Council Tax Cost Cutting: reduce your band and grab any discounts Discussion Area

vivatifosi

Hi jedeye,

Sounds a bit of a mess!

You're right, the banding is dependent on the home, not the occupant, so should not be relevant that an old lady is there living by herself. It may however be the case that the house has in some way been altered for disabled occupancy as that can result in a different banding. However it may equally be the case that you could cause your elderly neighbour's band to be raised.

If you haven't moved to the block in the last six months and only have a few days to make a claim (in other words you can't be 'out of time' by not doing something now), I would be inclined to try and find out a bit more information from the other residents before making a claim. If the old lady's council tax is being paid by the council as she's on benefits, or you knew that there had been a disabled conversion that had led to a reduced banding, I'd be less concerned than if I caused genuine hardship for an elderly neighbour, and I would want to give that a lot of thought first.

In terms of the multipliers, that's less straightforward. Prices haven't always risen in line and its the 1991 value that is of significance.

There were a huge range of properties in different bands in 1991 and it may well be the case that the one beds were at the very bottom of band B, the large three bed lacks some amenity that you have and therefore was sold for less than the two beds, but still fell in the very top of band B and yours fell in the very bottom of band C. Bear in mind the difference in price could be as little as a few hundred pounds - that's the case where I live.

Good next steps would be to look in the local papers at the library and speak to the neighbours if they were living there then to try and find out why the disparity exists.

Good luck!

vivatifosi

suzialwaysbroke

We challenged our banding as our next door neighbour (identical house) was on band C, & we are band D. We have lived here since 1988, neighbour since 1990, so way outside 6 month time limit. Told today that we will not be moved down, but she may be moved up as that is where the error is, very disappointed, also will have to hide when the council breaks that piece of news to her. Ho hum

Youngy

Youngy wrote: »

This is a little worrying. We followed Martin's info and found 2 neighbours with larger detached properties were in band G. We are a semi in band G, have lived here since prior to 1991. We live in a small village where the houses are all individual. We appealed on the grounds these 2 neighbours are in lower band G (1 of which is a larger new build detached) and have been told no grounds for appeal, have since carried on following it through and this week received a letter from the VTS confirming the appeal is registered, and that they aim to list the appeal for hearing within the next 6 months.

I am hoping these neighbours in lower band, especially the new build which must have been recently banded, are grounds enough for appeal. What other information can I use to support my claim? Seems quite difficult when the neighbours houses are all different. Obviously we are currently in the highest band and stand to make quite a saving/refund so am anxious to aid the process as much as possible.

Thanks for any help you can offer

Well to update my original post. We went to the tribunal in person and explained why we felt were grounds for appeal. The secretary explained we would hear back the outcome.

And today we have received a letter from the VOA saying they have rebanded us down to band G from band H, effective from 1st April 1993

That is great news in itself, but how do we go about requesting a restrospecitve refund from our local council? Is this done automatically? Also will any refund inc back interest. By the current bandings in our council this is a huge saving of £400pa!

Many many thanks to all who have given advice and especially Martin

Maisie

Youngy wrote: »

Well to update my original post. We went to the tribunal in person and explained why we felt were grounds for appeal. The secretary explained we would hear back the outcome.

And today we have received a letter from the VOA saying they have rebanded us down to band G from band H, effective from 1st April 1993

That is great news in itself, but how do we go about requesting a restrospecitve refund from our local council? Is this done automatically? Also will any refund inc back interest. By the current bandings in our council this is a huge saving of £400pa!

Many many thanks to all who have given advice and especially Martin

Youngy. Well done on getting your band changed.
You should get your refund automatically from the council. This will not include interest however. ( See post # 1781 from Keith1956 and look back on previous posts to see how to reclaim interest.)

Glad my original post helped you and many others get your band changed and a refund.

Maisie . OP

saver6

I live in a terrace of 4 houses, me being at one end of it (have been there 4 years). All 4 houses are banded C, yet the two on the ends are small 2-bed houses, and the middle two are larger 3-beds with conservatories. From the outside they all look same size, but the middle two do go back further.

I've checked valuations using the Nationwide calculator, and it does indeed say that the 2 in the middle should be C, and us on the ends as B. I honestly believe that us two on the ends should be B as it seems unfair that us smaller houses are paying the same as larger houses. I have tried checking on other similar houses in the street and they are a mix of Bs and Cs, but I don't know if they have conservatories etc.

Do I have grounds to claim, or is there anything else I can do to build up my case?

losgiganteskid

After I applied to my VOA office I initially received an acknowledgement to my letter.

Having waited 2 months I have now received the following letter:-

Dear Sir or Madam (?)

You asked me to look at the entry in the council tax valuation list for the above property because you believe it should be altered.

I have now completed my review and have taken into account the points you raised. I do not agree that a different valuation band should apply and do not intend to alter the valuation listentry. I am sorry that this is not the outcome you wanted.

To help you understand why I have reached this decision the following explains the basis of council tax, and the impact of the matters you have raised, which I took into account when reviewing the banding of your property.

A council tax band is based on the amount that a property might have fetched if it had been sold on the open market on 1st April 1991. This is the date of valuation applied to all properties for council tax purposes, even if the property hadn't been built at the time. This common date is used to ensure that every property is treated in the same way, giving a fair and consistent approach for everyone. Also for consistency, all properties are assumed to be sold with vacant posession and freehold (other than flats where a 99 yr lease at a nominal rent ia assumed). I am satisfied that the value of your property, reflecting April 1991levels of value, lies within the range £120,000 to £160,000 and that the current band of F is correct.

Levels of value for council tax are based on what a property might have fetched if it had been sold on the open market on a set date: currently 1 April 1991 in England, but the size,layout and character of the property, and the physical state of its locality, are generally assumed to be as they were on 1April 1993, when council tax was introduced. In some circumstance a different date needs to be assumed for these matters, for example when a new property is built or when improvements have to be reflected in the council tax band if a property has sold. But the levels of value are always taken as at April 1991. Taking into account the size, layout and character of your own property, and the physical state of the locality, I am satisfied that the current band is correct.

Your banding is based on evidence of actual sales of similar properties at or around 1 April 1991. I have reviewed this evidence and have also had regard to the bandings of other properties in the area, which have either been agreed with the taxpayer, determined by an independant valuation tribunal or established for a number of years. Property values have changed since the banding came into effect but any increase or decrease in a property's value caused by general fluctuations in the housing market cannot be taken into account for council tax purposes.

I regret that there is no right of appeal against my decision, as you can only appeal to a valuation tribunal if a formal "proposal to alter the valuation list" has been made to me as the VOA,s Listing Officer. The circumstances in which you can make a proposal are limited. The list of circumstances where a formal proposal can be made can be found on the VOA website at www.voa.gov.uk/council_tax/can_i_appeal.htm.

If there are any aspects of this letter that you wish to clarify or you believe you have grounds to make a formal proposal, please contact the Council Tax Enquiry Team on the telephone number at the top of this letter.

Yours sincerley


Can anyone tell me whether this is a bespoke letter which takes into account my personal circumstance (I think not) or whether it is a "standard" type of fob off , making the right noises that due consideration has been given, where actually, the VOA keep you waiting for a reply for 2 months then send this type of standard letter in the hope you will roll over and die.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I do intend following this up - so I will be phoning them as they suggest. What is my next move, and what exactly do I say to them on the phone ??

guppy

Yes, its a standard letter.

No, it shouldn't be a fob off. If they were going to send a fob off letter without considering your case, why would they wait two months?

As you say, best thing to do is phone and ask to speak to the person that dealt with your case.

What to say? Well why do you think the band is wrong? Why do they think it is right?

Good luck

guppy

saver6 wrote: »

Do I have grounds to claim, or is there anything else I can do to build up my case?

You don't need a reason to ask for a review, though it obviously helps your case if you can make a good argument why you are in the wrong band.

The Nationwide is only a rough guide, doesn't really prove much. The best evidence is actual sales from the early 1990s. Some people have used archive newspaper ads from the library, there is loads more info on this thread.

Some people get their band reduced straight away, presumably where there is an obvious error. Others have been rejected and have then faced a long fight requiring a lot of work to build a case on their part. Some have then got a reduction, others not. Best thing is to ask for a review and take it from there.

Good luck

keziah

When we moved here in 1997 the house was in band C. We are in a terrace of 5 3-storey townhouses on an unadopted road. There are only 2 other (smaller) houses in the road and the rest is flats.

The road leading to ours has a terrace of 3 houses like ours. Difference is they are on an adopted road, have double driveways (an extra bit the other side of the pavement) and obviously only 1 is mid-terraced so the others have a side entrance with an extra piece of land.

When the house at the end of our terrace was sold, someone in the next road realised that we were band C and complained to the VA because they were band E. The VA then decided that we should all really be E and put our terrace into D to split the difference. Using the calculator Martin sent today it seems that the original C band was correct. We received the same standard letter as losgigantiskid and they weren't budging. Obviously we don't want to make too much fuss incase they bump us up to E but a house has sold in each of the terraces this month and there was over £20k difference in price between them despite being allegedly identical. We have also had a new housing estate built opposite which has caused an increase in traffic (vehicle and pedestrian) and clearly devalued our homes.

Is it worth taking it up with the VA again do you think?

vivatifosi

Hi keziah,

Did they send you any evidence to show you why they have upped your band? I would at least want to see their data as to why they have done this. I can understand that you don't want to make too much of a fuss as I wouldn't want to go up two bands either, but if they've put you up one band and then want to put you up another that sounds as though it would be a hard action to defend at tribunal as they have a duty to get it right in the first place.

What you really need to establish is what your house was worth in 1991, not from rough calculations but from actual house price sales for the same or similar properties. It is worth asking people who have been in the area for a long time what houses went for then. It would also be good to have a look at house ads in local papers from the time, but this is much harder when there are only a small number of houses involved.

In terms of the new housing estate being built opposite, there is scope within the Council Tax rules to reduce the valuation banding of a property due to a detrimental change in the local surroundings, but you really need to have good evidence of what that change is and how it has affected prices. You can't just say it has devalued your homes, you have to be able to prove it.

Nevertheless, I would certainly be asking questions. Good luck!