Friend in a bit of a pickle...

boyse7en

SandC wrote: »

Is Sally's car a company car? Does the company have any company cars? If so ask him to find out what the company insurance covers as it's not always just basically x car with x driver.

Our company cars are covered for an employee (over 25) in any car, but that doesn't matter, as Matt wasn't driving Sally's company car, he was driving the client's car, so company car insurance wouldn't cover him.

Mark_Hewitt

Presumably the friend doesn't have a policy of their own which covers driving others cars on a third party basis?

Pernicious

My friend does have a full UK licence, & is insured on his own car.

He has 6 or 7 years of no claims so I guess he is an experienced driver, however he drives a corsa & is nowhere near as experienced as say, my father who has had his licence for over 30 years & has driven numerous different types of vehicles abroad as well as in the UK, but still this is the sort of thing you don't think will happen isn't it.

I don't think the company has any company cars, the car that was damaged was Sally's own.

Rossy.

So let me get this straight,

Your pal get's into the clients car and attempts to move it. He doesn't check to see if it's in gear and starts it. The car jumps a few feet forward and hit's sally's BMW.

She's on one and decides to go to BMW to check how much damage her car has. She comes back with the following

1. Scratched the bumper
2. Dented a panel behind it
3. Made the boot wonky
4. Ruptured a water bottle in the boot

At this point i'll say that all car manufacturers over claim on vehicle repairs as put simply it makes them money. Car manufacturers are not making as much money on new cars as they'd like and so push prices up on parts etc.

Secondly are BMW's made from egg cartons or something?. That little shunt would of happened at only 1-2 mph and i highly doubt it would cause a wonky boot/dented panel.

Sally is higher up in the chain of command, she should have known better than to instruct someone to move a car that

A) doesn't belong to her or the company
the person moving the car is not insured to do so

In my opinion Sally deserves to get her car repaired, but i think given the time of year, and that she's partly to blame i think she should get a few more "realistic" quotes than the first quote given by BMW

I feel for your mate. Horrible position to be in. Can't pay - Get sacked. Argues to pay - Get's sacked. Pay's to keep little miss muffet happy and will probably skint him completely.

Mark_Hewitt

He needs to check his policy, quite often you're covered on a third party basis on your own insurance.

neilmcl

Out of interest, what did the client say about all this, or has been kept in the dark?

mikey72

It's down to the company to sort out, not your mate on third party insurance. He was told to move it, so was acting for the company. Having said that it depends on how much he likes his job.
The public liability is supposed to cover damage to the public caused by your company. As Sally is a partner, she may or may not be covered depending on the words of their policy. There are some exceptions using some road cars, on private land on some policies, if other insurances apply etc.
If he had driven a company car into the clients it would have been more clear cut, even more so if it was say a ride on mower not used on the road for example.
She should be covered on her car insurance, that would mean making a claim, and if it's a company car with company insurance that would probably need sorting with the public liabilty as "other insurances" then apply and they wouldn't pay if her car insurance would.

JQ.

Hmmnn - OP I really don't think your mate should go all guns blazing based on the advice in this thread - I don't think anyone has catagorically answered your question. My immediate thoughts :

• Public Liability insurance is irrelevant - a forklift running over a member of the public on site yes, private cars in a car park no. Private cars have their own insurance.
• All cars involved are privately owned, so discussions about company cars is irrelevant
• Comments about it being Company Business are irrelevant, it was a car crash. I have access to several company cars - If I crash one I am responsible, which involves paying the £500 excess on the company car insurance policy. Same as my private car - if I crash it while on company business I am responsible. I think the fact that it was on company premises is a red herring and irrelevant.
• Comments about the dark overlord Sally ordering her minions about are a bit comical. I've worked in an office where double parking takes place and 2 people going out to move a car is completely normal. If a Partner is blocking a graduate's car, the graduate will ask the Partner to move their car. It takes far less time if 2 people do it.
• I've regularly moved other peoples car - but only when insured. When I had a company car I'd only move Company cars, now I have a private car I'll hapily move any car, as I have 3rd party cover. If someone asked me to move a car I knew I was not insured on I would refuse, and have done.
• Whilst morally, the company should pay I'd be interested to hear how that is enforceable. Unless Matt catagorically stated to Sally that he was not insured to move the client's car and she forced him to do it.
• Arguably, on the basis that Matt has been driving for 7 years, you would expect him to excercise a duty of care when driving someone elses car. It would appear he did not. When I get in someone else's car I certainly spend a bit of time working out what's going on, I don't just get in and crank it up.
• Sally is insured and can certainly claim on her insurance - however, her insurance company will then just go after Matt for their costs. If she takes a like for like courtesy car for a few weeks - that could end up very costly.

I don't know what the answer is, but then again I don't think anyone else does, so I would advise your mate to tread very carefully. There's a poster on here called Dacouch who seems very knowledgeable about insurance - might be worth pm'ing him/her.

mikey72

JQ. wrote: »

Hmmnn - OP I really don't think your mate should go all guns blazing based on the advice in this thread - I don't think anyone has catagorically answered your question. My immediate thoughts :

• Public Liability insurance is irrelevant - a forklift running over a member of the public on site yes, private cars in a car park no. Private cars have their own insurance.
• All cars involved are privately owned, so discussions about company cars is irrelevant
• Comments about it being Company Business are irrelevant, it was a car crash. I have access to several company cars - If I crash one I am responsible, which involves paying the £500 excess on the company car insurance policy. Same as my private car - if I crash it while on company business I am responsible. I think the fact that it was on company premises is a red herring and irrelevant.
• Comments about the dark overlord Sally ordering her minions about are a bit comical. I've worked in an office where double parking takes place and 2 people going out to move a car is completely normal. If a Partner is blocking a graduate's car, the graduate will ask the Partner to move their car. It takes far less time if 2 people do it.
• I've regularly moved other peoples car - but only when insured. When I had a company car I'd only move Company cars, now I have a private car I'll hapily move any car, as I have 3rd party cover. If someone asked me to move a car I knew I was not insured on I would refuse, and have done.
• Whilst morally, the company should pay I'd be interested to hear how that is enforceable. Unless Matt catagorically stated to Sally that he was not insured to move the client's car and she forced him to do it.
• Arguably, on the basis that Matt has been driving for 7 years, you would expect him to excercise a duty of care when driving someone elses car. It would appear he did not. When I get in someone else's car I certainly spend a bit of time working out what's going on, I don't just get in and crank it up.
• Sally is insured and can certainly claim on her insurance - however, her insurance company will then just go after Matt for their costs. If she takes a like for like courtesy car for a few weeks - that could end up very costly.

I don't know what the answer is, but then again I don't think anyone else does, so I would advise your mate to tread very carefully. There's a poster on here called Dacouch who seems very knowledgeable about insurance - might be worth pm'ing him/her.

You don't actually have liability insurance do you?
How do you know who owns sally's car?

JQ.

mikey72 wrote: »

How do you know who owns sally's car?

I read the whole thread.

Pernicious wrote: »

I don't think the company has any company cars, the car that was damaged was Sally's own.