Abbey/Santander

baggsy

blueberrypie wrote: »

It does work that way for very basic debit cards, such as the one my 11-year-old has. He can't make purchases without electronic authorisation. Such a card means the user can't ever go overdrawn, but it also means it can't be used at the hand-held machines on trains, at pay-at-pump petrol stations - or for on-line shopping with some retailers, including grocery. And no cheques either, of course.

This is exactly the card I want but as I'm an adult I can't find one anywhere.

It doesn't actually bother me that I can't use it on a train, I don't use a petrol station where you can pay at the pump and I don't buy groceries online. I don't use cheques either.

therealblob

blueberrypie wrote: »

You made those purchases, right?



Those transactions were yours, right?







I think *you* are missing the point. You are expecting the bank to keep track of your spending. That's not what the bank is there for.

You say you are capable of managing your account - but your examples above show that you are relying on the bank to do it for you. If you were managing your own money, those transactions which went through and made you overdrawn would have been no surprise - after all, they are *your* transactions.

Keeping track of your own spending means you *don't* have to keep checking your on-line balance hourly. It means you *don't* have to have any doubt about what is left in an account. It means you know how much you've spent, you know how much is left - and it doesn't matter if a retailer has already presented a payment or not, because you know what your own situation is. And that is the point that people are making: it is your money and it is up to you to manage it. The downside to on-line banking is that some people have become reliant on it to tell them what they can afford, rather than doing what people did years ago, when you got a monthly (or even quarterly) statement: kept track of their own spending.

Even with the best IT system in the world, a bank's "available balance" could only ever guarantee accuracy if *every single transaction* were authorised at the point of sale. That is not how it works (and not how it ever worked with A&L either, by the way - I think your experience there must have just been luck). It does work that way for very basic debit cards, such as the one my 11-year-old has. He can't make purchases without electronic authorisation. Such a card means the user can't ever go overdrawn, but it also means it can't be used at the hand-held machines on trains, at pay-at-pump petrol stations - or for on-line shopping with some retailers, including grocery. And no cheques either, of course.

Spare me the sarcastic asterisk's please. You have completely missed the point or are you questioning the fact's as repeated to me by a member of A&L customer services. If I was lucky then it was 24 months worth of luck with no charges, no hassle and complete customer satisfaction. Was that poor banking by me? NO. Did I get someone run my account for me? NO. I found a bank that was efficient, well run where I could keep full control of my purchases either online or through telephone banking.

The point I was trying to make before your lecture began was that now A&L have been taken over by Santander, their procedures would seem to be reverting to Abbey's old ones which could create problems for others. (If you had read posts by jen245, tellme its friday and vinh1000 then you would see it's not just an isolated incident or as a result of poor management of a bank account)

AnonymousForObviousReason

Ultimately I don't want to change my account again as I had got used to A & L and was very happy with them but I am very fearful for myself and anyone else who might fall into this trap.

Seriously? You're fearful? Quit being scared, whiny and clinging to the past just move to another bank, Nothing will change unless there is another takeover. Please check out the following to find another bank:
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/banking/?tab=8&dd
(Hint don't bother with FD they have a strict criteria over who is accepted, including "Account Management".)

therealblob wrote: »

If you had read posts by jen245, tellme its friday and vinh1000 then you would see it's not just an isolated incident or as a result of poor management of a bank account)

"Did you read the posts?"

vinh1000 - goes into little details and yes does agree with you. - "congratulations"

Jen245 Stated that 'While I agree with the above posts about not relying on the balances'. Then says the balances have been unreliable saying that payments she didn't make appeared and disappeared and/or she was being double charged. None of which you claimed.

tellmeitsfriday - was telling you to keep a spreadsheet because it's your responsibility, you even argued with them saying 'I think you fail to see the point.'

Finally I suspect the "sarcastic asterisk's", were for *emphasis* - sarcasm would look more like "speech marks" (see some of my statements above)... but like you I could be very wrong and "missing the point".

Rgds
Anon

BLT_2

tellmeitsfriday wrote: »

Exactly - you mustn't rely on the bank to sort out your budgeting.

That's what your spreadsheet is for... Make a list, keep a running total. If it's the same as your bank statement figure great, if not you know there are a few more things to debit.

e.g. I know my bank balance is £75 out because I went to Sainsburys yesterday. If I spent that £75 again and came on here moaning I'd be charged, I suspect I would be laughed at.

Keep a list, a spending diary - you're more likely to be accurate than the bank.... is what I am trying to say x

I wrote a cheque for the balance of my account today to a charming young lady in Soho for services rendered.

I just checked my bank account and I still have loads of money, that means I can go for a repeat performance tonight :rotfl:

Giggity giggity

zax47

I think the main point that people are trying to make to the OP is that that YOU know what you spent, so YOU account for it. The bank will account for it when THEY know about it - they aren't psychic.

I've been with Abbey/Santander for years, you get two balance figures- Account balance and Available balance. I've found the Available balance to be pretty accurate, subject to any cheques I've written being presented. If the two figures are the same then you know there's nothing pending, yet to be debited (or paid in cheques awaiting to be credited/cleared). It can't possibly allow for transactions, not requiring authorisation, not yet presented to the bank by the retailer - that's where YOU knowing what YOU spent matters.

OP Stop being a lazy sod and keep track of your finances properly! Especially if you're living so close to being skint all the time. It's your problem, not the banks.

the_seraphim

ok ok guys, chillax!

lets see if i can reconcile your differences with my own insight and my own story.

1st. I thought every transaction had to be authorised by the bank, if not how the hell is that supposed to work... seriously i did not know, nor is it made obvious that some transactions (debit card that is, i know cheques dont count, how could they until they are sent to be processed) might not be authorised immediately.

2nd. I have been declined by some of those hand held thingy wotsits, chip and pin things... so who did the declining if not the bank!

3rd. Customers should be offered upon request a card that will not authorise transactions without online contact with the bank, some people dont have iron clad memories for figures, nor do they have time to make a spreadsheet. and i never heard my bank recommend that i keep a spending diary... i thought they were supposed to help you...

4th. sometimes bank staff dont know the above 3! for example, and this is my story, my wife bought something for £20 on the 5th after i transferred £20 into her account online, the card was authorised by the machine (online so she thought) 2 days later i transfer another £20 to purchase something else, she does so, the transaction shows in her available balance (different shop but that shouldnt be important) on the 10th i transfer £30 to purchase something, and she checks her balance to make sure. there is £50 in the ledger balance, and £50 in the available balance. she calls me to query and i say "i only put £30 in, go check with the bank, do you remember buying anything" she says "im not sure" my advice was to check with the card issuer, so she did, and the staff memeber from HSBC bank advised the following verbatim when you use your card the bank should show it as a pending transaction therefore the money would not be in the available balance" apparantly not as the shop presented the £20 purchase to the bank that afternoon thus leaving her £20 overdrawn.

now there will be no charge for this as she asked a member of staff who advised her it was ok therefore its the banks screwup... and now she will keep better check of her spending history so this doesnt happen again but its easy to see who is to blame...

the banks... for failing to properly advise people on the nature of debit card transactions

the shops for being irrisponsible with their processing delays... i mean 5 days to present wth!

the card processing companies for their delays.

and after the first time this happens, and you become informed as to the possibility you should keep track. 'the first ones free' if you will

so stop arguing OP, you are wrong in this, but dont accept the bank charges... no one told you that some transactions occur without online authorisation and its not obvious, but i would blame you if it happened more than once as its your responsibility to check up on these things... if something unsuspected occurs with your finances you should check.

boo_star

the_seraphim wrote: »

thought they were..

now there will be no charge for this as she asked a member of staff who advised her it was ok therefore its the banks screwup... and now she will keep better check of her spending history so this doesnt happen again but its easy to see who is to

What are the odds it goes through twice? Any takers?