Toyota Northallerton - Forgery Query, please help!

Foxster

Hi all,

I am new to here so please try and stick with me, I will keep it brief...

Me and my partner were looking for a larger car, mainly for the dog. Eventually we decided on a 2006 Toyota Rav4. We viewed a few and wanted to use a Toyota dealership and use their finance with includes a few little perks, such as a 1 year warranty and a years roadside assistance (obviously dependent upon the deal).

Anyway, we struck what we considered to be a fair deal and agreed to commit at which point I paid a deposit. My partner signed an agreement in principle that we were happy with. No problems up to now, it was going pretty good but was what I expected from a "proper" Toyota dealership.

Over the next week/ ten days they had problems getting my partners DOB wrong on the 3 day insurance, not really an issue but did add a day or so to the exchange date. We eventually scheduled the 13th August as the big day. Upon arriving at the dealership I could see that the salesman that dealt with us was busy with another customer and eventually another salesman dealt with us. He sat down with us, got the big folder out with my partners name etc on it and then began to reel off all of the paper work and so on. This was until he pulled out an agreement indicating the main aspects of the deal i.e. Purchase price, TAX, MOT, SERVICE, WARRANTY...

I noticed at this point that we had agreed to pay £235 for a years tax but it had only cost £180, this again was not a big issue as across the whole deal it would not make any difference but I did want to know where the difference had gone as you would expect, but then I realised that most of the figures had been changed to suit the dealer... Now the big concern:

The salesman simply reiterated that we had signed this agreement, BUT WE HADN'T, my partner pointed out that we had never actually seen this document before and that in actual fact the salesman or whoever had forged her signature. This really shook my trust as if they wanted to change any of the small details we would have been happy to come and talk through it and inevitably sign the document. They claimed that this was not forgery as it was not a legal contract even though it had my partners name and forged signature on it, surely that is forgery alone?

I demanded to know who had forged it (I don't think we were supposed to see the document and think we only did see it as another salesman to the original was dealing with us), they seemed to avoid the question and talk about the figures. After some conversation the finance coordinator (or whatever they are called) came out and again, ignored my question. I went outside to make a phone call as although this did not affect the monthly repayments (although we never got that far) it did totally shake my confidence in the Toyota dealership and wanted to see what my work colleague thought. At this point the salesmen were panicking (all 3 of them) and began the rustle the documents around as my partner made the point clear that she now worried for what else could have been forged. I then asked for a photocopy of the document that had been forged and he did this, I asked to see the original to compare it to the pre-contract that we signed, I had hold of it for about 3 seconds before he ran around the desk as quick as he could to literally snatch it back from me. This infuriated me so we packed up and walked, it was a terrible ordeal, they could not even explain how the finance totted up in the new but apparently original contract, even though the new one was totally different and had the correct tax price on it.

We picked up the folder and went, got half way home and realized that the salesmen had stolen ALL of our documentation, including the letters addressed to our home and our copies of previous signed contracts. We went straight back but they had locked up and gone up.

I need to know where I stand regarding getting my documents back and my deposit, this is turning into a disaster. As we are 21 and 22 years of age I feel they are trying to take me for a mug. The car is a 13k car is a big commitment to us, I do not trust these people and find it hard to believe that employees at a main Toyota dealership can be so unprofessional, they never once to explain their actions but instead chose to ignore the issues and try and carry on with a sale.

Any advice is greatly welcome as my Father has just gone on holiday!

Thanks in advance,

Jamie

EDIT:

Should we have access to the information and all of the previous paperwork regarding us from Toyota even though they have stolen our copies? The manager was apparently not available as he had gone home already.

cyberbob

Make an appointment with the CAB. This is quite complex I would also be tempted to speak to the police as forgery on contracts is illegal.

standupguy

Dealers do at times change figures to suit themselves, usually to save VAT and if the overall figure that you are paying is the same as you were told then apart from it being unprofessional, you are no worse off and should take a view on whether you want the car.

If not, you will be entitled to a full refund of deposit and you should go and see the dealer principal to make a formal complaint and get your money back.

adam.mt

Standupguy's advice seems sound.

neilmcl

Foxster wrote: »

We picked up the folder and went, got half way home and realized that the salesmen had stolen ALL of our documentation, including the letters addressed to our home and our copies of previous signed contracts. We went straight back but they had locked up and gone up.

How have they "stolen" your documents. By the sound of it in the rush to leave you forgot to ask for your documents back! I think you should be a bit more careful with your choice of words.

smcaul

I would report them to the FSA, I am fairly certain (but stand to be corrected) that someone in the dealership would have to be registered with them to be able to sell the finance - I would think the FSA would take this very seriously!!!

Foxster

Thanks for your reply, I appreciate the variety of opinions. Stolen may have been the wrong word although he did take them all out of our folder whilst I was on the phone outside, as long as I get them back I really don't mind.

Now I appreciate that garages change prices etc to suit them, no problem as long as it doesn't affect us but with the tax coming out cheaper he had tried to keep the extra money tied up elsewhere, that was what I was querying, along with a "lesser" option of Supaguard that had been included which was not agreed on the pre-contract.

I was quite angry last night and missed a few points, I have calmed down a bit today after contacting Toyota head office although I am a bit grumpy due to getting called out at work at 4am! :mad:

Thanks again, I hope to resolve this over the coming week, I do not trust these people, the original sales person contacted my partner whilst I was out this morning to "apologise" on behalf of the poor professionalism of the financial coordinator, the funny thing is that it was this salesman that signed the witness part of the forged document.

Thanks again, very much appreciated.

Jamie

adam.mt

Hope it works out well. Seems the dealership may have been a little over zealous in trying to secure the sale and unprofessional in their actions. Juda's advice would seem sound. Remember though that if they've changed the price (and will no longer honour it) then you're entitled to your deposit back as it wasn't the deal you agreed to.

st999

Seems the dealership may have been a little over zealous in trying to secure the sale

I had an hour or so to spare yesterday while my wife was otherwise engaged, so I went into a car dealership to waste time.

I told the salesman I was just looking, I got all the patter and what are you looking for etc. So I ended up taking a test drive in a car and when we got back I was asked what did I think. I replied good car and because I was in a good mood I answered his questions. Name address DOB etc. So he said do you want a quote and I said why not. 10 mins later I had all the paperwork, just sign here. Do you want a murder on your hands I asked, no way am I signing anything without my wife seeing the car. £100 deposit to keep it till your wife sees it. I don't do deposits says I, I then look at my watch and say must pick up my wife bye and walked out the door.

Just got an email thanking me for buying a new car.

Yeh right! No signature, no deposit, no nothing. dream on.

hippey

standupguy wrote: »

Dealers do at times change figures to suit themselves, usually to save VAT and if the overall figure that you are paying is the same as you were told then apart from it being unprofessional, you are no worse off and should take a view on whether you want the car.

If not, you will be entitled to a full refund of deposit and you should go and see the dealer principal to make a formal complaint and get your money back.

Not all deals will have VAT, it will depend if the car was 'qualifing' or not, normally if it was previously owned by a private person then it will be a margin car and will not have VAT, but if a trade in is involved that is where the figures get altered