PCN issued

dantimp

I received a PCN yesterday, I was parked on double yellow lines however there was a sign in the area saying Mon-Sat 8am to 6pm which lead me to believe that I could park there. Bear in mind this was a Sunday. I now know that the sign should not be there. Below is the email I have drafted which has more info:-

I received the above parking ticket on 28/11/2010 but I believe the ticket was wrongly issued and I would like to submit an appeal for the following reasons:

· The area where I was parked on Forest Street was on double yellow lines, which had signage showing time restriction Mon-Sat 8am to 6pm. I was parked within this area on a Sunday, afternoon, therefore out of the restrictive times however was issued with a ticket,

· Please see attached “Photo 1” showing my vehicle (Blue Astra) parked to the right of the time restriction sign with an arrow pointing to the area where I was parked. Further to this please find attached “Photo 2” which shows an arrow in the other direction approximately 6 car lengths away. This indicates a specified area with the above parking time restrictions.

· Once leaving the area I saw a parking warden, and stopped to ask for advice. He stated that he was the person who had issued the ticket, and informed me that the zone was “Confusing to the average motorist.” He went on to say that the signage was still present from when there was a single yellow line and the sign had not been removed since inserting the double yellow lines. He also told me to appeal the ticket.

· I now understand that double yellow line areas should either, not have any sign in the area, or an “At Any Time” sign, this would then be clear that the double yellow line are in force 24hrs a day 7 days a week, however having the signs with Mon-Sat 8am to 6pm made be believe that I could park there when I did. If the time restriction sign was not there then I would have known that the double yellow lines were in force at the time of parking and would have not parked there.

From the above information and evidence and considering the Civil Enforcement Officer who issued my ticket told me to make sure I contest the ticket. Also with the amount of other vehicles parked in the same area at the same time suggests that the parking areas is very confusing and incorrectly identified I believe that the ticket was issued under unfair conditions, and would request that the PCN is cancelled.

What do you think? Do you Reckon I have a chance??

Thanks
Dan

Orford

dantimp wrote: »

Do you Reckon I have a chance??

Yes, the council will probably reject your appeal, and likely the NTO formal appeal too, (they often do this as a form of brinkmanship/bluff) but you would stand a very good chance at adjudication on the basis of the confusing signs. The TRO governing that road will almost certainly be at odds with the existing signage and markings.

McKneff

Didnt you think at the time when you parked there that it was confusing.

Signs say one thing
Double yellows actually mean no parking at any time. As far as I know thats what double yellows mean anyway.

Confused - dont park there just in case.

esmerobbo

You can get signs on double yellows but it is normally seasonal, like Holiday resorts where they run from May to Oct. However DYL normally mean no never governor!! I do think its worth a punt because of the confusing sign, nothing to lose!

Orford

The TRO could be crucial here. If it hasn't been amended then it will only mention a SYL. If it has been amended with the DYL, then it won't mention the timeplates. Either way the TRO will not reflect what is actually there.

taffy056

Make sure you take lots of images of the sign and the street, the council may take it down and you then have no appeal point, also as mentioned get the order for the road.

dantimp

Orford wrote: »

The TRO could be crucial here. If it hasn't been amended then it will only mention a SYL. If it has been amended with the DYL, then it won't mention the timeplates. Either way the TRO will not reflect what is actually there.

Sorry can you explain what the TRO, SYL and DYL are?
Thanks

Orford

TRO - Traffic Regulation Order - this is a legal document which sets out local traffic law, requiring road users to obey certain conditions such as one-way systems, parking restrictions, etc. You can obtain a TRO for any road, simply by contacting the council and asking. Some councils even have them available on their websites

SYL/DYL - Single/Double Yellow Line

Coupon-mad

dantimp wrote: »

I received a PCN yesterday, I was parked on double yellow lines however there was a sign in the area saying Mon-Sat 8am to 6pm which lead me to believe that I could park there. Bear in mind this was a Sunday. I now know that the sign should not be there. Below is the email I have drafted which has more info:-

I received the above parking ticket on 28/11/2010 but I believe the ticket was wrongly issued and I would like to submit an appeal for the following reasons:

· The area where I was parked on Forest Street was on double yellow lines, which had signage showing time restriction Mon-Sat 8am to 6pm. I was parked within this area on a Sunday, afternoon, therefore out of the restrictive times however was issued with a ticket,

· Please see attached “Photo 1” showing my vehicle (Blue Astra) parked to the right of the time restriction sign with an arrow pointing to the area where I was parked. Further to this please find attached “Photo 2” which shows an arrow in the other direction approximately 6 car lengths away. This indicates a specified area with the above parking time restrictions.

· Once leaving the area I saw a parking warden, and stopped to ask for advice. He stated that he was the person who had issued the ticket, and informed me that the zone was “Confusing to the average motorist.” He went on to say that the signage was still present from when there was a single yellow line and the sign had not been removed since inserting the double yellow lines. He also told me to appeal the ticket.

· I now understand that double yellow line areas should either, not have any sign in the area, or an “At Any Time” sign, this would then be clear that the double yellow line are in force 24hrs a day 7 days a week, however having the signs with Mon-Sat 8am to 6pm made be believe that I could park there when I did. If the time restriction sign was not there then I would have known that the double yellow lines were in force at the time of parking and would have not parked there.

From the above information and evidence and considering the Civil Enforcement Officer who issued my ticket told me to make sure I contest the ticket. Also with the amount of other vehicles parked in the same area at the same time suggests that the parking areas is very confusing and incorrectly identified I believe that the ticket was issued under unfair conditions, and would request that the PCN is cancelled.

What do you think? Do you Reckon I have a chance??

Thanks
Dan

Yes. Always challenge a Council PCN, IMHO, so you doing the right thing but just need more advice about what to say in an appeal to jump the hoops of the next stages in the process. As Orford rightly says, the Council will probably reject your informal appeal but that DOES NOT mean you have not got a case. Of course you have a case, follow it through!

For informed advice, post about your case on pepipoo forums, start a new thread there including a scan or pic of the front and back of the PCN (just blank out car ID and PCN number). Read the FAQs and sticky threads, register and post on here:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=30

After informal appeal and Notice of Rejection comes a Notice to Owner, which is the owner's chance to send formal reps (get pepipoo's advice).

Then if the Council reject those reps it's time to take it to the adjudicator.

The vast majority of cases posted on pepipoo win. Let us know when you do.

HTH

dantimp

Orford wrote: »

The TRO could be crucial here. If it hasn't been amended then it will only mention a SYL. If it has been amended with the DYL, then it won't mention the timeplates. Either way the TRO will not reflect what is actually there.

Thanks for the advise Orford. I have obtained the TRO and it still states SAT - SUN 8am-6pm. Therefore it looks like it has not been amended. I will now include this in my appeal email.

Will let you know how I get on.

Coupon-mad

You will get a rejection I expect so do post on pepipoo if that happens. Do not just go it alone with your formal appeal once you get a Notice to Owner, the stakes are higher then and you will need their advice to win it.

Maybe the Council will just accept your informal appeal but experience says probably not. :mad: