Fighting a losing bettle with Landlady AND Letting Agency

MemmaJ

Sorry, this is going to be a bit of a long one..!

I relocated (from one County to another) in August with my twin boys, in order to be nearer to my boyfriend. I had a job secured before I even started looking for houses, as my new employers were willing to wait for me to find a house.

As it happened, I only ended up looking at one house and went with that one! There were many reasons for this, that will become clear as I go on - but it has been nothing but problems from the offset.

Myself and my boyfriend came to look around the house, but were shown around by an Agent from another branch of the Letting Agency, because they were closer. The Landlady is a middle-aged woman, who inherited the house from her father when he died and has subsequently 'refurbished' it and is Letting it out through an Agency. The location is perfect for me, so it was already a winner.
The Agent that showed us around didn't really know anything about the house because "it's not managed by us", but the refurbishment work was all still being undertaken when we looked around.

In the garden, there is a Workshop, a small shed, a Vehicle Inspection Pit and a small brick-built building (around the size of a playhouse) called Tudor Cottage. At the time we looked around, these were all locked, but looking through the windows/gaps, I could see that they were full of junk. I asked the Agent if they were going to be cleared out before the house is rented, and was told that they would be.
This pretty much swayed it for me, as I wanted to use Tudor Cottage as a playhouse for my twins, and my boyfriend wanted to use the workshop and inspection pit for his hobbies (cars and pitbikes!).

A couple of days later, I phoned the letting agency and became frustrated that they weren't able to answer any of my questions because "it's managed by the other branch" - so I gave up and phoned the other branch directly.
I stated that I was very interested in the house, but on the basis that the workshop / pit / Tudor Cottage were all going to be cleared out (without them, it's just another 3 bed semi), so could they please confirm this. They said that yes it would all be done. They even phoned the Landlady particularly with regards to the Pit, who apparently said that she would get her son to do it.
This was around the beginning of July and we were told that the refurbishment work was due to finish in mid-to-end July, but my Tenancy at my old property was not due to end until the 14th August. So I phoned the Agency and asked if the Landlady would be willing to wait to start the Tenancy from the 1st August, and she agreed but only on the basis that I signed a 12 month Tenancy Agreement. I didn't really think about it, but knew that I wouldn't want to move again for a while, so I went ahead and agreed to come in and pay the admin fee on the next working day (which I believe was Monday). Less than an hour later, I had a phonecall back from the Agency saying that someone else is interested and is willing to pay the Admin fee "today" so if I want the house, they need the payment by phone NOW. I panicked and didn't want to lose the house (also because there weren't any others in the location I wanted), so I paid the admin fee by phone using someone else's card (I hadn't been paid yet so I didn't even have it myself!)

So off I went on the 1st August to pick up the keys to my new house, and went straight there to see the finished work in all it's glory.
First thing I noticed was that the Pit, the workshop, and Tudor Cottage had NOT been cleared out. Tudor Cottage was still padlocked up, and pit and workshop were still full of junk. The workshop contained HOARDES of old tools / car parts / general junk (which obviously belonged to her dad), and when we managed to open the pit, THAT was full to the brim with asbestos guttering.

When I looked around the rest of the house, I was really disappointed with the shoddy workmanship and bad finish, but I guess there's nothing that can be done about that once it's done...

I phoned the Agent immediately and asked them why none of it had been cleared, asked them to remove the lock from Tudor Cottage, and also informed them that it was asbestos in the pit - and they said they'd contact the landlady and come back to me.
A couple of days later, I was back at my old house continuing the packing, but I gave my boyfriend the keys to my new house so that he could do a few bits at the new house (build some flatpack furniture etc, before I moved in). One evening he came to the house straight from work, to find the Landlady in it (this was after my Tenancy had started). She had obviously just let herself in, and had come to remove the lock from Tudor Cottage. He briefly spoke to her about the Pit, and she was very 'unbothered' by it, basically saying that it's not dangerous because it's concrete-mix and isn't broken (that may well be the case, but doesn't change the fact it hasn't been cleared). He said that she had a very poor attitude and was very rude, but having never met her myself, I wasn't sure of this.

The Letting Agent basically came back to me and said that the Landlady wants ME to remove the asbestos and put it on the front garden, and she will then arrange to have it collected. I wasn't entirely happy to do this because I didn't know what was UNDER the guttering (there was clearly a lot of stuff in there!), and I have children. So I phoned the local Environmental Health department for advice, asking them if I'm allowed/safe to move it. They wouldn't tell me wether I can or can't move it, without seeing it (but told me not to touch it for now) - so they arranged to come and have a look.

Regarding the workshop, I put my disappointment in 'writing' (via email), asking for a rent reduction for the first month if I'm expected to clear it myself, because I was told it was all going to be done and I should be able to use it as it's part of the property that I'm paying for. I suggested that I get a quote from a clearance company as to the general cost of it, in order to get a figure for the rent reduction and they agreed to this. I got quotes from 2 companies - one of 100 pounds, and one of 300 pounds, so I presented these figures to the Letting Agent. The Landlady refused these figures and offered me a rent reduction of 50 pounds, which I refused, but said that I want her to arrange to have it cleared out as agreed. So it was agreed that it would be cleared out by her Contractor and this was eventually done a couple of weeks later.

Meanwhile, 2 Environmental Health officers came to look at the asbestos in the Pit and said that it is safe to move and can be taken to a Hazardous Waste site - but as it would then be charged by the weight, advised that it's down to the Landlady, not me. They were not very impressed that it had been left in there, but didn't move it around or lift any out, so we still didn't know what was underneath. They asked to look around the rest of the house, as they apparently have to fill in a whole report when they visit a house. They found a couple of other things that they were concerned about - one was that the built-in oven wasn't secured and the whole thing just pulled out, another was an unsealed asbestos waste pipe coming from the back of the toilet in the bathroom, and another was an unsafe boiler expansion pipe coming out of the kitchen wall, into the garden (at shoulder height).

A few days later, one of the Environmetal Health officers hand-delivered me a copy of the letter that they'd sent to the Letting Agent outlining all of their concerns, and stating that it must all be rectified by a certain date (end of Novemeber).

Over the next couple of weeks, the built-in oven and the boiler expansion pipe were rectified by Tradesmen.

In the meantime, I had been making myself at home and had painted a 'feature wall' in most of the rooms - just one wall of colour, leaving the rest Magnificent Magnolia(!). After I'd done it, I realised my mistake and knew that I should have got permission first. But I had decorated rooms at my old house, and had simply repainted them back to Magnolia when I left, so I didn't think it would be a problem if I offered to do the same here. I sent an E-Mail asking for permission (not saying I'd already done it...!), and stating that I'd be happy to repaint them when I leave the property. The Landlady said no...! I panicked at that point, and knew I had to 'fess up - which I did, and stated that I didn't think it would be a problem due to my willlingness to repaint them when I leave.

The Letting Agent phoned me in the middle of September and made an appointment with me for the Landlady to come and clear the asbestos from the pit herself, which would then be collected from the front garden. She didn't turn up on that day, and when I phoned the Letting Agent, they insisted they'd phoned me and left a message saying she wasn't coming as the council can't come and collect it until at least October. (They didn't phone me, I had no missed calls and certainly no voicemail from them).
It was then re-arranged for her to come on this Saturday just gone.

The moment I met her, I knew my boyfriend was right about her. She was SO rude and has the attitude of a hormonal teenage girl. She was with a man who I assumed to be her husband / partner, and as soon as I opened the door, she thrust an 'Asbestos in the Home' leaflet at me and told me to "read it", muttering that it's completely safe and you don't even need gloves to move the guttering. Her and her partner then proceeded to put gloves on (haha!) and start to clear it out. My boyfriend was here at the time, as he was doing pitbike-type stuff in my garage.....

He asked her if she was just taking the asbestos, or if she was clearing the whole pit, at which point she 'flipped her lid' a bit, stating that she was only taking the asbestos and was NOT clearing the whole pit because that's a "ridiculous thing to expect". We informed her that we were told it was going to be done before I moved in, which she denied all knowledge of, and said she'd NEVER said that the pit OR the workshop would be cleared, and had never even said that we could use them. My boyfriend backed down and said he would clear the rest of the pit himself once the guttering was gone.
She then started about how she "doesn't understand why I had to get Environmental Health involved" and that it's "out of order" that I got them to inspect the whole house. I explained what happened with Environmental Health, but she clearly didn't believe me.
Once they'd cleared the guttering, we could then see that there were further asbestos SHEETS underneath, some of which were already broken and in small fragments. My boyfriend then said he wasn't happy to clear that out and his friend (who had turned up in the middle of all this) told her that it wasn't safe (he used to be a roofer, so has seen it before) and advised her not to touch it either. She had another strop and started going on about "well you've got your way then haven't you, I'll HAVE to get it cleared out now!". My boyfriend was being very friendly still (I don't know how!), saying that we will be flexible and are happy to work around whenever is convenient to her/her contractor to have it cleared, we're resonable people etc, - to which she replied "I don't see how you can think that wanting 300 quid off your rent for clearing a workshop, and painting walls without permission, classes you as reasonable!", and then started whittering on about how I've moved into a "practically brand new house" where they "didn't HAVE to replace all the windows, and didn't HAVE to refurbish it" (as if that was for my benefit alone?!), and that I "haven't exactly got off the the best start". I was really upset by this, as I've NEVER had a problem with my last Letting Agent / Landlord (where I lived for nearly 4 years), and had an absolutely glowing reference from them.
She had a TERRIBLE attitude and was incredibly rude in her tone and mannerisms the whole time (her partner was very quiet throughout...!).
The way it was left, was that she/the Agent would contact me regarding clearance of the Pit by specialists. The guttering is now on the grass in the front garden.

This morning, I received a letter in the post from the Letting Agent stating that the Landlady has instead taken the decision to fill in the Pit with cement. Her reason for this is apparently that she feels the metal covering is rusty and therefore 'unsafe' (what a cop-out!) and doesn't state wether it will be cleared before being filled in, or if they're simply going to pour cement over what is left in there.

It also implies that they hope my boyfriend isn't living here, as she's obviously told them that she thinks he is (due to all his stuff being in the garage, and him being here when she came)

So that's the long and short of it for now (I have probably forgotten one or two other things too!)
I just don't know what to do any more, and I've only lived here 2 months! The whole situation and the landlady in particular, is constantly stressing me out - and the worst thing is that I signed a 12 month Tenancy!

I feel like I've had to fight my corner from the very beginning (as the Letting Agent always takes the Landlady's side, naturally), and I'm really running out of fight now.

Any advice on ANY of the above would be gratefully recieved

skint-student-nurse

ohhh lordy hun! Did you inform environmental health about the asbestos sheets that were underneath? if not,please do this asap.

What kind of tenancy do you have and is your deposit protected? My concern after reading your post, from my experience of being both a tenant and a landlord is that you will get a S21 (notice to quit) because of the remarks she has apparently made to you. The S21 wouldnt do anything atm though.

I would contact shelter or the CAB to see what advice they can give. HTH,sorry i cant be more useful atm

MemmaJ

I didn't re-contact Environmental Health yet for a few reasons:

firstly because she said she was going to have it cleared, so I didn't see it as a problem.

On recieving this letter today, I have a suspicion that she plans to just have it filled in without having it cleared first (which I know environmental health wouldn't be too happy with), but as it doesn't say what they're going to do in the letter, I thought it would be best to wait and see what their intentions are, and possibly contact E.H if it does transpire that they're just going to cover it over.

I didn't want to jump the gun and phone them today because I know they'll contact her again, and I didn't want to make things worse for myself. The last thing I need is for her to kick me out now!

mostlycheerful

“Any advice on ANY of the above would be gratefully received”

“So that's the long and short of it for now (I have probably forgotten one or two other things too!)”

Write up all the rest of it and anything else you can remember while it’s fresh in your mind and write up every last bit of this from now on and any stuff leading up to this that you can remember.

Fantastic, Addams Family, a great piece of writing, work it up into a whole book and you’ve got a best seller on your hands. And a whole string of articles in some or even all of the national newspapers if you want. Your attitude and phrasing and observational skills are splendid, top marks, may I put in a bid to option your story for a film, a whole 2 hour dour sceptical wry cynical black humour account of this gross spectacle and all the lead in and the denouement. And a twelve part half an hour comedy series a la Basil Fawlty and Fawlty Towers with all the twists and turns slavered over. And it would work on radio as well, you could probably do a once week hour long epic about this for at least a year and maybe even five years. Y’know, introduce all the secondary characters and go into a bit of detail about them. And the whole history of dad before he died and the daughter now with the sad dismal business of trying to make a go of it. Yeah, you could milk this in all sorts of ways, it’s an epic. It’s a tragi-comedy in the best Chaucer Shakespeare East Enders tradition. You could get the cream of British acting to turn out for this one. Do you want to act yourself in it? Or would you prefer to get a star or an up and coming unknown to be you, the choice is yours. And who’s going to play the rude grizzled landlady, it’s a peachy role, there’ll be a lot of competition for that one.

Keep writing and record every last detail of every event and contact, particularly all the officials and their attitudes and reactions, from now on, this one could run and run. In the meantime, practical solutions? Er, nah, just let it continue as it is, this is priceless, this is English eccentricity at its best, this is a major work of art so don’t spoil it, just record all of it, all the time, and especially your thoughts about the whole palaver. Classic. “Tudor Cottage” indeed! Yeah, that can be the working title for the book and the film, that’s priceless, that’s absolutely great. That’s a one off, there’s only one of them on the planet and you’ve got it, superb.

clutton_2

have you got a break clause in your tenancy agreement ?

MemmaJ

mostlycheerful - I don't think I have any idea what you're talking about...!

clutton - I'm pretty sure there is a 6 month clause in the Tenancy, as it was originally suggested that my boyfriend could be added to the Tenancy Agreement at this point if we wanted.

clutton_2

you seem to have got off on the wrong foot.. maybe you need to write a letter to your LL explaining (much more briefly than here) what your expectations were, based on what the LA had told you, and apologising for decorating and explaining how EHO works.... and that you did not intentionally make things difficult for her.

If you are to stay then re-establishing relationships is important

Getting a pit concreted in will cost her a lot more, i suspect, that getting the asbestos removed by the councils recommended contractors...

she may be finding this all very difficult - dealing with her dead parents home - and her rudeness is one way to deal with her grief... no excuse really.. but it may be one way for you to understand her...

if you really cannot stomach her - then leave at the 6 month point.....

MemmaJ

I did do all that with her in person on Saturday. I really didn't want her to leave on a bad note, so went and spoke to her (away from my boyfriend) before she left.
I explained again what happened with E.H and re-confirmed that I didn't ASK them to come out. Also apologised for painting the walls and re-confirmed that I'm happy to repaint when I leave, and that I did excatly that at my old property and the Landlord was happy with the result and end finish.

I explained that we're happy here and have settled in very well, and would like to stay for as long as she'll let us and therefore don't want to have a bad relationship with her, etc.

She seemed OK at the end of our conversation..?!

It's not that I can't stomach her, as I know that I wont be having an awful lot of direct contact with her. It's more that things have not been done as they were agreed, and I am now being made to look like the unreasonable one by both her and the Agency.

ruggedtoast

I actually quite enjoyed reading that. Very engaging.

Anyway, letting agents lie through their teeth. They probably never passed on the information about what you wanted doing. In any case the owner sounds like a bit of a mare. It does sound like she has to make the place livable anyway, and seems to have done that, with ill grace.

Its disappointing she didnt make the outbuildings usable, but unfortunately thats letting. If the stuff in there isnt on the inventory then you can dump it. As it is she wants to pour concrete on it.

I would just try and enjoy the next ten months in your home and move on. In a sense its just one of those things, like if you move in somewhere and there are horrible neighbours. At least you'll rarely see her now, though paying her will surely rankle a bit.

Edit. Another accidental landlord.

dollydiva

Mostlycheerful...great post! Some folks just don't get irony, so think you're banging your head off a brick wall there mate....

Dd

mrcol1000

Its only certain types of asbestos which are dangerous and then only so if you break it up and breathe in the dust. Covering it in concrete is probably a sensible cheap way to deal with it. I don't really see what the problem is other than its taken a while for the landlady to sort the problems with the property out. There are a lot of tenants putting up with a lot worse than your problem. Also I can see why the landlady got upset at you involving the council. Even landlord's are human after all. Also if your boyfriends stuff is at the property and he is always there why wouldn't she think he was living there? You also admit that you painted a wall without permission. Could it be that the landlady is wondering if she wants to rent to you in the same way your wondering if you rent from you? Rightly or wrongly?
I would keep on to get these problems sorted. Try not to see it a battle. Grin and bear it for rest of your tenancy and then decide if you want to move on.