Budget for a Loft Conversion

peediedj

typeractive wrote: »

Hi peeddiedj,

Sorry, though I'm not sure what you want help with really? You have pretty much answered your own questions just by airing them - yes it depends on what style raftes you have (well not solely) but it helps to know what you have - can ya poke ya head up in the attic and hve a look? If you want to know of the stairs, well there are some pretty strict rules on stair case design, IIRC 220mm tread depth, 200mm riser height (I should know all of this off the top of my head!!), maximum pitch of 42 degrees. However, I don't know if there is a minimum of step width? Tho naturally you want something easy and safe to get up and down. Remember if you're moving furniture up there it could be tough on small stairs. It is possible to get space saving stairs which look scary to walk up! (Will see if I can find a pic for you).

Have you thought about an extension if there's enough space outside to build onto?

already built a extension for my disabled son,so no room left there,as for stairs to save room cant you put a spiral in??

typeractive

Ok,

Spirals - yes, possible. I briefly looked into them when I was thinking about it all. I seem to recall you need around 5ft square as a kind of minimum diameter - but you'd really have to look into it with some detail.

Also, you need to think about where you rise into the attic. You need optimum head height to get up there (i.e. it's no good entering at the eaves of the roof as you're gonna bump ya head). So spirals (imo) are better if they're more central. If you perhaps have some old cupboard space that you'd be prepared to get rid of maybe you could use that space? Or it might mean adjustments to existing rooms and layout?

I guess with anything it's just very difficult to give some opinions and ideas without knowing the layout.

Perhaps get a planner to pop round and shoot some ideas through, you could also ask some recommended builders / loft specialists for their opinions.

typeractive

BS 5395 Part 2 1984.
This states that a spiral serving 1 habitable room should have a 600mm clear width, max rise of 220mm and centre going of more than 145mm.
This would be our 1448mm diameter.
For a main stair serving 2 or more habitable rooms you require a 800mm clear width (900mm in Scotland), max rise of 220mm and a centre going of 190mm.
This would be our 1830mm diameter (2083mm diameter in Scotland).

Source: http://www.castspiralstairs.com/spiral-building-regs.php

Here's the space saving stairs I mentioned:



Whilst I was looking I found these - they look scary!!

Bazman

Hi I have similar questions:

I am looking to have a shell done. With basic electrics etc for a small office.

1.) I am in the top floor flat. The flats are freehold. If I make no alteration to the shape of the roof do I require the other freeholders consent? 1b)If I do change the roof (i.e. a dormer style) do I require their consent?

2.) Would a dormer style conversion require planning permission?

3.) The flat actually has the potential for some stunning views across London. I would like to consider the possibility of putting in a patio on top of the LC. Would this require planning permission, (I assume it would require the permission of the other FH.?)

4.) Is it necessary to have a architect/draughtsman do the drawings first? I spoke to a couple of loft conversion specialists and both seemed confident that they would not need a plan?

If it is what can I expect from the draughtman/architect? Full layout + specification of all materals heating systems wiring and plumbing or something less detailed?

Can someone recommend somebody a suitable architect who will cover the south east London area. I only want first hand recomendations please.

5.) Can someone give me ballpark firgures for the conversion? with/without the dormer. The floorplace is circa 875 sqft and the head height at the peak is circa 7 feet.

Thanks

Baz

ash0786 wrote: »

Hi people.

My 1st ever post on this site!

I am looking to get the shell of my loft conversion done in a couple of months. I live in the east London area and have a 3 bedroom terraced house. I know this may sound crazy but im looking to get 2 bedrooms and a bathroom in the loft. The house is 18ft wide. I have a few questions i hope you lovely ppl can help me out with.

1. Do I get the architect to do the plans first or do I speak to the local buildings reg officer first?
2. How much am i looking at, price wise, for a loft shell, raised floor, landing, stairs etc etc? roughly?..the internal stud walls, plastering, electrics, plumbing etc etc i will sort out myself. Just a rough price for the structure.
3. Anyone know a good architect in the london area?

Obviously money is a issue, hence shell only but i am pretty good at DIY so will deal with majority of internal work myself.

Regards to all you peeps and a happy and prosporus new year!

typeractive

Hi Bazman,

Unfortunately I can't answer all your questions, but I'll try and help a little bit:

Bazman wrote: »

Hi I have similar questions:

I am looking to have a shell done. With basic electrics etc for a small office.

1.) I am in the top floor flat. The flats are freehold. If I make no alteration to the shape of the roof do I require the other freeholders consent? 1b)If I do change the roof (i.e. a dormer style) do I require their consent?

I really don't know. I would imagine with no changes, and with it being to building regs then it should cover the safety aspect. Though being a shared build I'm sure there would be some kind of paperwork necessary.

2.) Would a dormer style conversion require planning permission?

Have a look here for some info on dormer's. Planning Portal IIRC it depends on the direction it faces and a few bits and bobs. I should be covered in the confirmed building regs as opposed to planning permission - they're two seperate things. Though if the window was to face into someone else's property etc there may be further complications - and plannign as such may be required? Click on the interactive house link - it's pretty handy.

3.) The flat actually has the potential for some stunning views across London. I would like to consider the possibility of putting in a patio on top of the LC. Would this require planning permission, (I assume it would require the permission of the other FH.?)

Sounds lovely - can I come and visit for a weekend! I would imagine most definitely planning permission would be needed for this sort of work.

4.) Is it necessary to have a architect/draughtsman do the drawings first? I spoke to a couple of loft conversion specialists and both seemed confident that they would not need a plan?

If it is what can I expect from the draughtman/architect? Full layout + specification of all materals heating systems wiring and plumbing or something less detailed?

I'm quite surprised at this. To be done legit, then the "plans" (though in this case if we were not looking for planning permission) would need to be passed by building control. So how the loft conversion companies assume they will get the green light for go without will go beyond me?? Surely they're required? Unless they know some other sort of stuff? hmmm

They will give you the spec of what materials are required to build - again the loft conversion company / builder should follow these.

As for the electrics, that's different - they will suggest that the floor has a hard wired smoke detection system, and that any installed electrics should be carried out by a competent electrician with the relevant qualifications. Part P standards must be met, but try and find a sparky that is affiliated to an 'awarding body' NIC / Napit etc. There's lots of differing opinions on here with regards to which holds a better value. My guy is NIC registered and to date I've found him excellent and very competent.

Can someone recommend somebody a suitable architect who will cover the south east London area. I only want first hand recomendations please.

Sorry - I can't

5.) Can someone give me ballpark firgures for the conversion? with/without the dormer. The floorplace is circa 875 sqft and the head height at the peak is circa 7 feet.

Thanks

Baz

Again I'm not too good at suggesting any sort of price here. Perhaps other forum members could help?

My largest piece of advice - contact your local council's building control office. Speak to someone / email them all your questions. They won't be allowed to recommend any trades people but they will be able to tell you what you need. Then it's like anything else, shop around.

They may also want a structural engineers report completing also - another add on. This may be worthwhile anyway as the property is a shared residence!

Personally I'd be looking at other loft conversion places as I wouldn't feel confident them doing the work without the drawings passed through building control - but that's just me.

Finally budget for it, then budget a LOT more. As there are always complications / unforseen issues. You wouldn't imagine the cost of insulation alone!!!

It won't be cheap that's for sure. You may end up compromising somewhere - ie. dormer over the patio idea, but it sounds a great spot!!

Good luck and post up some pics if you go for it!!

Bazman

My main concern is where to start really.

Obviously I have to have some decent idea of the likely cost before I can decide if the project is feasable.

So do I get a LC specialist round to give me the ball park figure or the draughtsman/architect?

Ideally I just want to get a few quotes so that I can get a good feel for the costs involved.

It seems that LC guys are happy to do this but would a draughtman/architect do the same?

Can I rely on the LC specialists quotes?

typeractive wrote: »

Hi Bazman,

Unfortunately I can't answer all your questions, but I'll try and help a little bit:



I really don't know. I would imagine with no changes, and with it being to building regs then it should cover the safety aspect. Though being a shared build I'm sure there would be some kind of paperwork necessary.

Have a look here for some info on dormer's. Planning Portal IIRC it depends on the direction it faces and a few bits and bobs. I should be covered in the confirmed building regs as opposed to planning permission - they're two seperate things. Though if the window was to face into someone else's property etc there may be further complications - and plannign as such may be required? Click on the interactive house link - it's pretty handy.

Sounds lovely - can I come and visit for a weekend! I would imagine most definitely planning permission would be needed for this sort of work.

I'm quite surprised at this. To be done legit, then the "plans" (though in this case if we were not looking for planning permission) would need to be passed by building control. So how the loft conversion companies assume they will get the green light for go without will go beyond me?? Surely they're required? Unless they know some other sort of stuff? hmmm

They will give you the spec of what materials are required to build - again the loft conversion company / builder should follow these.

As for the electrics, that's different - they will suggest that the floor has a hard wired smoke detection system, and that any installed electrics should be carried out by a competent electrician with the relevant qualifications. Part P standards must be met, but try and find a sparky that is affiliated to an 'awarding body' NIC / Napit etc. There's lots of differing opinions on here with regards to which holds a better value. My guy is NIC registered and to date I've found him excellent and very competent.


Sorry - I can't

Again I'm not too good at suggesting any sort of price here. Perhaps other forum members could help?

My largest piece of advice - contact your local council's building control office. Speak to someone / email them all your questions. They won't be allowed to recommend any trades people but they will be able to tell you what you need. Then it's like anything else, shop around.

They may also want a structural engineers report completing also - another add on. This may be worthwhile anyway as the property is a shared residence!

Personally I'd be looking at other loft conversion places as I wouldn't feel confident them doing the work without the drawings passed through building control - but that's just me.

Finally budget for it, then budget a LOT more. As there are always complications / unforseen issues. You wouldn't imagine the cost of insulation alone!!!

It won't be cheap that's for sure. You may end up compromising somewhere - ie. dormer over the patio idea, but it sounds a great spot!!

Good luck and post up some pics if you go for it!!

typeractive

Bazman wrote: »

My main concern is where to start really.

Obviously I have to have some decent idea of the likely cost before I can decide if the project is feasable.

So do I get a LC specialist round to give me the ball park figure or the draughtsman/architect?

Ideally I just want to get a few quotes so that I can get a good feel for the costs involved.

It seems that LC guys are happy to do this but would a draughtman/architect do the same?

OK. This is what I suggest.

1. Call the local building dept. Explain about the ideas of patios etc. See if they say it's possible (which I guess anything is possible these days - within reason), ask for the admin fees. Cost - nothing.

2. Call a few draughtsmen for a consultation. Personally if I was going all out extravogant I'd call an architect. Though if you decide upon the dormer only route etc, call the draughstmen. Get a few of them to come out, talk it over and ask for a free quote. Ask them of the work and materials involved - jot these down for a rough idea. Cost - nothing.

3. Call a few builders / loft conversion specialists. Get them to come around, give them an idea of what you decided upon with the draughtsmen. e.g. a couple of rooms, new joists, any steels needed. Ask them for a quote. Cost - nothing.

4. If you're savvy and up front to say - I'm just shopping around for ideas and costs, then to find out an estimate it will cost you nothing.

A LC will know of the current regs (if they're reputable at least), and they will have a team that are able to do all the work. They will know what to expect as they do it day in day out. Have a look at their portfolio - what have they done in the past? What do they think it will cost?

It's very difficult to compare the costs. A builder may come in way under the LC specialist, though how much experience do they have? They may do a cracking job? Who knows?

If you're in doubt, just go with the LC specialists and invite them round - compare a few companies. See if anyone can recommend one? Query the building regs, and who will do the drawings. You want them approved by the local council.

Can I rely on the LC specialists quotes?

Difficult to say as I've already explained. Can you rely upon any quotes?...the thing is - with good homework you can at least narrow some factors down. Look at their portfolio of work, how much do they know? what's their relationship with the building control (if they carry out work locally). Call the building control company and ask if they have dealt with this company when it comes to submitting plans / inspecting work.

It's all about research and communication. Perhaps the LC specialists will be an inititally high quote, but they are more likely to factor in the real costs, and unexpected hicups that a builder who rarely does the same job would see.

An architect / draughtsman is unlikely to know the costs. They could give you a ballpark figure. Though are they likely to know the current costs of C16 8 by 2 joists? Or the cost of 40m2 kingspan 75mm insulation? Barely. An LC specialist is your friend at the moment. Compare a few and see what they suggest.

Bazman

OK contacting the counil with my queries. In the mean time found this:

Found these guys who do loft storage rooms for circa £5k.

Seems exactly what I need?

Thing is this seems a lot lower than any other quote I have seen for a LC?

Anyone got a good handle on the difference between a "storage room LC" and a full LC are?

Also anyone got any first hand experiences of this company in particular.

Baz

macman

Bazman wrote: »

OK contacting the counil with my queries. In the mean time found this:

Found these guys who do loft storage rooms for circa £5k.

Seems exactly what I need?

Thing is this seems a lot lower than any other quote I have seen for a LC?

Anyone got a good handle on the difference between a "storage room LC" and a full LC are?

Also anyone got any first hand experiences of this company in particular.

Baz

Loft storage is exactly what is says-extra storage, using the existing loft space and joists.
A proper loft conversion requires proper permanent access, sufficient windows, and the insertion of steels to support the new floor, plus any electrical/plumbing and fire safety requirements. Your existing loft floor is not designed to take the weight of a full conversion and cannot support the loads that it would impose.
The two are entirely different things.
if you try and 'bodge' a storage conversion into a full LC then not only will you be in breach of the regs, but you will never be able to sell the property as having a loft conversion (or indeed, sell it at all without doing the necessary remedial works).
You can't do a loft conversion for £5K!

typeractive

Bazman wrote: »

OK contacting the counil with my queries. In the mean time found this:

Found these guys who do loft storage rooms for circa £5k.

Seems exactly what I need?

Thing is this seems a lot lower than any other quote I have seen for a LC?

Anyone got a good handle on the difference between a "storage room LC" and a full LC are?

Also anyone got any first hand experiences of this company in particular.

Baz

Baz, I think you really need to decide upon what you want. One minute you're talking patios with beautiful views of the city, the next you're thinking of a storage room. Most likely any such loft storage will include boarding the existing floor (so no strengthened enough to be lived upon / habitated), you will probably get a loft hatch with ladders that drop down and a light inside.

This (in my eyes) is not a loft conversion in the slightest. It's just extra space to store the Christmas tree etc. None of this is what I was talking about. Perhaps this is the reason why the LC specialists were so sure they wouldn't need any drawings?!#

Macman was spot on, though I don't fully agree with this:

You can't do a loft conversion for £5K!