Garage charged 3-10x parts markup - advice?

Hammyman

newbie007 wrote: »

Well you live and learn. Others have raise this issue, were all the work needed to be done, thats the question. With the wheel bearing, you can hear a knocking noise whilst driving, it becomes louder when the bearing gets worse.

Err, no. By the time you hear a knocking noise, its at the point of catastrophic failure. Firstly its picked up by testing for play. As it gets worse, you get a drone when turning the wheel in one direction. Next stage is a constant drone and finally the one you mentioned just before it falls to bits and the wheel parts company with the car.

Hammyman

Strider590 wrote: »

^^ So trading standards don't care as long as you agree'd to be ripped off? I don't think it works that way.

Of course it does. A company are free to charge whatever they like for something, just as much as you're free to say "no thanks, I'll go somewhere else".

goldspanners

Heliflyguy wrote: »

:rotfl:

Its unfortunately a necessity in this modern age for most.

but not a right. the government beleive bank accounts are now a basic human right, they don't feel the same about everyone owning a car.

psdie

Any more input on what markup is typical / reasonable in people's experience? Goal being to draw up typical job costs for future reference for myself and other MSE members - could be a useful resource (e.g., as a forum sticky).

@eschaton - they would have said automated comparison services for insurance products, holidays, etc were "totally unworkable" 10 years ago, due to the perception that there are too many variables. Or even something like Parker's/Glass's Guide valuations. I don't buy that having no idea of appropriate cost is the MSE way!


There's nothing "unworkable" with coming up with a rough guide to expected price brackets for common jobs - e.g., replace front discs and pads takes roughly 30 mins (made up!) multiplied by advertised labour rate. 2 x discs + pads have raw parts cost of around £40-£80 (?), plus typical garage parts markup of - say - 50%. Result:

• Replacing front disc + pads (non-dealer, average vehicle, commodity parts): roughly 20-30 mins labour, roughly £60-£120 inc VAT parts (inc mark up).

After plenty of refining through feedback, it seems like a useful potential MSE resource to me! And of course the wonder of having guidelines is that it promotes greater consistency across the industry - good for the consumer and evens out customer expectations for the garage. If pricing guidelines can work for MOTs, why not common maintanance jobs?

Anyone fancy a go at rough times for common maintenance jobs? Care to correct my front discs + brakes example for a start? :beer:

goldspanners

psdie wrote: »

If pricing guidelines can work for MOTs, why not common maintanance jobs?

Anyone fancy a go at rough times for common maintenance jobs? Care to correct my front discs + brakes example for a start? :beer:

an MOT doesn't involve wrestling with rusty bolts,broken studs,seized parts.
a price comparison website would have to be estimate based rather than qoutes given. this in turn could then lead to really low estimates being given by unscrupulous garages and then you finding a much higher bill at the end of the job.

you can get fixed price servicing,but fixed price repairs would leave garages wide open to loosing a lot of money.

some main dealers will offer book times for some repairs,but independant garages working on every make and model under the sun couldn't always do this.
an honest garage will give you worst case scenario price and then charge less if it takes less time/parts. but not all garages are honest.

your best bet is to get a quote from the garage before authorising any work to be done.

eschaton

psdie wrote: »

Any more input on what markup is typical / reasonable in people's experience? Goal being to draw up typical job costs for future reference for myself and other MSE members - could be a useful resource (e.g., as a forum sticky).

@eschaton - they would have said automated comparison services for insurance products, holidays, etc were "totally unworkable" 10 years ago, due to the perception that there are too many variables. Or even something like Parker's/Glass's Guide valuations. I don't buy that having no idea of appropriate cost is the MSE way!



There's nothing "unworkable" with coming up with a rough guide to expected price brackets for common jobs - e.g., replace front discs and pads takes roughly 30 mins (made up!) multiplied by advertised labour rate. 2 x discs + pads have raw parts cost of around £40-£80 (?), plus typical garage parts markup of - say - 50%. Result:

• Replacing front disc + pads (non-dealer, average vehicle, commodity parts): roughly 20-30 mins labour, roughly £60-£120 inc VAT parts (inc mark up).

After plenty of refining through feedback, it seems like a useful potential MSE resource to me! And of course the wonder of having guidelines is that it promotes greater consistency across the industry - good for the consumer and evens out customer expectations for the garage. If pricing guidelines can work for MOTs, why not common maintanance jobs?

Anyone fancy a go at rough times for common maintenance jobs? Care to correct my front discs + brakes example for a start? :beer:

Still don't agree. I might give more detail tomorrow when I am not tired but the comparison you made to insurance etc.. is just not the same.

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZz

psdie

Hi Goldspanners - the idea isn't to hold garages to fixed price fees, but to give customers a clearer idea of the rough cost of common maintenance. This works both ways: it highlights if a garage is taking the Michael .. but equally would reassure customers that apparently pricey work (like the Micra's wheel bearings) is actually reasonable value!

goldspanners wrote: »

some main dealers will offer book times for some repairs,but independant garages working on every make and model under the sun couldn't always do this.

What I'm proposing is akin to making public the rough "book times" for common jobs (bracketed by broad car groups if it makes a big difference), along with guidelines to typical reasonable price ranges for commodity parts.

goldspanners wrote: »

an honest garage will give you worst case scenario price and then charge less if it takes less time/parts. but not all garages are honest. your best bet is to get a quote from the garage before authorising any work to be done.

Again, in practice the garage usually *doesn't know* what work is going to be required until they've carried out at least some strip down examination work, which presumably needs to be paid for regardless of whether we decide to proceed. I've never had a garage give "worst case" pricing up-front - it's always (across various garages) gone up as new issues are "discovered".

RE getting a quote before authorising: of course, I always do, and most garages will volunteer this. The problem is that you get the garage rep on the phone saying you need X, Y and Z and they'll cost £XX. Most people, myself included, have little idea whether £XX is reasonable for the work. The quote is almost inevitably accompanied by "your car is dangerous until that's fixed!", so it makes little difference whether we can actually afford the price being quoted - it just apparently has to be done.

I'd feel so much more confident in this situation if I could ask for a breakdown of the quote, then query if there are any items that are clearly well over the going rate (as those "in the know" can do off the top of their heads!). If this is due to complications, the garage can explain these. If there's no explanation and the garage isn't prepared to improve the quote, we have the option to go elsewhere.

This just isn't possible in practice for the average person at the moment - the garage quotes a high number, tells you it's essential work and you agree through gritted teeth and knotted stomach. And if you're my partner, you then burst into tears because it was supposed to be the holiday money.

Inactive

Strider590 wrote: »

^^ So trading standards don't care as long as you agree'd to be ripped off? I don't think it works that way.

I think that you will find it does.

If you buy say a pint of milk in Tesco for say £1.50, then find the same item in Lidl for a quid, do you honestly think that Trading Standards will care?

vaio

There is a “reasonableness test”, say I drop my car off at a garage and say fix the exhaust which they do and then give me a bill for £500 when the normal going rate would be £80, then trading standards and (ultimately the courts) would say it was unreasonable

It doesn’t apply if, as in this case, the punter has agreed the price before the work was done

goldspanners

Inactive wrote: »

I think that you will find it does.

If you buy say a pint of milk in Tesco for say £1.50, then find the same item in Lidl for a quid, do you honestly think that Trading Standards will care?

the only way they would think you've been ripped off is if you get home to find the milk isn't milk its actually water.

garages are a free market and if you don't like thier price try another.