Can I charge for wasted time due to incorrect PCN?

lambch0p

Hi,

I've received a PCN from Newham council. The registration on the PCN is my reg, but the vehicle in the supplied photos is not my car (i've never been to Newham). I don't believe this is anything as nefarious as someone cloning my number plate, as it's impossible to read the registration on the vehicle in the images. Clearly, Newhams policy is to 'guess' any characters that cannot be recognised.

I've sent them a letter highlighting the issues with the PCN (I did not provide any photographic evidence, or a copy of my log book at this stage). I've also sent them an invoice for 40 pounds (the rate I charge my clients), to cover the time spent speaking to them on the phone, and writing the letter. Through no fault of my own, I have had to waste over an hour trying to resolve this, and i'm curious to know if I have any legal standing to charge them for this time.

I have offered to provide them with photographic evidence for a reasonable fee of 80 pounds (I'm a photographer, so 2 hours to take, process, print and send the images is a reasonable amount of time). :rotfl:

Thanks

peter_the_piper

Total waste of time imho. Its hard enough to get them to admit they are wrong.

lambch0p

I'm fairly sure it is a waste of time, but if I have a legal leg to stand on, i'm quite prepared to pursue it voraciously.

anewman

If they don't want to pay the fees you charge, but are happy to pay court fees to take you to court and lose, then that's their problem really isn't it. I mean taking you to court has no hope of ever being successful as the car is not yours. In a court of law I understand you should be able to claim your expenses from the council for wasting your time in association with the court case, so things like loss of earnings for attending court. It's up to them to prove guilt, and not for you to prove innocence. I know the world is moving towards a guilty until proven innocent ideology, but supposedly the courts one is the reverse.

You have already made a reasonable effort to inform them the car is not yours, and they should be able to figure this out with the details they got from the DVLA if they keep adequate photographs and records.

lambch0p

DO NOT IGNORE THIS NOTICE



Dear Sir/Madam,

Thank you for the Penalty Charge Notice you sent me last week, dated 20/07/2010.

On inspecting the PCN, I noticed that it detailed my vehicles registration number. I then noted that it had originated from Newham. This caused me some confusion, as I have not been to, or through Newham in at least 15 years, and have no immediate plans to break that hiatus, in fact I can safely say that I will not deliberately venture into Newham for as long as I live.

Somewhat baffled, I called your Parking Management team, and the operator agreed that the registration mark on the vehicle that was alleged to have committed the offence was illegible.

I then turned to the last sheet of the PCN, and saw the photos. This caused me even more confusion, as it wasn’t even vaguely close to being my vehicle. The one concession is that they are both Peugeots. Not being familiar with the commercial Peugeot van offering, I performed the basic check of going to the Peugeot website, clicking on the ‘Vans’ link and perusing their selection. After approximately 6 seconds, I was able to determine that the van in the photographs on the PCN, was a Peugeot Expert. A white, Peugeot Expert. This is fairly different to my vehicle, which is a silver\blue Peugeot Partner Combi. You can confirm this by texting my registration (XXXX XXX) to 83600, this is an SMS based service that will provide you with the details of the car that bears that registration mark, or by contacting the DVLA.

On that basis, please cancel this PCN and send me an apology.

I’m curious about your procedure for dealing with license plates that are unreadable in the images taken by your enforcement cameras. Do you just randomly select any missing letters? Perhaps some due diligence is in order. You will find the Vehicle Registration Tool, mentioned above (the 83600 text service) a most efficacious solution when dealing with ambiguous registration characters. Also a good pair of glasses can help. SpecSavers do 2-for-1 deals, so I’d recommend them.

I would have happily let this go, but your PCN stated in very bold letters ‘DO NOT IGNORE THIS NOTICE’, which I feel is an explicit request for me to devote some time to dealing with it. I therefore enclose an invoice for £40.00 which is a charge for one hour of my time (at my standard hourly rate). I would appreciate it if you would settle this invoice within 28 days so that I can avoid beginning proceedings against you. If you would like me to provide you with images of my logbook and vehicle, please let me know. I can provide this service for a very reasonable £80.00.

Coblcris

anewman,
Court has nothing to do with this.

lambch0p,
You should expect Newham to ignore your appeal to the NTO. They will, by policy, engage the adjudication process. In all likelihood they will drop out just a few days before the hearing however you can withhold your consent for the hearing to be cancelled and proceed to claim costs.
Ignoring your NTO appeal would be wholly vexatious on their part in my opinion.

anewman

How would the fine be enforced if it were not paid? I assumed courts would be involved then as the Council and Police fines are reputedly unignorable.

Lirin

It's actually a pretty funny letter....

Meepster

OP - I've just spent 15 minutes of my time reading your drivel...

As a result you now owe me £8.75 for the time I have wasted. I will happily accept this payment by cheque, PayPal or milk tokens...

Regards

Meepster

Coblcris

anewman wrote: »

How would the fine be enforced if it were not paid? I assumed courts would be involved then as the Council and Police fines are reputedly unignorable.

Your assumption is incorrect. There is no court involvement. Paper is issued by TEC bulk processing centre and if it runs to the bailiff stage they operate as private bailiffs not court bailiffs. See Part 75 of the Civil Procedure Rules.

Coblcris

Is there a point of fact or procedure you wish to make ?