LV - claim declined because of wrong window locks!

WombleSW20_2

Hi

I wonder if anyone has had any similar experience to me with their LV building & contents insurance or any other insurers..........

While on holiday, my house was burgled - a sash window was forced open and both cars and various items were stolen. The window in question was secured with a traditional latch as well as a barrel security lock that was could only be opened with an allen key. When I applied for cover, I was only asked if all my windows had key operated locks - to which I responded yes.

I made a claim for the damage to the window and the items stolen and have learned today that LV will cover the damage to the window but not the items stolen - the reason being that the policy requires an key operated window lock excluding locks with an allen key. There is nothing in the schedule or policy wording about this and I'm waiting for them to clarify why and where this exclusion has suddenly appeared from. I've checked their site today and there is nothing about this in their underwriting questions.

My experience with LV to date has been excellent but this seems ludicrous. Can they introduce new exlcusions like this? Would FOS uphold my claim?

huckster

LV can only rely on the terms and conditions that they have informed you of.

I am in agreement with you. Yes proper key locks are better, than those with allen keys, but unless they say that allen keys are not acceptable, then your claim is fully valid.

Check all your documents thoroughly and make a complaint to their claims director. You may have grounds to go to the FOS, but they are taking ages to deal with complaints, sometimes over 2 years. You might be better instructing solicitors and taking this to court if you can.

dunstonh

Would FOS uphold my claim?

Only if LV are trying to impose terms that do not exist in the policy wording.

Check the written policy document and not the website. The website version may only be a "key facts" or "key points" document. That said, just checked on their website during application process and there is a question that asks:

Do all accessible windows have key operated locks?
Accessible windows are those opening windows on the basement or ground floor of your property or the 1st floor or above if next to drain pipes, fire escape or balconies etc.

I did a dummy quote saying yes to that question and no to that question and the premiums changed. So, if you said yes to that question and you dont have key operated locks then the insurer can reject or reduce the claim. Reduction is the normal method you would expect though.

WombleSW20_2

Thanks Dunstonh

I've checked the policy wording - there is nothing here about accessible windows / locks etc. and all the schedule says is that I must have key operated window locks. I certainly don't recall the question set you quote above during the application process.

All the windows on the ground floor have window locks but there are a couple of the 1st floor windows that don't have key operated window locks. Would this matter? The burgler entered on the ground floor? It does feel like they're trying to weasel their way out of this. Definitely not very TCF!

dunstonh

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/4/minimum-security.htm

I think that page will help you (or possibly not when you read the second paragraph below)

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]If, when applying for the insurance, a consumer claims, incorrectly, to have certain locks, and the insurer subsequently rejects a theft claim because of this mis-statement, we will expect the insurer to demonstrate that it had only agreed to issue cover on the basis that the policyholder had the specific locks which he or she claimed, incorrectly, to have.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]In our view, a policyholder who has failed to comply with the security requirements in force will not lose protection under the policy unless failure to comply is relevant to the loss. If, for example, the policyholder agreed to have his or her window locks secured whenever the house was empty, but then forgot and was burgled, it would not be reasonable for the insurer to reject the claim unless the burglars were able to get into or out of the house by means of an unlocked window. [/FONT]

WombleSW20_2

Having read thast last paragraph a few times, my interpretation of this is that if I coconfirmed that all windows had locks, and the burguler entered through an unlocked window, then a rejected claim would be reasonable. However, if they entered throiugh a locked window, then the claim should not be rejected. Is that right?

dunstonh

WombleSW20 wrote: »

Having read thast last paragraph a few times, my interpretation of this is that if I coconfirmed that all windows had locks, and the burguler entered through an unlocked window, then a rejected claim would be reasonable. However, if they entered throiugh a locked window, then the claim should not be rejected. Is that right?

Yes. The "error" has to be relevant to the claim for them to be able to refuse it or be something that they would not have offered cover on from the start had they known of it. They cant argue the latter as it just results in a discount being applied.

So, if a different window was used that was locked then the error cant result in rejection

ankspon

I have window locks,key operated,the problem is i can open the lock with virtually any key so they are no better

mattymoo

When I used to do household security surveys for a major insurers (94-04), the term "Key Operated Window Locks" would include those which used Allen type keys or variations on an allen key. It is quite rare for retrofited locks to have a traditional looking key. Take a look in Homebase or B+Q and you will see many of the aftermarket locks do use Allen (hex) or square type keys for opening.

In any event, the phrase is "Allen Key" so it is a key operated lock.

Unless the LV documentation makes specific mention of Allen keys and you were made aware of this (possibly in a renewal notice or better still, the main schedule), then I do not feel they have a leg to stand on.

PS: I did a quick google and found this page from Chubb (or Mul-t-loc as they are now) -
http://www.chubb-at-heart.co.uk/products/additional/hingedWindows
3 out of 5 products on that page use an Allen Key and all of those products would meet insurers requirements. LV really are out of step with the market here.

PPS: - just did a quick quote on the LV site and this was the policy security condition imposed -

Security Conditions

We will require the following minimum level of security to be installed at your home within the next 28 days if it is not in force already:

• A mortice deadlock with at least 5 levers, or Locks to BS3621 fitted to the main entrance / exit door, or double glazed units with a minimum of a 3 point multi locking system.
• All other doors (including patio doors) fitted with the above security, or the existing door locks providing they are complemented by additional key operated security devices top and bottom.
• Key operated window locks on all accessible windows.
• A burglar alarm to a minimum of grade 2 EN50131 (for all new alarms), or burglar alarms previously installed by a NACOSS/SSAIB registered installer (where an alarm is already fitted).
• All of the locks and alarm will be used whenever the property is left unattended and overnight. They will be maintained in good working order.

Absolutely no mention of Allen keys, just a straightforward requirement for key operated window locks.

This makes me suspect a claims handler has tried to be a bit of a smart alec and declined the claim with no basis to do so under the contract. Definately one to fight, via their in-house complaint procedure to beging with.

WombleSW20_2

Hi everyone.

Firstly thank you all for your comments. I got a call from the claims adviser informing me that they have re-reviewed the claim and have agreed to accept it. HOORAY!Apparently the loss adjuster / window repair company were using a completely out-of-date policy wording and had advised LV to reject. Absolutely great news - so thanks again!

luci

Brilliant news. Thanks for the update.