Council Tax Cost Cutting: reduce your band and grab any discounts Discussion Area

Leodogger

lincroft1710 wrote: »

It matters not, the size, type or age, or their value in 2011/2. I'll repeat it yet again and this time you may understand, it is what a dwelling would have sold for on 1 April 1991 that matters and the 1990 sale price of these bungalows seems to indicate a value at that date in excess of £52K, and therefore Band C.

I'm not an authorised spokesman for the VOA, so I am not obligated to explain why different properties are in the same band. I worked for them for 35 years, the last 12 of which were spent settling CT bands, so I offer advice, suggestions, insight into the thought processes behind CT banding and share my knowledge of certain aspects of CT law.

I have already offered a possible explanation, another is that the houses are in too low a band. If you want the actual reason ask the VOA.

You know what ? I don't think I can be bothered asking them anything as the methodology for tax banding in the first place is completely flawed. I lived in a 3 bed semi, with rear garage, off road parking and private gardens, front and back, big conservatory on the back and 2 living rooms instead of one that I have now. I was in Band B !!!!! :eek: How can you band a property on value, what a stupid idea. So if I had bought a cheapie bungalow that was built with low cost materials or a little terraced low priced townhouse with exactly the same size footprint, I would have been in band A or B. Instead I am an OAP living in a housing association terraced bungalow on a state pension paying £120 per month instead of £98 where I came from before I retired.

This government is off its trolley, all they ever want to do is punish OAP's who have worked and contributed to the tax system for 50 yrs!!!

getsct

JWhite wrote: »

You know what ? I don't think I can be bothered asking them anything as the methodology for tax banding in the first place is completely flawed. I lived in a 3 bed semi, with rear garage, off road parking and private gardens, front and back, big conservatory on the back and 2 living rooms instead of one that I have now. I was in Band B !!!!! :eek: How can you band a property on value, what a stupid idea. So if I had bought a cheapie bungalow that was built with low cost materials or a little terraced low priced townhouse with exactly the same size footprint, I would have been in band A or B. Instead I am an OAP living in a housing association terraced bungalow on a state pension paying £120 per month instead of £98 where I came from before I retired.

This government is off its trolley, all they ever want to do is punish OAP's who have worked and contributed to the tax system for 50 yrs!!!

IF your previous property had been extended or improved by yourself after you bought it. The band would not change until the property was sold on. Thats how you can have a large house in a low band until it is then sold, then the VOA recheck and increase its band if thats what is required. The following occupier would then be able to appeal against that increase if they wished. The system is based on the open market value of a property on 1st April 1991. This is not out of choice as its the law until there is a revaluation. There was meant to be one back in 2007 but the england reval was cancelled by labour and mr david miliband as the goverment thought it would be unpopular at the time. The Welsh assembly vetoed this decision for wales so theres went ahead and they use a list based on 2005 prices.

The current government annouced last year that they will not touch council tax system in england until past the next election in 2015. The system would be fairer if there was a reval every 5 years as what happens currently with the business rates list that the VOA also maintains. Such a change would take an act of parliment to do. The charges are set by your local council not the VOA. If you want a reduction in payments you should ask them.

lincroft1710

Can't improve on what getsct has posted except that Wales CT is based on 2003 values, but came into force in 2005.

The old rating system (which dated back to the 19th century), the current business rating system as well as CT were/are all based on property values. I'm sorry that you can't grasp this idea.

moneyfoolish

I asked for a valuation check some time ago after being alerted by the Moneysavingexpert article. I have a 5-bedroom detached house which we bought in May, 1986 for £85,000. My house was built in the mid-seventies and, unfortunately, all the houses in the street were completely different with different sized gardens. There is, therefore, no way to guage one house relative to another. In fact, the situation is even worse now because most of the houses were bought by property developers in the boom times and have been replaced by smaller houses and flats. I checked and found that my house was the only house in the postcode in Band F. One of my neighbours has a house in Band E and the other in Band D. The house in Band E is the nearest size to mine. In fact, just before the latest property crash, all 3 of us had agreed an option with a developer to sell our houses but the crash meant that the developer did not take up the option. The intersting point was that the developer had offered my neighbour in Band E around £100,000 more than my offer on the basis that they have more land. This was one of the reasons I chose to appeal. In addition, when I used the Nationwide adjuster for my region on my £85,000 house it produced a value of just over £117,000 if I used Q1,1991 and just over £119,000 if I used Q2,1991 which are both below (if only just) the 1991 Band F range of £120,001 to £160,000. I received a letter last week telling me merely that the person who reviewed my case was satisfied that my house was in the correct range and that I could not appeal.

getsct

russell_anderson wrote: »

I asked for a valuation check some time ago after being alerted by the Moneysavingexpert article. I have a 5-bedroom detached house which we bought in May, 1986 for £85,000. My house was built in the mid-seventies and, unfortunately, all the houses in the street were completely different with different sized gardens. There is, therefore, no way to guage one house relative to another. In fact, the situation is even worse now because most of the houses were bought by property developers in the boom times and have been replaced by smaller houses and flats. I checked and found that my house was the only house in the postcode in Band F. One of my neighbours has a house in Band E and the other in Band D. The house in Band E is the nearest size to mine. In fact, just before the latest property crash, all 3 of us had agreed an option with a developer to sell our houses but the crash meant that the developer did not take up the option. The intersting point was that the developer had offered my neighbour in Band E around £100,000 more than my offer on the basis that they have more land. This was one of the reasons I chose to appeal. In addition, when I used the Nationwide adjuster for my region on my £85,000 house it produced a value of just over £117,000 if I used Q1,1991 and just over £119,000 if I used Q2,1991 which are both below (if only just) the 1991 Band F range of £120,001 to £160,000. I received a letter last week telling me merely that the person who reviewed my case was satisfied that my house was in the correct range and that I could not appeal.

This is because the nationwide and all other online calculators do not take into account regional variation which is used to develop the valuations plus comparable sales would also be used for the same area if no houses from that road were on the market on and around the 1st april 1991. We do not advise that people use these calculators as they can produce wrong results. Changes in the housing market since then cannot be taken into account at all. I assume you have had a informal band review which is carried out the same way as an appeal however it does not give you the right to appeal the final decision unlike a valid appeal does. There are very strict criteria that make an appeal valid, being a new taxpayer within the first six months of occupation and any kind of material change in the local area that can affect your properties value like new factories being built next to you for example. The letter you recieved should of stated how they came to there decision. If you wanted another review though they would look at the previous review as part of it which would probably mean it would come to the same decision.

lincroft1710

getsct wrote: »

We do not advise that people use these calculators as they can produce wrong results.

The most inaccurate one I came across whilst in the VOA was undervaluing 1991 prices of certain house types by 25%. Usually it was 10%.

thewad

I've actually gone with moneysavingdirect as I was led to believe, by the guy who visited, that it would cost me money if I lost the appeal.
He mentioned the 50% would go towards specialist solicitors in council tax review claims.
Didn't realise it was free.
Have got the letter saying I am being re banded from the council, and also been told the money will arrive shortly.
I'm seriously !!!!ed off with MSD and am seriously thinking of not paying them.
My next door neighbour got hers 2 weeks ago and has so far refused to pay, still waiting to hear from her about the outcome.
What the legal position....I think it's misrepresentation.

Regards
John :beer:

getsct

thewad wrote: »

I've actually gone with moneysavingdirect as I was led to believe, by the guy who visited, that it would cost me money if I lost the appeal.
He mentioned the 50% would go towards specialist solicitors in council tax review claims.
Didn't realise it was free.
Have got the letter saying I am being re banded from the council, and also been told the money will arrive shortly.
I'm seriously !!!!ed off with MSD and am seriously thinking of not paying them.
My next door neighbour got hers 2 weeks ago and has so far refused to pay, still waiting to hear from her about the outcome.
What the legal position....I think it's misrepresentation.

Regards
John :beer:

Unfortunately when you signed with them its effectively a contract between you and them. This means in the eyes of the law if you refuse to pay them they can take you to court over breach of contract. The VOA has dealt with many cases from moneysavingdirect and other similar companies. We only take a case of theres on if they have got the taxpayer to sign a voa authority to act form that you would have signed when you signed up with them, Without this form we will not process there case as so far as we are concerned they have not got your permission to do so. We would then contact them by letter informing them that we are now dealing with the taxpayer directly and not them.

The VOA have advised on our website about using these agents, we cannot say anything negative against them as we have to remain impartial at all times being a goverment dept.

But if you signed this form when you signed up then legally they are intitled to the share of the refund they are asking for im afraid. Hope this explaination helps.

thewad

Can't recall signing a authorisation form and I've kept all the paperwork they gave me and there's no copy of an authorisation form.

thewad

Would this be a special form from the VOA then or just their own form stating authority to act??