Hugely Under-Paid for the job

Blitzwing85

Hi

This is regarding my partner, and i was just curious as to what others experiences/opinions were. I'm aware that there is nothing that can be done really.

She works at the same company as me, and works in the Process Optimisation department. Basically this is an Engineering Department who's job it is to improve the processes around the site to improve quality, cost etc.
This department has 6 men, who's pay ranges from £25,000 to £28,000.
She gets £14,000.

To compound matters, they get qualifications paid for them...and she is paying for her own through Open Uni AND using it at work. (i've finally convinced her to push for them to pay this so we'll see what happens there).

Now, the shop floor workers get paid the same as she does and they do nothing more than general assembly work.



I'm really shocked that companies can get away with this in this day and age. She does the same job, and does it better.
She even implemented a system recently which 2 of these guys said was 'impossible' after spending months on it. It took her a week.


I wish i could give them a piece of my mind but i can't fight her battles.

There should be some way you can do something about these things i think!


Is anyone else in this situation or has managed to get a rise or get out of it? I guess the best solution is to get another job!

Oldernotwiser

Has she considered using the appropriate legislation to fight this inequality, possibly with the help of her union?

maninthestreet

If your partner is performing the same duties as the men in the her department, she should be paid the same - this is the law (1975 Sex Discrimination Act). Does the employer have an HR department?

westv

It does sound like what is happening is illegal (assuming same work, hours etc.)

Blitzwing85

Well yes the duties are the same. The problem initially was that the job was sort of 'created' for her as she worked temp in purchasing cover for someones maternity leave but she came back and she had done such a good job they asked her to stay on. They sort of made this job up.

However this was 2 years ago now and since then she has a LOT more responsibilties and is doing 90% the same role as the men in the office. She is less hands on engineering than they are, but she nonetheless implements processes, monitors machiens permormances and improves their efficieny etc etc.

The only main difference is they are qualified and she is not. But that should have little effect on the pay for the job. Certainly not as much difference!!




Mind you the company has no pay structure what so ever which is half the problem. 2 new guys have recently been employed in the GDS department repairing equipment...in otherwords just changing a PCD with every fault. Something a 12 year old could do. They get paid £25k for that...making them the most over-paid people here. And they do less work together than the 1 person they replaced.






Anyway, back to them atter at hand. Yes we done have an HR department. The company is a huge global company with sites in over 50 countries, our site having 1 of the highest turnovers.
There is no union or anything though so i guess the only way would be legal action.

However, this would be for her to do and i just can't convince her to be that ruthless.
If it was me i'd have them up against the wall in a heartbeat but i can't see her doing it.

Maybe due to her Dad, Brother and Me working here too!! Although all in different buildings at the site. Which in this company means different rules, pay structures and everything!!! So it's not like that should stop her.

gingerdad

Blitzwing85 wrote: »

The only main difference is they are qualified and she is not. But that should have little effect on the pay for the job. Certainly not as much difference!!

I would see that as a pretty big main difference, she needs to either fight her corner directly with the managament of look at the sex discrimation act....

Annisele

Blitzwing85 wrote: »

The only main difference is they are qualified and she is not. But that should have little effect on the pay for the job. Certainly not as much difference!!

That can depend very much on the industry. I once got a 50% pay rise after I passed a not-very-difficult exam that meant that my employer was allowed to let me work unsupervised.

What sort of qualifications do the other people have, how long would they take to obtain, and and how valuable are they really to the employer? (E.g. a BSc in Biology might be far less use to some employers than a Food Hygiene certificate - you'd expect the biology graduate to be able to pick up the certificate pretty easily, but in some jobs the employer would be justified in paying him less until he'd actually got the certificate).

Legal action is not the only option - it's a bit drastic to start with! Amongst many others, there's the "have a word with your boss" option, the "have an informal word with HR" option - there's even the "raise a formal grievance" option - and they're all long before you see the inside of an employment tribunal.

In her position, I'd request a meeting with my boss to discuss my pay, and turn up armed with all the reasons I ought to be earning £x. It might just be that £14k was perfectly fair for the job she was doing two years ago, and inertia on both her part and the company's has ended up with her still earning £14k - in other words she might be pleasantly surprised!

Blitzwing85

gingerdad wrote: »

I would see that as a pretty big main difference, she needs to either fight her corner directly with the managament of look at the sex discrimation act....

Well it will be the main difference for her low pay. But qualifications should not come into play. A qualification should help you get a higher paid job yes, but not give you a higher pay for the same job.

I've only got an HNC but get paid more than plenty others who have degrees, but that's because i have a much more important job role and more responsibility.


I'll tell her to look at the Act but i can't see her doing anything. She just keeps saying she's asked and it's difficult in her department. I understand her point, she works under a manager who works under the production manager who works under the operations manager. (the latter being a complete **** too doesn't help).
But i told her to fight from the point of view that she's not asking for anything unreasonable here. Hell, not even to be brought up to the same level. Even just upping her to £18k would be good, still WAY off the rest and £4k to a company this size is nothing.

I've just asked the company to pay for my degree, and 1 week after they accepted I told them i want more pay and they said it'd be reviewed in Feb. I told them i want it in writing so i know it's happening and they did, plus gave me a months salary bonus. Honestly, that's the difference between working in 1 department and working in another. Also i kind of made sure at the start that i'd work directly for the senior manager, as opposed to a middle manager...knowing it'd be easier to ask for these things.

I think the best thing is for her to move on, and at least she's studying at Open Uni to do so. It'll just take a few years unfortunately.


I'll keep plugging away at her trying to get her into my way of thinking. If she won't come around and push it, i guess i'll just have to hope she gets another job sooner rather than later. It's not a financial issue for me, we have enough money it's just the principles of it really really bug the hell out of me. It's all i can do to stop myself waltzing into the HR office myself and tell them what i think

zzzLazyDaisy

She can speak informally and confidentially to a case worker at the EHRC who will be able to give her information about her rights re equality of pay and sex discrimination. What she chooses to do with that information is up to her, but at least she will be in a position to make informed decisions

http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/

jonnyd281

Does your partner have any engineering qualifications, or qualifications to do the job she is doing? That could explain the pay differential

Blitzwing85

Annisele wrote: »

That can depend very much on the industry. I once got a 50% pay rise after I passed a not-very-difficult exam that meant that my employer was allowed to let me work unsupervised.

What sort of qualifications do the other people have, how long would they take to obtain, and and how valuable are they really to the employer? (E.g. a BSc in Biology might be far less use to some employers than a Food Hygiene certificate - you'd expect the biology graduate to be able to pick up the certificate pretty easily, but in some jobs the employer would be justified in paying him less until he'd actually got the certificate).

Legal action is not the only option - it's a bit drastic to start with! Amongst many others, there's the "have a word with your boss" option, the "have an informal word with HR" option - there's even the "raise a formal grievance" option - and they're all long before you see the inside of an employment tribunal.

In her position, I'd request a meeting with my boss to discuss my pay, and turn up armed with all the reasons I ought to be earning £x. It might just be that £14k was perfectly fair for the job she was doing two years ago, and inertia on both her part and the company's has ended up with her still earning £14k - in other words she might be pleasantly surprised!

If they advertised for the job they would likely want an HNC level qualification in mechanical or electrical engineering or something along those lines. All of which the others will have. Some may have slightly more but i'm not sure.
Obviously she has no related engineering qualifications, as she only came into the position because every job she filled in for preiously she did better than the person she filled in for and the company wanted to keep her.

This is an angle she could take i guess, remind them why they wanted her to stay in the first palce but say isn't it about time she was rewarded with at least a half decent pay.

It wouldn't be worth her while studying in this field as it's not what she wants to do anyway. But i just think she should push for more pay anyway while she is here.
At the very least she should get them to pay for the rest of her degree. It's putting dents in our savings for a deposit for a bigger house next year and i want to move ASAP so it's annoying me.

She has wrote up a justification letter for that so we have some progress.


She has had meetings with her boss and he says there is nothing he can do as he has no power...and his boss won't go for it at all.
HR here are useless unfortunately, although still probably worth having a word with them.


I'd probably agree with the pay fitting what she did initially. As i said she was just convering and they created this position to keep her on. And as companies work, this won't change until the employee pushes it. I think for now i'll settle for them paying for her degree and lay off asking her about it for a bit.