Free solar panel discussion

PeterZ_2

digitaltoast wrote: »

No, we look for REALISTIC solutions.

So why is nuclear not a REALISTIC solution? Do you not think that for example 40% nuclear, 20% coal, 20% gas and 20% renewables (solar, wind and hydro etc) makes sense and is realistic?

I hope that is a REALISTIC solution, because thats where we will be in 9 years time!

digitaltoast

PeterZ wrote: »

Now its your turn to start stating the obvious, once again where did I say that solar pv would help at 5pm in december? It doesn't!

Does it help at 10am in March? Yes!
Does it help at midday in June? Yes!
Does it help at 3pm in Spetember? Yes!

There are plenty of other days inthe year when solar pv does help.

Is peak load time of the grid at 5pm in December? Yes!
Is ONE SINGLE LONELY WATT of power being generated by PV? No!
Is the net result precisely the same amount of base-load generation needed as before? Yes!
How does mid-day in June help? You tell me!

PeterZ wrote: »

So why is nuclear not a REALISTIC solution? Do you not think that for example 40% nuclear, 20% coal, 20% gas and 20% renewables (solar, wind and hydro etc) makes sense and is realistic?

I hope that is a REALISTIC solution, because thats where we will be in 9 years time!

Oh !!!!!!, talk about moving the goalposts! I never, ever said anything about nuclear not being realistic. You've also ignored my question about clarifying your statement vs my graphs, you've now bounced off at a random tangent.

Please, feel free to prove me wrong on any of my points, but I don't see you posting one single link of piece of solid evidence to back your points up. I'll respond again when you've got something solid.

Cardew

PeterZ wrote: »

Electricity isnt all about that winters day. We use a lot of electricity in the spring summer and autmun as well.

We have some great engineers in this country and they have already formed their plans for the future of the national grid, see this:

http://www.nationalgrid.com/uk/Electricity/Operating+in+2020/2020+Consultation.htm

No one is saying its going to be easy, but when the gas and oil runs out and gets really expensive we need to have an alternative in place.

You seem like a smart guy and seems a shame that you focus your efforts on trying to shoot others down, rather than looking at positive solutions.

Engineers already have all the solutions.

Nuclear power and coal fired power stations! Plus extract the oil and gas from the plentiful reserves that are currently uneconomic to exploit.

Solar is just a joke in economic terms - we have to pay people over 1,000%(10x) more in subsidies than it costs to produce electricity by conventional means.

grahamc2003

PeterZ wrote: »

So with 15,000MW of solar it could have provided somewhere around 40% of our daytime electricty needs for today.

From the many errors in your recent posts, I'd like to just comment on this one.

If we assume 1kw capacity of installed solar costs around £4k, then 15,000MW would cost £60,000m

grahamc2003

PeterZ wrote: »

We have some great engineers in this country and they have already formed their plans for the future of the national grid, see this:

.

It's quite ironic that you seem to hold a polar opposite view to most of them who post on here!

Your posts are misconception after misconception. In the above, you don't seem to realise that ngc engineers will implement government policy as best they can, and they will not make that policy, in fact, these days they will have virtually no input to that policy whatsoever.

Do you think we would be facing a very serious energy gap in a few years if senior ngc engineers were influential at the policy level?

zeupater

Hi All

Love the 'Bell Curve' pv output from 8th April ..... the problem is that bell curves like this are not at all typical. Take today for example. By 8am (the grid peak mentioned) with a cloudless sky my system was producing <5%kWp, by midday the output was ~70%kWp and ramping up, then the clouds came out to play turning what started off as a smooth bell curve into a jagged mess resembling a cluster of termite hills .... at 3pm the system was producing <15% of what is possible at that time on a sunny day ...... The nearest to a bell curve I've had this month was also on the 8th, the same day as referenced, however, the sky was particularly hazy that day, therefore despite the total lack of cloud cover the system peaked at around 80%kWp.

HTH
Z

PeterZ_2

digitaltoast wrote: »

Is peak load time of the grid at 5pm in December? Yes!
Is ONE SINGLE LONELY WATT of power being generated by PV? No!
Is the net result precisely the same amount of base-load generation needed as before? Yes!
How does mid-day in June help? You tell me!



Oh !!!!!!, talk about moving the goalposts! I never, ever said anything about nuclear not being realistic. You've also ignored my question about clarifying your statement vs my graphs, you've now bounced off at a random tangent.

Please, feel free to prove me wrong on any of my points, but I don't see you posting one single link of piece of solid evidence to back your points up. I'll respond again when you've got something solid.

Wow, talk about not getting it!

You and the other doomers are so hung up on base load that you are all missing the point!

Yet again, please show me the post where I said anything about solar pv generating at 5pm on a decembers day?

On mid day in June in June we are using electricity, please correct me if I'm wrong!

During daylight hours solar pv will be generating electricity

That electricity doesn't just disapear, it gets used. This reduces the demand on the grid. The national grid are in charge of balancing demand, which varies dramatically throught the day, as per your graph! What do you think happens at half time during the footie? The demand soars!

The solar pv reduces the demand on the grid and the amount of fuel consumed.

I challenge you to prove any of the above statements to be inncorrect!

Please go back and read my other posts and stop assuming I've said something different.

PeterZ_2

grahamc2003 wrote: »

From the many errors in your recent posts, I'd like to just comment on this one.

If we assume 1kw capacity of installed solar costs around £4k, then 15,000MW would cost £60,000m

Where is my error? There is no error!

Is 15,000MW not around 40% of our daytime needs? Please show me links and proof!

digital toast was the one who talked about 1 in 4 houses having solar!

I responded to Tiffanys post who had commented on digital toasts post about 1 in 4 being laughable.

PeterZ_2

grahamc2003 wrote: »

It's quite ironic that you seem to hold a polar opposite view to most of them who post on here!

Your posts are misconception after misconception. In the above, you don't seem to realise that ngc engineers will implement government policy as best they can, and they will not make that policy, in fact, these days they will have virtually no input to that policy whatsoever.

Do you think we would be facing a very serious energy gap in a few years if senior ngc engineers were influential at the policy level?

We are not discussing policy. You and the other doomers make it sound as though renewables do not work. When in fact they do and the national grid have plans in place to support an massive increase of renewables by 2020.

The fact remains that the national grid have it all under control.

Of course if national grid had their way we would have demand and supply at fixed levels.

PeterZ_2

zeupater wrote: »

Hi All

Love the 'Bell Curve' pv output from 8th April ..... the problem is that bell curves like this are not at all typical. Take today for example. By 8am (the grid peak mentioned) with a cloudless sky my system was producing <5%kWp, by midday the output was ~70%kWp and ramping up, then the clouds came out to play turning what started off as a smooth bell curve into a jagged mess resembling a cluster of termite hills .... at 3pm the system was producing <15% of what is possible at that time on a sunny day ...... The nearest to a bell curve I've had this month was also on the 8th, the same day as referenced, however, the sky was particularly hazy that day, therefore despite the total lack of cloud cover the system peaked at around 80%kWp.

HTH
Z

Did every solar pv system across the country experience the same cloud at the same time? With thousands of systems across the country the output will still follow the bell curve regardless of what happens with your particular system.