Overzealous landlord stress!

Binks

We just moved out of a 2 bedroom apartment that we have rented for the past 3 years. The apartment was new when we moved in and had not previously been inhabited.
Now that we are moving out the landlord is trying to claim against our deposit for:

Shower screen to be cleaned of hard water marks. (My wife and I spent hours trying to remove all of these. They return each and every time the shower is used.)

Bedroom carpet and living room carpet have some faint marks, and I do mean faint. In total they comprise about 1ft sq. One of them is a coffee mark, that was treated but didn't fully come out. The other three, I'm not sure what they are, but they look like blotchy discolouration of a cheap piece of carpet to me. However, I do acknowledge that they are there. The landlord wants the entire carpets cleaned though, for both rooms, rather than spot cleaning.
Attached are photo's, it was hard to obtain pictures that would even show the marks up. I was willing to concede this small loss in exchange for the safe return of our deposit, until he started his own checkout report.

{Tried to include pictures of the carpets but I can't post links yet.}


A dishwasher basket. The landlord claims that it is broken, in reality there are some removable sections that have been taken out, the clips for these attachments were left with the dishwasher. He claims that they are snapped, which they are not. He has gone out and bought a new basket for over £100. I've looked into this and the clips that he claims were snapped, are themselves are only £9 plus P&P. But thats besides the point, they weren't broken...

He is also claiming for a small metal shower support from the shower, this actually just fell out of the wall. 'You might say yeah right, it just fell out', but it actually did...see below...

The whole place was built to a low standard, since we moved in the gas had to be disconnected for 9 months as it was unsafe, this left us with no heating, water, or hob. After it was reconnected we were plagued with gas leaks. The electrics weren't earthed correctly and had to be rewired. The windows leaked, sliding doors failed, the fitments (including mirrors, electrical sockets etc) all fell off the walls, often replaced at our own expense. The firedoor handle mechanisms 'slipped' locking people into rooms.
These general faults affected a group of about 300 apartments and should be well documented...somewhere....
I had to take days off work, cancel appointments, and all sorts to get it all sorted out.

He even wants to claim for two small nails that were left in the wall to hang clocks, even though this is allowed under under tenancy agreement. He says he has to fork out and pay for the filling and painting of two holes in the wall. Holes? Pin pricks more like!

In addition whilst we lived at the property it was never maintained, things that we reported (faulty faucet, leak on ceiling, firedoors, electrical sockets, blocked drains etc) were never repaired.

Sounds like a disaster area right? Well actually we kept the place absolutely spotless despite all of these things. The independent inventory clerk said that for a three year tenancy he was impressed, and suggested that the only thing that would need rectifying would be some spot cleaning of the carpets. None of the other items are mentioned.
Unfortunately our confidence in our care of the property, led us into a false sense of security, so we took no other photos. We may, if we're lucky, be able to obtain the photos the inventory guy took of everything. Silly of us I know.

I would go as far to say that if the property had been left with nobody living in it for three years, it would be in far worse condition then it is right now given all of the problems we helped to fix!

Our landlord, unhappy with the inventory, is going back to the property on Friday to 'properly inspect the place'! It seems he doesn't consider his current list to be scrupulous enough and is in the process of compiling a more thorough one. ><

The agency who we rented through, seem reluctant to do anything. They just say that the landlord is unhappy, and they will return the deposit less the disputed amount after he gets back to them on Friday. As they hired an independent inventory clerk they haven't looked for themselves and sound quite hacked off about the prospect of going into dispute proceedings.

Over a period of three years, nothing was ever raised by the agents at the routine inspections, and our rent was always paid on time. As I have already stated, anything we reported ourselves was noted but never acted upon.

I am quite concerned that the landlord is trying to recoup some money, on a poor investment, by breaking into our deposit. The amount of money we paid for the place, (£850 per month), together with the problems we put up with, makes me feel a bit queasy.

Please help us out with some advice!
What in the world should we do?

sooz

Where is your deposit protected?

Carpet cleaning will probably be in your contract, & spot cleaning just leaves an obvious clean spot.

Shower screens are a :mad: to clean, but it can be done. Limescale remover, elbow grease, a paint scraper on the really bad bits, & about 4 rolls of kitchen paper . You yourself said you did clean them but they returned. These really should have been cleaned before you moved out.

What happened during the tenancy with problems in the whole building is of no relation to the return of your deposit.

Start a dispute with whichever company holds your deposit. They will take the evidence from the independent inventory clerk, & not your landlord.

moromir

sooz wrote: »

Start a dispute with whichever company holds your deposit. They will take the evidence from the independent inventory clerk, & not your landlord.

I don't believe this is correct. The independent inventory clerk's paperwork is infact supporting documentation available to the Landlord if he so wishes to include it in his case.

The dispute is between the Landlord and the Tenant. The dispute service does not apply to third parties for 'evidence' off its own back.

Binks

The deposit is held by one of those new tenancy deposit schemes. I'm about to read through tthe contract regarding the carpets.
The thing is the shower screens were cleaned, the day we moved out...with limescale remover, elbow grease, the works. That's why I'm interested to get hold of the photo's from the Inventory clerk. If somebody has since turned on the shower, they would have returned.
Calcium.. good for your teeth... bad for your elbows!

Sorry I didn't make it clear what I'm very interested to learn is.. are we liable to pay for the whole carpet? The ARLA guidelines seems to suggest we only have to pay a proportion of the cost, whereas the agency is hoping to charge us the full price.
As for all the other stuff, from the mouth of the agency, it seems they are hoping to disregard the independent inventory and proceed with the landlords own findings...can they do this?
The reason I listed all of the property faults was to emphasize the point, that the property is in much better condition now, then when we initially moved in...
Honestly I could scream with frustration.

If only I could post the photographs for you guys to see.

sooz

Binks wrote: »

Calcium.. good for your teeth... bad for your elbows!

Sorry I didn't make it clear what I'm very interested to learn is.. are we liable to pay for the whole carpet? The ARLA guidelines seems to suggest we only have to pay a proportion of the cost, whereas the agency is hoping to charge us the full price.

Are they trying to charge you for new carpets?
Or the whole cost of cleaning the carpets?

After 3 years, any carpets would need to be fully cleaned, to remove your 3 years of dirt from them.

If they are trying to charge you for new carpets, then 3 years of wear and tear would have to be taken into account, & you would only be liable for a proportion of the costs, taking into account the lifespan of the carpets.

sooz

moromir wrote: »

I don't believe this is correct. The independent inventory clerk's paperwork is infact supporting documentation available to the Landlord if he so wishes to include it in his case.

The dispute is between the Landlord and the Tenant. The dispute service does not apply to third parties for 'evidence' off its own back.

True, but the tenant would have the check in & check out inventory report too. They could submit this as their evidence, provided by an independent third party employed for that purpose.

Binks

Nope they are trying to charge us only for the cleaning of the carpets, I can't find a stipulation in the tenancy agreement that says they need to be cleaned at all. But to be fair we are willing to pay a fair proportion of the costs...

The ARLA guidelines say:

The landlord should not end up, either financially or materially, in a better position than he was at commencement of the tenancy, or than he would have been at the end of the tenancy having allowed for fair wear and tear.
To avoid betterment, the allocation or apportionment of any costs, charges or compensation for damage must take into account all the factors relating to
(a) fair wear and tear,
(b) the most appropriate remedy and,
(c) that the landlord should not end up either financially or materially in a better position than he was at commencement of the tenancy or as he would expect to be at the end of the tenancy having considered (a) and exercised (b).
The principles of some very general examples might include
1. A small to medium stain or mark on a carpet or mattress - perhaps £15 - £35 e.g. the cost of a "spot" clean or, this amount as the tenants' contribution to a full clean of the whole item, or as compensation for the diminution. A small to medium size chip or mark, scratch or burn on a kitchen worktop - perhaps £5 - £25. A landlord could of course decide to have a new carpet put down or a new kitchen worktop installed if they wished, but, they cannot lawfully charge the tenant for that full cost. The costs should be apportioned and shared between landlord and tenant on the principles given above. E.g. Cost of new carpet £500 - apportioned £465 to landlord, £35 to tenant.


I believe this point has been accepted as a tenet of law, having been agued over so many times in the courts...

Binks

Again from ARLA themselves:

'Fair wear and tear – this means making an allowance for: -

1. The original age, quality and condition of any item at commencement of the tenancy
2. The average useful lifespan to value ratio (depreciation) of the item
3. The reasonable expected usage of such an item
4. The number and type of occupants in the property
5. The length of the tenants occupancy

It follows therefore (and is an established legal tenet) that a landlord is not entitled to charge his tenants the full cost for having any part of his property, or any fixture or fitting, ".....put back to the condition it was at the start of the tenancy."'

sooz

As a newbuild carpets were new, so cleanliness is easy to document.

You are responsible for removing your dirt.

Had the carpets been older, & he could not prove that they'd been cleaned before you moved in, then you could argue you are only liable for a proportion.

I'd start getting some written quotes from local companies, so you have evidence of how much this should cost.

I'm not sure why the examples from arla you give above mention spot cleaning. I've paid £35-£60 for cleaning carpets in two or three rooms. There's normally an initial charge, & then a small extra per room. Spot cleaning leaves a clean mark. I think they have badly phrased this.

Then the same link later talks about having a replacement carpet or worktop, which as I said makes allowances for wear & tear.

sooz

You are confusing dirt with fair wear & tear.

Binks

Indeed it seems that the tenancy agreement stipulates that the flat must be cleaned by the tenant or by a professional to the same standard as it was at the start of the tenancy. So I guess we're over a barrel really. Under this clause, they can charge us for pretty much whatever they want up to the standard of a spangly new flat. Thanks very much for clearing up that point. I guess it's just up to the individual landlord and we're going to get stung.

It's the other things that are really getting us down. Any advice on these?
Can we use the inventory clerks findings as support for any other disputed items?