No success with submitting to saynoto0870

edda

I use the saynoto0870 website whenever I have an 0870 number as it can save me money - but only if the number is listed.

In an effort to repay a useful site, I submitted several numbers a few weeks ago - and now I find some earlier ones have been removed!

E.g. when House of Fraser took over James Beatties (who have about 10 or 12 stores, mainly in the Midlands), they did the dirty and changed all the 01... numbers to 0870

I noticed saynoto0870 only had about 3 of the stores listed and - as I knew about 6 or 7 other numbers - submitted them for future inclusion. (I know they have to check them out, but they work, as I rang several that day to find an item I particularly wanted).

Anyway, to cut an already long tale short, there are no Beatties numbers shown on the website now - even the ones that were there before! :mad:

Is this a conspiracy to wear us down - 'cos I'm not happy.

Heinz

In www.SayNoTo0870.com's unverified list, there are:

House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072832 01283 515515 Burton upon Trent
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072836 0121 7058111 Solihull
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072837 0121 3556123 Sutton Coldfield
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072840 01905 723456 Worcester
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072831 0151 6476642 Birkenhead
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072833 01384 459922 Dudley
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072834 01484 468500 Huddersfield
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072835 01604 621111 Northampton
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072838 01952 297700 Telford
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072839 01902 422311 Wolverhampton
House of Fraser (Beatties) 0870 6072830 01296 399996 Aylesbury

Are those the ones you mean?

Unfortunately, there appears to be no procedure (or even any real effort) on that site to check/verify/transfer entries in the Unverified List to the Verified List (or, as you discovered, even to simply amalgamate them so that a single search would find all possibles).

Indeed (and even more regrettably), there has also been some discord recently and some senior members appear to have resigned following allegations that posts critical of the site owner were deleted.

bbb_uk

Heinz wrote:

...even to simply amalgamate them so that a single search would find all possibles..

Daniel, the site owner, has been working on this with also the possibility of having a rating system so users can either rate good/bad if a number is valid or not. Unfortunately, the rating system isn't working as planned so Daniel has decided in the interim to hopefully go live with a 'single' search which would list both the databases and you can tell the difference between what is verified and what remains unverified.

Heinz wrote:

...there appears to be no procedure (or even any real effort) on that site to check/verify/transfer entries in the Unverified List to the Verified List

Checking of unverified entries isn't as straight forward as it seems, there are some things to take into consideration and they are:-

• The unverified database has suffered from a lot of spam and this has increased lately.
  
• We all do this in our spare time so sometimes after work, we may just be too tired, etc
  
• As its done in our spare time, it sometimes means when we dial these numbers to check they're valid (not a spam, joke, etc) then there may not always be an answer if the company is only open say office-type hours and doesn't have an answerphone or some other descriptive answer.
• We obviously can only check numbers at such times as its included in any inclusive tariffs we have otherwise we would get charged. This could mean anytime, evening & weekends only, or just weekends.
  
• We also have to check that an entry in the unverified database isn't already listed in the unverified database which sometimes there can be duplicate entries
  
• We also have to check that an entry isn't already listed in the verified database and was overlooked before it was submitted into the unverified database.
  
• We also have to check the 084x/087x number is correct and we do this via googling, company website, etc. Due to the costs of these numbers we can't just ring up these 084x/087x numbers to verify they're correct hence why we google, etc.

Heinz wrote:

Indeed (and even more regrettably), there has also been some discord recently and some senior members appear to have resigned following allegations that posts critical of the site owner were deleted.

There has been one member that has made personal attacks and libellous comments against the site, the owner, the mods (me included obviously) and other forum members including newbies that didn't agree with that member. Such personal attacks, etc will not be tolerated on SayNo just as it's not tolerated on here or most (if not all) other forums. The member in question has been warned many, many times in the past but to no avail. This member, in the past, has been warned about the attacks he made about this site and his posts on this site and the personal attacks against MSE Martin himself. At the time, this member was warned by MSE Martin that if he continued he would be banned here.

orsonkart_2

I was one of a number of members that left or decided not to contribute to site any further.
The main reasons i left were the deleting of posts without any apparent reason,and the complete lack of interest in the site by its owner,it appeared to me that he was now only interested in its commercial potential.

I would point i was not the member who bbb_uk refers to in previous post.

edda

Thanks for this - but I still don't understand how numbers can move from the verified to the unverified list.

Edinburghlass_2

Thank you for your explainations bbb_uk and to Heinz for the numbers.

However, MSE is not the place to be discussing the whys and wherefores of how another site operates nor its members. Likewise saynoto0870 will not welcome posts against MSE on their website. We have many shared members and Martin has always been proud of his connection and the interaction by MSE users with saynoto0870.

I'll leave this thread open just now but it will be closed if the thread attracts more posts regarding the personel and the running of saynoto0870.

bbb_uk

edda wrote:

Thanks for this - but I still don't understand how numbers can move from the verified to the unverified list.

Hi edda,

I should explain that when a number is added by anyone such as yourself they are actually added to the unverified database first this is so we can check them. The unverified database is kept separate from the actual normal verified database.

Numbers would not have been moved from the verified database (ie already checked) to the unverified database (awaiting to be checked) unless after they were checked a member reported that those normal geographical numbers no longer worked but even if this was the case they would have been deleted.

I think the confusion is that the number isn't automatically added to the main database and is actually held in the unverified database until checked. I will, however, check these numbers myself later today, and move them to the verified (proper) database.

Sorry for any confusion.

bbb_uk

orsonkart wrote:

I would point i was not the member who bbb_uk refers to in previous post.

I didn't mean to imply you were or anyone specific but for obvious reasons I can't mention the forum member.

The main reasons i left were the deleting of posts without any apparent reason

This was explained in my reply to Heinz

and the complete lack of interest in the site by its owner,it appeared to me that he was now only interested in its commercial potential.

Daniel is working on a lot of the behind-the-scenes stuff like upgrading search facilities, trying to stop/slow down spam entries, checking of numbers, etc, etc. The specific forum member I'm referring to is aware of this as last week I was talking to the specific forum member over the telephone to try and sort this out.

Heinz

Heinz wrote:

Unfortunately, there appears to be no ..... real effort ..... even to simply amalgamate them so that a single search would find all possibles.

bbb_uk wrote:

Daniel, the site owner, has been working on this .....

Good to hear.

I think we all appreciate that the size of the databases on that site means that keeping entries up to date is a nightmare (particularly with firms like Sky taking a proactive approach and regularly trawling through and de-activating 0800 and geographical numbers found by members).

The simple expedient of amalgamating the unverified and verified lists (with red text indicating 'unverified' and/or a 'date last verified' column?) - suggested by me and at least one other member some 2 years ago - would, IMHO, greatly assist those searching. I look forward to that happeniing in the near future.

BTW, I wasn't the one to have his posts deleted either.

Chaufeurse1956

Is anybody else experiencing problems when trying to get to saynoto0870. When I enter it into my browser it either takes me to the AOL search page or it brings up the main page and then takes me to the AOL search page when I click to find an alternative number. Is this just me? Is it an AOL thing?

I also entered a legit number that has not appeared - it was the 01388 number for the Black and Decker factory shop in Spennymoor here in County Durham. It took me ages to track it down but sayno have not listed it for some reason - either that or I am looking in the wrong place!

Any suggestions please .

Chris

Heinz

Chaufeurse1956 wrote:

Is anybody else experiencing problems when trying to get to saynoto0870. When I enter it into my browser it either takes me to the AOL search page or it brings up the main page and then takes me to the AOL search page when I click to find an alternative number. Is this just me? Is it an AOL thing?

I also entered a legit number that has not appeared - it was the 01388 number for the Black and Decker factory shop in Spennymoor here in County Durham. It took me ages to track it down but sayno have not listed it for some reason - either that or I am looking in the wrong place!

Any suggestions please .

Chris

And, with that post, you have again demonstrated the problem with the Unverified database on the site.

Your entry is there - it just doesn't show up if you search using the normal search facility.

However, if you search by clicking on the 'List Unverified Entries' button and scroll down to the second alphabetical list (for some reason, there's an alphabetical list which goes from Abbey to Woolworth and then another list starts at .TM), you'll find it, as I did.

That's assuming, of course, that your entry is:

Black & Decker Outlet 0870 7521270 01388 422429 Spennymoor Outlet Shop; Store sells most B&D and Dewalt tools