Electric Cars

victor2

frothey wrote: »

the battery thing is a red herring imo - I'm pretty sure that in 14 years Toyota have only replaced a handfull of batteries, they are arguably more reliable than most manufacturers engines! manufacturers will be very lenient on battery claims for years as they won't want the negative press.

It may well be, but I recently bought a 4 year old Prius, mainly on the basis of the hybrid system (including the battery) having an 8 year/100,000 mile warranty. It's reassuring to know that I still have 4 years of that left. On one hand you think Toyota wouldn't give such a warranty if they didn't think the system wouldn't last that long. On the other hand, you could say it's marketing by them to get the new techonology established, and they've factored in the cost of replacing those that don't last.
Either way, it suits me, although I have assumed that the car may well be worthless in another 4 years, so it would be wise to allow a depreciation cost of 100% in that time, and any value it has left is a bonus.

SailorSam

I get a regular email/newsletter from 50cycles 'cos i'm interested in perhaps getting an electric bike, the latest newsletter has on it 'coming soon electric cars'. There's nothing to read at the moment but ...... watch this space.

Hammyman

TVR2 wrote: »

Would be good if users could plot journeys they have completed in it for some real world battery range. I mean, 100 miles means what if there are lots of hills?

What if its cold? In the current cold snaps, the battery life would be massively reduced.

Hammyman

frothey wrote: »

But you've got to take it in context - their would be potentially people shouting that the batteries aren't "green", but conveniently forgetting you can knock the impact of producing an engine, the lubricants and the production of the fuel.

However an engine and the lubricants are fully 100% re-cyclable unlike a lithium ion battery. I'm glad you brought up fuel. Most electricity generation in this country is from coal powered generation so electric cars are not as "green" as people think they are. Mind you most pro electric car eco-loonies seem to think electricity comes from thin air the way they talk.

Also recovering metals from batteries is more energy intensive than recycling an engine:

From Battery Universe:

Current battery recycling methods requires a high amount of energy. It takes six to ten times the amount of energy to reclaim metals from recycled batteries than it would through other means.

thescouselander

Hammyman wrote: »

What if its cold? In the current cold snaps, the battery life would be massively reduced.

This is a good point actually - Lithium batteries do no work well at all in some of the temperatures we have experienced recently. NiMH is even worse.

optimus_primera

Its not just about what range at what speed though.
The weight of the vehicle would have some bearing on it surely??
ie a fully loaded vehicle with family and luggage would use more juice than a single occupant ?

As previously mentioned, you have batteries reaction to cold temps,plus as you do not have a heat exchanger on the form of an Internal combustion engine,you have to rely on the battery providing the heating power for occupants,and as we all know, to get decent heat via electric power,takes a lot of wattage.

I am not convinced about electric vehicles as a suitable alternative yet. Can you imagine the amount of battery power needed to run a HGV when the oil runs out!

frothey

victor2 wrote: »

Either way, it suits me, although I have assumed that the car may well be worthless in another 4 years, so it would be wise to allow a depreciation cost of 100% in that time, and any value it has left is a bonus.

old prius's still sell at the same sort of money as diesel focus's, etc - and they are way outside of warranty!

Hammyman wrote: »

However an engine and the lubricants are fully 100% re-cyclable unlike a lithium ion battery. I'm glad you brought up fuel. Most electricity generation in this country is from coal powered generation so electric cars are not as "green" as people think they are. Mind you most pro electric car eco-loonies seem to think electricity comes from thin air the way they talk.

We need to go Nuclear for electric cars to have any future...

BTW - do they re-cycle lubricants or just use them as fuel? which gives off more CO..... and even with the million+ hybrids that toyota have put on the road, there's hardly a pile of batteries waiting to be re-cycled. Again, people conviniently forget that normal cars have batteries and lots of nasty bits in them as well!

All this carbon footprint stuff is b*lll*cks if you ask me, people will only look as far into it as their vested interest needs - my bike is hardly CO friendly, carbon frame shipped from the states, lots of titanium bits, lots of bits shipped from china.... even if it was, the moment I chuck them in the back of my car it's all wasted anyway lol!

Hammyman

frothey wrote: »

BTW - do they re-cycle lubricants or just use them as fuel?

Recycle them. In some HGVs, they already do this kind of. On some I've driven they have a centrifugal filter which takes out even more particulates and means 100,000km engine oil changes.

When you do an oil change in a garage it goes into an oil drainer which is then emptied by tanker and goes off for recycling. Local council waste collection sites have similar waste oil tanks. Its only oile from muppets who DIY it at home and chuck it down the drain that doesn't get recycled, plus that that leaks out of the engine in daily driving.

There used to be a couple of businesses I delivered drums to in the 90's who used to recycle old oil with it typically ending up as the £2.99 a gallon stuff at the motorist shops.

frothey wrote:

All this carbon footprint stuff is b*lll*cks if you ask me, people will only look as far into it as their vested interest needs - my bike is hardly CO friendly, carbon frame shipped from the states, lots of titanium bits, lots of bits shipped from china.... even if it was, the moment I chuck them in the back of my car it's all wasted anyway lol!

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::T:T:T:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

About the most truthful statement in the whole fiasco TBH.

davidjwest

Thanks for the feedback everyone, I'll bear this in mind as I develop the site.