Here`s the thing......

DervProf

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

The reason so many are locked out of the housing market is not the prices. It's the exorbitant deposit requirements, and rationing of mortgages.

And the reason that deposit requirements are so high ?

Are the banks concerned about the risk of falling prices ?

If the banks turn on the money taps, won`t that bring back HPI ?

Will the return of HPI be good for the UK economy ?

Are you wanting lower deposits AND low interest rates at this moment ?

As you said "The next generation can want anything they like. It doesn't mean they'll get it."

THE_GHOULISH_CODPIECE

More like good riddance.

StevieJ

DervProf wrote: »

We see Hamish, Sibley and the like celebrating any rise in house prices (which has been a little less often in recent months). They clearly want house prices to rise, and will even mock those who predicted that they may fall. Increased demand/shortage of supply is often cited as being a big factor in the reasons for HPI. I get the impression that if house prices were to continue to rise, due to increase in population and insufficient new house building, Hamish and Sibley will keep "giving it large" as they currently do.

At what point does their celebration of HPI become in bad taste ? I mean, if property shortgage continues to worsen, and people have to start living in tents or very poor conditions, will Hamish & chums finally see that what they have been celebrating is in fact leading to many people having to tolerate poor living conditions ? Or will they just sit there in their comfortable four walls, and just say "tough, you should have invested wisely like wot we did" ?

My thoughts are that they are already exhibiting a very selfish and short sighted attitude, and they would no doubt disagree. But if property shortage worsens, and starts to have really serious consequences for more and more people living in the UK, what will people`s opinion be of those who say HPI = good ?

You really don't get it do you? you and and your ilk are merely opposite sides of the same coin, in fact this forum is becoming HPC by proxy :eek:

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

DervProf wrote: »

And the reason that deposit requirements are so high ?

Because it's an effective way for the banks to ration a limited pool of funding.

Are the banks concerned about the risk of falling prices ?

They should be. If prices fall significantly they'll need another bailout.

If the banks turn on the money taps, won`t that bring back HPI ?

When they do, then yes it will. But HPI will happen eventually anyway. Mortgage restrictions do not prevent HPI, they merely delay it.

Regardless, they can't turn on the money taps at the moment, because they don't have access to enough money.

Will the return of HPI be good for the UK economy ?

Yes.

Are you wanting lower deposits AND low interest rates at this moment ?

What I want is of no relevance.

The return of competition to the market when funding levels increase will eventually drive down deposit requirements.

And only then will FTB's be able to buy again in any numbers. Although it may be too late for some.

As you said "The next generation can want anything they like. It doesn't mean they'll get it."

Very true.

But as lower deposits are the only way much of the younger generation will ever be able to buy a house, you should rather hope they come down before prices rise out of reach for even more FTB's.

the.ciscokid

Ingrained in the British psyche is the idea that HPI is a good thing, when actually the inverse is true. House price increases (which is a effect of debt increase) is very bad for your average home owner and the wider economy. The only people who benefit from increasing property prices are speculators (and I include bankers in that categorization).

The mental leap and societal change required to get the "Location Location Location Generation" suckered in by incredibly powerful VI, starting right at the top with MP flippers (who were supposed to be looking out for the wider interests of the economy, rather than lining their own pockets with tax payers money, and their second homes) and their lack of financial regulation has been, and will be ruinous I am afraid.

We can see the destruction of massive increases in debt during the last decade all around the western world, as wealth was transferred from the have nots to the haves. The sad thing is, the have nots were (and still are) bailing out the haves as the economy takes a turn for the worst.

I am afraid the real "GHOULS" are those who cheer HPI, pulling up the ladder behind them, leaving the next generation to pick up the tab. Either they don't realise the wider societal impact, or don't care - I hope for the former, but fear the latter is true in some cases.

I

System

Just a little protip Derv, ` isn't an apostrophe, you want a '.

bendix

Malcolm. wrote: »

Shacks in a third world slums don't have internet access.

Actually, yes they do.

bendix

Sibley wrote: »

No, I have a nice little semi in Loose Valley just outside of Maidstone. Share another town house with my sister (no mortgage).

Live in a really nice house in Bangkok 3 bedroom detatched. I'm typing this from a 5* hotel in Singapore where I'm working this week. If you consider this slum living I take my hat off to you. You are richer than me.


Now the killer blow for you.

I'm going to buy a house in Thailand next year. Brand new I expect. Probably 3-4 bedroom detatched on a new estate. I bet that will go down well with Gloomy.:rotfl:




As it goes you are not the type I really dislike on here. I know where you are coming from.

It's not my fault the UK is a bad place to live though. I don't make the rules.

You know what, Sibley? I'm warming to you. You take the abuse you get on here with good grace, and I can't fault you for that.

Interesting story re how you got on the property ladder too.

Graham_Devon

Joeskeppi wrote: »

I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure they only have ill feelings for those who hoped to see all homeowners plunged into negative equity as some kind of punishment for having a mortgage. And the kind of people who use the phrase "BTL scum" etc.

You are wrong.

I feel it used to be mainly about that, but recently the fact that rent is rising for everyone is getting some pretty exciteable.

The rent part of my deal went up £9 a month. I'm a charitable kind of person, so he can add that one to the spank bank.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Graham_Devon wrote: »

the fact that rent is rising for everyone.

Just illustrates the point that rising house prices are purely a function of supply and demand, and the massive and worsening housing shortage in this country is an ongoing problem.

And when demand is artificially constrained in the sales market by mortgage rationing, then rising rents are inevitable.

The typical bear worldview (and yes, there are some exceptions) is that there is no housing shortage, the cause of high prices is a credit bubble/BTL/Speculation, the cause of high rents is benefits, etc etc etc.

Whereas in reality, the absolutely dominant factor in UK house/rent prices is the fact that we have a massive housing shortage and it's getting worse by the month.

Temporary swings of supply between rented and owner-occupied can mask the problem for a while, but it's ultimately going to lead to big increases in price for houses and rent and there's no getting away from that fact.