Dla, IB-esa migration, whats the scoop?

disability_brown

Hello, i have been recieving IB since 1998 for mental health problems, in 2008 i started getting Dla, Lrm & Lrc. After recently making a renewal claim, i have just got a letter telling me i am to recieve this benefit for an indefinite period, so far so good..My question is, what happens if you fail the more stringent wca for esa, and end up on jobseekers allowance, will it mean i will lose my Dla, even though it,s an indefinite award, i'm a little confused and more than a little worried, thanks:(

JS477

If you fail to get ESA then you have a month in which to appeal the decision. In theory you shouldn't loose your DLA if you're moved onto JSA because they're two separate benefits, therefore whether your DLA claim is looked at as a result of you moving onto JSA is therefore anyone's guess.

NASA_2

DLA isnt about ability to work so failing the WCA doesnt stop your DLA.

Plenty of people are on high rate of both components and working full-time.

oldestrocker

NASA wrote: »

DLA isnt about ability to work so failing the WCA doesnt stop your DLA.

Plenty of people are on high rate of both components and working full-time.

Yes I agree it shouldn't affect the DLA assessment. But how many times are we seeing the ESA assessment for which someone fails being used in evidence to question the validity of their DLA entitlement.
You only need to read other postings on here and other forums that highlight this unfair action?

The same applies on ESA. You are entitled to work whilst claiming that benefit under the Permitted Work rules. Yet that information is sent to ATOS before they assess you. This would then give rise in their mind that if you can do that - you must be fit for work!
I know this has happened as it was the only way ATOS would have known when they asked a specific question at the assessment and I told them that yes I work within the rules and do voluntary work as well!

Did that information colour their opinion in the report when it was sent to the DM? Was the DM's decision coloured by my admission? I will never know.

I don't know about voluntary work, but would hate to think that this is also passed over to ATOS. To be safe no one should do any work, paid or voluntary whilst on ESA, which goes against the whole idea of trying out work.

To say that information gathered for one benefit is not used to review another is rather naive.

NASA_2

I can see how unreasonable it is to use the fact that someone is working to show that they might be fit for work. Permitted work is an absolute disgrace IMO. People can earn nearly £5000 a year and get a top-up of benefits. Madness.

Its right that failure of the WCA can lead to a review of DLA - as the department is in possession of new information - it remains the case though that failing the WCA does not stop DLA.

And I never said that the information wasnt passed between benefits. Please show where I did that.

Indie_Kid

I'm on LRC, LRM & JSA. I've never had anything from the DWP regarding my DLA claim.

oldestrocker

NASA wrote: »

I can see how unreasonable it is to use the fact that someone is working to show that they might be fit for work. Permitted work is an absolute disgrace IMO. People can earn nearly £5000 a year and get a top-up of benefits. Madness.

In a way I agree with you, but the rules are there for a reason and that info should not be taken into account in any way when making a decision for benefit.
Nor should the fact that voluntary work is undertaken either.

Its right that failure of the WCA can lead to a review of DLA - as the department is in possession of new information - it remains the case though that failing the WCA does not stop DLA.

It may stop the claim if the DLA office having received that new information thought that it cast doubt on the DLA claim itself and decided to review it.

And I never said that the information wasnt passed between benefits. Please show where I did that.

No, I am sorry you didn't mention that at all. What you did say was that failing the WCA does not stop DLA. I expanded on it that to think that it wouldn't is naive.

Way off subject, but I find that someone who claims JSA and actively looks for a job whilst appealing an ESA decision, then 'wins' that appeal will not get the additional elements to top up his JSA, yet if he continues to claim ESA whilst under appeal will get that element!
And I presume that information would find it's way to DLA, if he claimed that he had difficulty walking, but kept that info back from the JC when he applied for JSA.

NASA_2

The WCA can instigate a review, its the review that stops the DLA in some cases, its important to make the distinction though otherwise people will start worrying that everything will stop due to the WCA when that simply isnt the case.

As for someone who claims JSA not getting the backdated payment - they chose to claim that benefit - it defies logic to claim JSA when they could appeal the ESA. and continue with the ESA claim. The numbers affected should be fairly small. Also worth saying that some people would actually benefit financially from being on JSA during the appeal if they also get DLA as the Disability Premium is more than the WRAG would pay. The choice is with the claimant.

Not being able to walk isnt a reason not to claim JSA. I work with two people who are in wheelchairs. The only thing to declare to JSA is something which would stop you working altogether.

oldestrocker

sh1305 wrote: »

I'm on LRC, LRM & JSA. I've never had anything from the DWP regarding my DLA claim.

Maybe that is because you haven't failed a medical for another benefit ie ESA.
If you get chance to have a look at the descriptors that apply for ESA and you will see that if you fail the test, it is very unlikely that DLA will accept that for similar desriptors you are entitled to DLA.

eg If you fail the walking test for ESA, and you are claiming that that is one of the reasons you are receiving DLA for, doubt will arise in your DLA claim.

oldestrocker

NASA wrote: »

The WCA can instigate a review, its the review that stops the DLA in some cases, its important to make the distinction though otherwise people will start worrying that everything will stop due to the WCA when that simply isnt the case.

As for someone who claims JSA not getting the backdated payment - they chose to claim that benefit - it defies logic to claim JSA when they could appeal the ESA. and continue with the ESA claim. The numbers affected should be fairly small. Also worth saying that some people would actually benefit financially from being on JSA during the appeal if they also get DLA as the Disability Premium is more than the WRAG would pay. The choice is with the claimant.

Not being able to walk isnt a reason not to claim JSA. I work with two people who are in wheelchairs. The only thing to declare to JSA is something which would stop you working altogether.

Thanks you make a lot of sense.
Yes failing the WCA can instigate a review of their DLA entitlement.

Once again, the numbers of people that claim JSA after failing the ESA assessment isn't counted in 10's. Again look at the many on this and other sites that religiously follow the advice given out by the DWP within the 'failure letter' They believe that that is the way forward!!
I actually fell into the same trap myself, until some kind hearted woman in the JC said that she couldn't accept that I was fit for work. The JSA claim form was filed away and she completed a new ESA1 and fast tracked it for me. Now I am fairly intelligent, but the letter to me seemed to say that I had to claim JSA!!

The Disability Premium didn't come into the equation for me as it was a contribution based claim. But I take your point as regards the difference in benefit levels.

When I mentioned walking it was just an example. Of course it wouldn't stop someone working. But to some claimants, they withold the info that they claimed ESA for believing that if it became knowledge, the JSA claim would cease leaving them with nothing!
I kept to myself what was wrong with me, and acted out that I was fit for work as I saw the problems if I admitted to my conditions. It was only because of what the lady in the JC saw that she questioned me closely to find out the true extent. I never knew that I could carry on getting ESA whilst appealing.
To me that was illogical - how could I be paid ESA when I had failed the medical! You are either ill or not!!

As regards DLA, I feel that it is commonly accepted by most that to fail the ESA assessment WILL mean a review of the DLA entitlement. For that reason I failed to show on my ESA50 anything to do with my mental illness as that is what I get DLA for. I didn't want to run the risk of it being said that I didn't have a sufficient mental illness to qualify for ESA AND then run the risk of a review of my DLA.

There is a lot of disinformation about - but there is also a lot of fear of losing what you have already!

disability_brown

Thanks to everyone, for taking the time to respond to my question:T