Early-retirement wannabe

uk1

Marine_life wrote: »

Some interesting points being discussed on the thread.

I believe you're talking about the law of 'diminishing marginal utility' (which appeals to me as an economist ). that is the additional value derived declines as we consume more (think cars or houses) and can even become negative (think Mars bars). But there's more to it than simply consumption, it about what I would call the 'effort to achieve'. Which means that if you have to scrimp and save to buy something (and I am not just talking paying the rent or putting food on the table) then there will be far more satisfaction ('utility') than if it's easy to come by. Essentially combining thre laws of utility and scarcity.

Its probably why we so often hear of lottery winners being unhappy.

I think that is part of it but people do often work so hard to acquire their wealth that logically each new bigger thing they feel insufficiently thrills. I have observed that prior to being successful many I know who have done so have felt that before they had, that if they were to become extremely financially successful then they will be fulfilled and happy. They see it pretty much as black and white. In the process of achieving it they often sacrifice important things such as health, friendships and time with those they should have with the wisdom of hindisght spent much more time with. Then when they "succeed" they discover that the excess of cash in fact doesn't change their inherent discontedness to happiness because when you buy something big and expesnive most of the joy is in the moments it is newly acquired and wains pretty quickly afterwards. In short cash didn't make them as happier as they thought it would. But they are left yearning for either the health they lost or the relationships they sacrificed. And new friendships are difficult or impossible because there is a constant suspicion.

So for example extremely wealthy people might buy a large yacht and are initially extremely excited for a while but then they start to grumble about the noisy crew on the boat moored a few feet away, the running costs, how little time they have for it, how people "sponge" off of them etc. They also mourn the relationships and friendships they sacrificed and lost when their lives were simpler and less complex. So the dissatisfaction when achieved is possibly greater than when and if they didn't have it if you get my drift.

The conslusion I reached having had several friends who have become extremely wealthy during the IT boom but seemed unhappy, was that "having enough" and knowing that you have enough is a happier state of happiness than either having too little or counter-intuitively - too much.

atush

and at least I'm doing something for the public good and not just making profits for companies

Making profits for companies is for the public good. Taxes, employment, pension funds.

Having said that, I was a US govt medical researcher. For the public lol. but I never turned my nose up to those working in the private sector.

michaels

uk1 wrote: »

I think that is part of it but people do often work so hard to acquire their wealth that logically each new bigger thing they feel insufficiently thrills. I have observed that prior to being successful many I know who have done so have felt that before they had, that if they were to become extremely financially successful then they will be fulfilled and happy. They see it pretty much as black and white. In the process of achieving it they often sacrifice important things such as health, friendships and time with those they should have with the wisdom of hindisght spent much more time with. Then when they "succeed" they discover that the excess of cash in fact doesn't change their inherent discontedness to happiness because when you buy something big and expesnive most of the joy is in the moments it is newly acquired and wains pretty quickly afterwards. In short cash didn't make them as happier as they thought it would. But they are left yearning for either the health they lost or the relationships they sacrificed. And new friendships are difficult or impossible because there is a constant suspicion.

So for example extremely wealthy people might buy a large yacht and are initially extremely excited for a while but then they start to grumble about the noisy crew on the boat moored a few feet away, the running costs, how little time they have for it, how people "sponge" off of them etc. They also mourn the relationships and friendships they sacrificed and lost when their lives were simpler and less complex. So the dissatisfaction when achieved is possibly greater than when and if they didn't have it if you get my drift.

The conslusion I reached having had several friends who have become extremely wealthy during the IT boom but seemed unhappy, was that "having enough" and knowing that you have enough is a happier state of happiness than either having too little or counter-intuitively - too much.

For some people the wealth is about keeping score, always driven not by what they have but by how what they have compares to others - you can recognise these people because they drive German cars, often with personalised number plates.

Then there are people like me who are happy with the simple things and having the time to appreciate them...who are screwd over by their employers who see a 3 day working week as 2 days per week of lost revenue - and marginal revenue at that so probably a 50% mark up. It is proving very hard for me to work only my contracted days

k6chris

Marine_life wrote: »

Its probably why we so often hear of lottery winners being unhappy.

I have successfully managed to avoid this problem for many many years :rotfl:

DairyQueen

Bravepants wrote: »

and at least I'm doing something for the public good and not just making profits for companies and shareholders - although I'm also a shareholder of course, dirty little capitalist scoundrel that I am!

So, we have established that you are a a hypocrite.

Fact 1... those companies, and their shareholders and employees, will be paying for your gold-plated pension.
Fact 2... why do you assume , high-mindedly, that all public sector organisations operate 'in the public good'.

I wish.

For the record...

I am on the receiving end of a biased planning decision. I can either rollover or spend tens of thousands challenging them. If I win, the decision will be quashed and they will have to revisit (big deal) and they will have to pay my costs from the taxpayers' purse. If I lose then I am facing costs of, possibly, £100k. Unfortunately, the taxpayer is not underwriting my costs.

Don't bother mentioning the phrase 'public good' alongside public authorities. Complete b**lshit.

The only priority of any public authority is now the 'M' word. MONEY.

The 'public good'? gales of ironic laughter.

crv1963

happyandcontented wrote: »

I think the freedom that comes with not having to work can make you a better employee! You are not constrained other than by politeness! If they are prepared to isten...which, rarely happens.

I think you're right. I think fear of change forces many to work "for the man" longer than they need to. There's an interesting dynamic in many that makes them feel they need to worry about having enough. Whatever the object "of enough" is, pension funds, savings, cars or make of cars, possessions etc.

I've been up and down the ladder in the public sector, tried the private sector, returned to the public sector. I've been excited, unhappy, disillusioned and content at different stages of my career. I've let ambition destroy relationships and I've sacrificed opportunities to let others get on with their careers. We're all human. I've had periods of ill health and stressful events in and out of the workplace.

If I've learned anything it is change is the only constant state we live in, that there are sharks in every team/ branch and you just have to walk the line doing your best to do no harm to someone else.

A manager I worked for had a great saying "always be nice to everyone as your climbing the greasy pole- you never know when your coming down it". I adopted this approach and have found my climbing up and sliding down much more manageable in my personal contentedness.

I've identified what I think my enough is and my point of quoting happyandcontented is I've found this week at work that having now reached the point I can take my pension even though I haven't reached my enough point, work is really enjoyable. If I get to the point it's making me miserable I can give three months notice, take my pension and move on to doing something different until I do reach my personal enough point.

JoeEngland

OldMusicGuy wrote: »

I could have told you that I learned that within a few years of being in the corporate world. The problem with the corporate world (like the public sector world as well from what I have seen) is that it is full of people. While there are many good people, there are also plenty that are not so good, and the corporate world can encourage their bad behaviours.


It's easy to think that big employers "care" for you. They do as long as it helps their profitability and ability to please shareholders. But even well-paid people in the corporate world are still wage slaves and they shouldn't forget it. Only the ones at the very top (ie the exec team) are not slaves. They will get paid off for failure. 40 years a wage slave, me......

You are not a mercenary, I think you are being realistic. The company will carry on without you quite happily once you are gone. So best of luck for the future. Personally, I am loving not being a wage slave.

Work is a business relationship: the employer pays you for your labour. No matter how good an employer is it's best not to lose sight of that.

tigerspill

michaels wrote: »

For some people the wealth is about keeping score, always driven not by what they have but by how what they have compares to others - you can recognise these people because they drive German cars, often with personalised number plates.

Then there are people like me who are happy with the simple things and having the time to appreciate them...who are screwd over by their employers who see a 3 day working week as 2 days per week of lost revenue - and marginal revenue at that so probably a 50% mark up. It is proving very hard for me to work only my contracted days

Pretty judgemental on those with german cars and nice number plates.

Utter rubbish. Maybe you are not as happy as you say - a bit of inverted snobbery coming through in your post.

uk1

michaels wrote: »

For some people the wealth is about keeping score, always driven not by what they have but by how what they have compares to others - you can recognise these people because they drive German cars, often with personalised number plates.

Then there are people like me who are happy with the simple things and having the time to appreciate them...who are screwd over by their employers who see a 3 day working week as 2 days per week of lost revenue - and marginal revenue at that so probably a 50% mark up. It is proving very hard for me to work only my contracted days

As it happens I have an extremely expensive German car with personalised number plates which my wife told me to buy as the only major self-indulgent reward for taking the risky and stressful decision to leave the safety of a decent salary to specutively start what turned out to be a succesful business. I am certainly not keeping any score of anything. When you leave a salary and have a family who are relying on you and start a business you cannot countenance the luxury of failing. It wasn't an option. In fact the business was profitable in month 2.

I don't have a competitive bone in my body so was driven not by any competerive drive. In fact it was the lack of a competitive drive that I think made me feel I wasn't suited to corporate life. I also felt that I was unemployable and was simply bored and hated not being in control of my destiny and wanted a more secure and better funded and more certain future doing interesting work with clients I chose and liked. My wife felt the previous job was killing me and that starting a business would be less stressful. I knew it was the right decision to leave when all my colleagues told me I would fail as I was starting a business that would be providing a service that had so far never been offered and their take was that as no one else was doing it, this proved that there was no market and my take was that there was a clear market with no competition.

Our criteria for success was to be able to gain some specific clients I wanted to work with and make enough cash to retire extremely early and comfortably. When we started I told my wife if we failed the worst that would happen is that we would live in a mobile home until I found a job and started again. In fact as soon as we had saved enough to retire early well - it took 15 years - we stopped.

Not everyone who has a German car (or as wifey a Swedish one ...) with personalised number plates is competitive and unhappy. .

kidmugsy

Once upon a time German cars were better built than the alternatives.

But the reliability tables have for years told a different tale.