CCJ and other questions from new forum user

gazz007

hi all, new to this malarky, so forgive me if I seem a tad 'greenhorn' at this. I received a county court claim form from Wandsworth County Court on Friday, I have been trying to get my head around what to do, and I stumbled upon this site. It is for a debt that HFO Capital purchased from Morgan Stanley in 2007, and HFO services have been trying to threaten me with the dossier stuff, and also sending photos of a house I used to share with my former partner, plus the experian report on me, which says I am a joint owner of the house my children still live in with my former partner. I guess I was silly enough to keep my name on the deed to the property, but I only did this with the best interests of my kids at heart i.e. if my ex met someone else, something were to happen to her (heaven forbid of course), and the possibility of her new partner being entitled to her house under common law (correct?). Anyway, I left my name on there since we split up around five years ago, just to ensure I had a say in the kids getting the house, and now these parasites are clearly trying to go after my so-called interest in that property. I requested the CCA, which turned up TWO months later as a poor photo copy, and about a quarter of the original size, and barely readable without very good eyesight, which I sadly do not have. I have panicked and tried to tell them I cannot afford a lot of money as I am on mimimum wage, but they repeatedly asked for unreasonable amounts of money. All the while I have been advised by National Debtline (to be honest they are either usless or just short of useful), but I needed someone to help me, and their name came up in Google when I searched for debt help.

I have tried to negotiate with HFO Services, even though the CCA looks a very poor quality copy, as I did owe the money to Morgan Stanley. I had stopped paying Morgan Stanley when I became unemployed. over three years ago, but I am now working, but only for minimum wage, and am trying to get a DMP through the national debtline. HFO services sent my case to their solicitor Turnbull and Rutherford, who sent me a letter to the property I no longer live at, which is nearly forty miles away, and I do not drive, so I could not pick this letter up until I was made aware of it's arrival, which happened to be around a week after it being posted, as my children and their mum were away on holiday. I sent a letter to the solicitor to ask for more time to deal with HFO services as I had no idea the solicitor letter was there, and I apologised for any delay in replying, and gave the solicitor my address which I have lived at for the last three years, and that I had made HFO aware also that I no longer lived in that house, or indeed that area. Yet they still sent all mail plus that very important letter to an address where I do not live. Upshot was that T&R said thanks for the letter, but their client (yeah right they are one and the same aren't they?) still intends to persue a charging order on my interest in the property. I replied to say that they need to get a CCJ, which I have to default on first before any further action can be taken (correct?). I then sought advice from National Debtline to go for a DMP, to avoid me having to deal with these mercenaries personally. I informed T&R of this and asked them to hold action until the DMP people contacted them.

This is where we are at now, the solicitors have ignored my request, and hit me with this court claim, without even trying to negotiate an offer with me. The thing is, the claim says it's HFO Capital that is taking me to court, and not HFO Services, can they do this with them being based outside the UK? I am not trying to dodge paying my debts, I am simply trying to avoid being ripped off, and also avoid any unnecessary hassle for all concerned, including my children, who's home they are clearly trying to snatch. Any advice would be very much appreciated. I apologise if this is vague, my nerves are shot here and I am trying to get everything into one post as I do not have long to respond to this claim with my offer. Would it be silly of me to contact the solicitor and try to arrange a repayment plan and stop the court action? I need advice very quickly if anyone can offer any. Thanks very much in advance.

MrsTinks

Gazz I have moved your post from the other thread into it's own thread... You have a lot of questions and I think that it would be better if they were not confused with lots of other questions etc

Right first things first - what exactly have they sent you? Do they have a CCJ against you for this debt or is that what they are threatening to take you to court for? Is the paperwork sent to you official court papers OR are they merely on the solicitors letter head to give them the air of being "genuine"

Charging orders... can be applied for if you have had a judgement (CCJ) and were ordered to pay "forthwith" (immediately) or have failed to make court ordered installments. That is why it's important that we know where you are at exactly...

IF a charging order is granted then they cannot force the sale of the house, especially not as your children live at the address. Did you and your partner ever legalise how much of the house you own and she owns? Because the charging order can only be made against YOUR share... not hers. And by the same token it can only be made for the amount you actually owe, nothing more.

Common law... I think you are wrong on that, but do check with a solicitor. I suggest to protect yoru childrens financial future BOTH you and your ex write wills leaving all to the children should anything happen. That will minimise any problems with delays in releasing money in the event of a death which dying without a will would cause...

So - where does that leave you... Well I'd contact someone like CCCS for advice - but I'd also keep a REAL good hold of all the things they have sent you so far - including the pictures of the house etc. I'm not certain but I'd think there is a very good chance a judge would see this kind of "debt recovery" as darned close to stalking or harrassment...

I'm also curious as to why they have applied to a local court for the judgement... Most of these companies go through the mass processing court at Northampton for CCJs... Which is why I'm asking if it REALLY is court paperwork...

gazz007

Thanks for the very quick response MrsTine, I appreciate it. The court claim is an N1 and it is stamped with Wandsworth county court, with 76/78 Upper Richmond Road Putney London on the bottom, and is stamped as 'Served On 12th Aug 2010', looks real to me. Can HFO Capital do this with them being based in Dublin? All correspondence was from HFO Services prior to the solicitor contacting me, who has clearly taken the aggressive route. His letter says "This letter is sent in an attempt to avoid the need to issue legal proceedings against you". They gave me 14 days to reply, but having sent the letter to the children's home, I had no idea it was there for around a week, I explained this to them, but they were having none of it.

gazz007

does anyone else have any advice regarding HFO CAPITAL's legal right to claim against me in a UK court? If they have no legal power in the UK can I then defend this claim on that basis? I need to work out my next step very quickly as I have lmited time after being served with the claim on the 12th August 2010. Many thanks in advance

PNPSUKNET

they will use a subsidary to claim via the courts, hfo capital will be more than likely the parent company. I fully advice you take take legal advice, any incorrect advice here could really cost you.

gazz007

they are claiming as HFO CAPITAL, they are the claimants on the N1 I received from the county court, there is no mention of HFO Services on the claim form - does this make any difference?

PNPSUKNET

I wouldnt imagine

NorthernLas

This is a link to a CAG thread which is about people getting taken to court by HFO capital http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?192940

I have no idea regarding your defence question. You can acknowledge the service on line and then prepare a defence. This would give you extra time. You will need to read up on the thread - a defence could be that the CCA, default notice, termination are incorrect.

I would try and speak with CCCS or National Debtline or community legal advice on whether you should and how to defend your claim.

This link is instructions as to what to do with the court claim
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/ManagingDebt/CourtClaimsAndBankruptcy/DG_10013083

RAS

gazz

What we ned to know is

1. What sort of debt is this - loan, CC etc. In your najme alone or shared with the ex-missus
2. When did you take the account out and more importantly given you left the house 5 years ago, have you paid anything towards this debt in the last 6 years.
3. Can you post up the CCA - an by the way an illegiblwe CCA could be unenforceable.
4. Do you have the default letter as that may be duff.

gazz007

hi RAS, it's a CC, Morgan Stanley were the original creditors. but I received a letter in March 2010 telling me that they had sold the debt to HFO in September 2007. Why did they wait this long to contact me regarding this? Also, after contacting them via email, I was forced to telephone him when he emailed me attachments containing pdf documents with experian credit reports, and a google earth photograph of the house my children live in! I had to phone him this time (I know, I know, but I was shocked to receive this email and wanted to know what was going on). Some guy on the phone at HFO services called Mr Kumar then proceeded to ask me when I am going to pay them what I owe, without even trying to establish a level of cooperation. I told him I am not arguing with him over the phone, I want everything in writing via post, at my CURRENT address, and gave him the details.

He then sent further emails to me with ridiculous payment scheme offers, so I decided to contact National Debtline, but they weren't much help. I found information on CAG regarding a CCA request, so I sent a recorded letter to HFO services to ask for a true signed copy. Two months later, his next correspondence was sent to the house I no longer live at - AGAIN. This time, the letter came with a heap of information about me, land registry, experian reports (again), barclaycard search for my current address, which they had now been given TWICE but they still sent mail to the house I no longer live at. Only in this letter they started getting nasty, with the google earth photo printed on a sheet entitled 'HFO services - Bailiff information sheet'. I was in constant contact with them, telling them I am seeking advice regarding the matter.

The guy wasn't having any of it, they passed it over to their solicitor Turnbull & Rutherford, who sent their letter to, you guessed it, the house I no longer live at, giving me 14 days to reply. I didn't even know it was there until my ex came back off her holiday and asked me why I still had letters coming to her house. I then emailed the solicitor (for speed) to inform them that I will be replying in writing and to apologise for not responding sooner, but they sent it to the wrong address even though HFO services already had my current address. Their reply was smug in the extreme, saying thanks for the new details, and that they will now direct all written correspondence to the current address, but their 'client' is still going to seek a charging order on my interest in the property my ex and kids live at. All this after a letter was sent to me claiming their letter was 'an attempt to avoid the need to issue legal proceedings' against me.

I sent them a hold action letter stating that I needed further legal advice, they ignored it and went straight for the county court claim, which is where I am now.

EDIT: the solicitor sent me the default letter, it was dated 14th July 2010.

I'm worried here because I don't have much time to respond to the claim, and I have no idea what to do. Am I silly for thinking that I should maybe try to negotiate terms with this solicitor to try to avoid this going to court? My head is spinning with all the information I have, and the help I've received from the National Debtline has been anything but, they have a total lack of patience when I was unsure of something they've told me. They did say I should go to CAB and ask for advice, but I have to take time off work, and that's not good as I work with an employment agency, no work, no pay - so I am stuck for the times I can get down there.

If it's best to just bite the bullet and offer this guy an amount I can afford to try to persuade them to avoid court action, then so be it. I just need some guidance folks.

gazz007

can't post photo links to show the documents, damn, that's me up the creek now I guess