cold there was ice on the inside of the windows in the morning. It has been proven by a nursery in Scotland that children exposed to the elements are healthier so maybe people should moan less about what they spend on gas and just turn the heating down/off like we used to have to live like.

smunchkinp

Easiest and fairest way is to give those with pre-payment meters the same tariff as those who pay by direct debit.
In fact they should get it slightly cheaper as they pay BEFORE they use anything.

Im not on a pre-payment meter, and when i got into financial difficulties last year and the energy company wanted to fit one, i flatly refused to even let them in the house. ( benefits of having a big mean dog )

EVERY family has the ability to get online, even its just booking a 30 minute slot at the local library, so saying im not on the internet and cant compare is no excuse,
The Elderly who are struggling do need help to find the best deals, as a lot of them are unable to grasp the concept of the internet but how long would it take you as a neighbour, relative, friend, to find the best deal on their behalf, I did it for my nan and 6 of her neighbours.
Also some families are in fuel poverty purely by their own lifestyle, If they insist that every bedroom is equipped by xbox's and TV's PC's laptop's ect, then they can pay the fuel bill or learn to cut back.

Those on a really low income can get loans from the DSS for large household goods, which are interest free, or they can ask a credit union but i know of several families who get these loans, not for the items they claimed to need, but for holidays, birthday and xmas presents.

savemoney

You could equally say some who pay by direct debt may be paying for future bills some may be in credit even by hundreds of pounds.

I am in credit not by much I owe some on gas but have built a credit on electric which about equals it out

smunchkinp wrote: »

Easiest and fairest way is to give those with pre-payment meters the same tariff as those who pay by direct debit.
In fact they should get it slightly cheaper as they pay BEFORE they use anything.

Cardew

smunchkinp wrote: »

Easiest and fairest way is to give those with pre-payment meters the same tariff as those who pay by direct debit.
In fact they should get it slightly cheaper as they pay BEFORE they use anything.

.

Welcome to the forum.

All the utility companies state that pre-pay meters(PPM) cost a great deal more to administer than credit meters.

This was given in evidence by the bosses of the Utility companies to the Parliamentary Committe on Energy supply as the justification for the additional charge for PPM and that was accepted.

In Parliament it was stated that PPM were generally used by the less well off, and hence less able to afford high energy prices. It was as a result of this political pressure that companies have reduced their PPM tariffs in line with their Standard tariffs.

However PPM tariffs still cost more to administer and it is paid for by a cross-subsidy from other tariffs - robbing Peter to pay Paul!

That is exactly the same principle as this Warm Homes initiative.
The Government announces in the House that £250million will be spent in subsidies for poorer families. Yet that money comes from higher prices we all pay for our gas and electricity - not taxation - more robbing Peter to pay Paul.