How are third and pass degrees regarded these days?

studentphil

I still think looking for a bit of achievement in someone's work is not a bad thing. Then constructive feedback is what is needed. Rubbishing people's work just demovitivates them.

alibongo42

I totally agree with those of you who say that it depends which Uni you went to and which subject you took. Certainly in my experience, getting a 2:1 (or whatever) at one college/uni was in no way equal to getting the same degree class elsewhere.

I did a difficult degree in Chemical Engineering at a good Uni and struggled through four years (bad subject choice - didn't have any better ideas once I realised - in the end just wanted "a degree" to compete in the job market) to get an unclassified honours degree (higher than a Pass, lower than a 3rd). Try explaining that one to potential employers! As far as I know it's only possible in engineering degrees.
My then-boyfriend did a relatively easy degree at a college that was affiliated to my Uni. His lecturers prepped his class on upcoming exam questions and gave them numerous attempts at assignments. He graduated with a 2:1 and on his certificate it looks like he went to the same Uni as me!

The sad truth, however, is that major companies often will not even hand you an application form at careers fairs if you don't have at least a 2:1, regardless of what it's in. I can understand that they have thousands of applications and have to narrow the field somehow, but they must miss out on loads of strong candidates. On numerous occassions I had employers at careers fairs who had absolutely no idea whether they could let me apply, because I had an unclassified honours degree AND a Masters degree. Because I didn't fit nicely into their 2:1 minimum tick-box, they got very confused.

Anyway, that was all six years ago now. As time (and jobs) go by, I find myself working in places that have a complete mixture of graduates and non graduates doing exactly the same jobs for the same money. And scarily, quite often the non graduates are less naive and more able!

studentphil

alibongo42 wrote:

I totally agree with those of you who say that it depends which Uni you went to and which subject you took. Certainly in my experience, getting a 2:1 (or whatever) at one college/uni was in no way equal to getting the same degree class elsewhere.

I did a difficult degree in Chemical Engineering at a good Uni and struggled through four years (bad subject choice - didn't have any better ideas once I realised - in the end just wanted "a degree" to compete in the job market) to get an unclassified honours degree (higher than a Pass, lower than a 3rd). Try explaining that one to potential employers! As far as I know it's only possible in engineering degrees.
My then-boyfriend did a relatively easy degree at a college that was affiliated to my Uni. His lecturers prepped his class on upcoming exam questions and gave them numerous attempts at assignments. He graduated with a 2:1 and on his certificate it looks like he went to the same Uni as me!

The sad truth, however, is that major companies often will not even hand you an application form at careers fairs if you don't have at least a 2:1, regardless of what it's in. I can understand that they have thousands of applications and have to narrow the field somehow, but they must miss out on loads of strong candidates. On numerous occassions I had employers at careers fairs who had absolutely no idea whether they could let me apply, because I had an unclassified honours degree AND a Masters degree. Because I didn't fit nicely into their 2:1 minimum tick-box, they got very confused.

Anyway, that was all six years ago now. As time (and jobs) go by, I find myself working in places that have a complete mixture of graduates and non graduates doing exactly the same jobs for the same money. And scarily, quite often the non graduates are less naive and more able!

It is a strange one different staandards in different unis

talksalot81

Something that seems to be overlooked... how the degree is regarded is in fact a minor point. The reason for doing the degree is to learn! The grade is a sideline.

Everyone seems hooked into what employers think but I am strongly of the opinion that those who work harder, learn and understand more will work their way through the system more effectively than someone who didnt (irrelevant of the grades achieved).

If you get to the end of your degree and have no more to ask than "Is my 2.2 really going to make me noticed?", then I think you have somewhat missed the point of an education. That is not meant aimed at any one person, it is a reflection of the system. Just look at the modular system... cram some info in, do an exam, forget the information. The whole thing is geared towards getting a grade, learning has become the sideline. Really sad

studentphil

I would say my course has bastly changed me as a person with out doubt very positively.

talksalot81

In which case your grade is of minor importance. You dont need the grade and the associated impression, you should be able to get just as far, all on your own, with the skills you have obtained. If you believe that and can prove that, then your degree time has been very well spent.

studentphil

talksalot81 wrote:

In which case your grade is of minor importance. You dont need the grade and the associated impression, you should be able to get just as far, all on your own, with the skills you have obtained. If you believe that and can prove that, then your degree time has been very well spent.

I think my degree even though I do dislike it sometimes has been a really good thing for me intelligence and skills wise.

BigBouncyBall

WOW studentPhil! Are you on my course? I've just read this and related to EVERTHING you've said. I'm on the wrong course and can't wait to finish. I too am in a dept where no lecturer knows a student and the feedback system is a shambles. I know exactly how you're feeling at the moment too. I'm sitting on a 3rd with one year to go and i too think that a 2.2 at the end of the course will be a great achievement for me personally and I'll be bloody proud of myself. You should be too. If you end up with a 2.2 i'm sure you'll look back in 5 years time (as you do about GCSE's now!?) and see that getting less than a 2.1 is not a fast track to the gutter and it is so not true what people drum into you that if you don't get a 2.1 then thats the end of the line.

I think it's very difficult for the people on these boards to understand what life is like of you're on a course like ours where no matter how much effort you put in you seem to get diddly-squat credit for it (and others seem to be finding it all so easy hmm?). Its also very difficult to understand what its like living in this situation 24/7. No disrespect to any of the people who are talking here (seriously i mean that - i know everyone is here to help) but you read the problems, answer with some 'advice', log off and go back to the small, but important, dramas of your own life. While people like studentphil (and myself) are left with the problems seeing no way out.

To you Phil i would say you need to talk to someone outside of your family/friends and outside of the university councilling service who, while having all the good intentions in the world are usually full of people sitting on 1st's doing some CV building volutary work. Perhaps it would be better to post on another forum too (this is money saving after all lol) you might get a different response (dont try thestudentroom.co.uk though - its full of smug 18 year olds weighing up whether to go to uni at cambridge or harvard or whether to take 6 A-Levels or 7 or what PhD to do when they cruise through Astrophysics)

I'm not going to patronise and advise you get a tutor because i know as well as you do that its not about that. I'm also gingerly trying to suggest you see a doctor. I was in a very similar frame of mind to you at the start of the summer. I went and he diagnosed me with mild depression. No drugs were prescibed mind you but he did talk to me about uni and ways to change the situation i'm in. I feel better now. I'm exercising and getting away from the troubles of uni and have finally realised (only taken two years!) that university is not a right of passage or a way of life - in a way its just an extension of school. 3 (or 4) years and your out of there with a piece of paper saying what you got.

Good luck. I hope whatever happens you can be happy with whatever you get.

studentphil

BigBouncyBall wrote:

WOW studentPhil! Are you on my course? I've just read this and related to EVERTHING you've said. I'm on the wrong course and can't wait to finish. I too am in a dept where no lecturer knows a student and the feedback system is a shambles. I know exactly how you're feeling at the moment too. I'm sitting on a 3rd with one year to go and i too think that a 2.2 at the end of the course will be a great achievement for me personally and I'll be bloody proud of myself. You should be too. If you end up with a 2.2 i'm sure you'll look back in 5 years time (as you do about GCSE's now!?) and see that getting less than a 2.1 is not a fast track to the gutter and it is so not true what people drum into you that if you don't get a 2.1 then thats the end of the line.

I think it's very difficult for the people on these boards to understand what life is like of you're on a course like ours where no matter how much effort you put in you seem to get diddly-squat credit for it (and others seem to be finding it all so easy hmm?). Its also very difficult to understand what its like living in this situation 24/7. No disrespect to any of the people who are talking here (seriously i mean that - i know everyone is here to help) but you read the problems, answer with some 'advice', log off and go back to the small, but important, dramas of your own life. While people like studentphil (and myself) are left with the problems seeing no way out.

To you Phil i would say you need to talk to someone outside of your family/friends and outside of the university councilling service who, while having all the good intentions in the world are usually full of people sitting on 1st's doing some CV building volutary work. Perhaps it would be better to post on another forum too (this is money saving after all lol) you might get a different response (dont try thestudentroom.co.uk though - its full of smug 18 year olds weighing up whether to go to uni at cambridge or harvard or whether to take 6 A-Levels or 7 or what PhD to do when they cruise through Astrophysics)

I'm not going to patronise and advise you get a tutor because i know as well as you do that its not about that. I'm also gingerly trying to suggest you see a doctor. I was in a very similar frame of mind to you at the start of the summer. I went and he diagnosed me with mild depression. No drugs were prescibed mind you but he did talk to me about uni and ways to change the situation i'm in. I feel better now. I'm exercising and getting away from the troubles of uni and have finally realised (only taken two years!) that university is not a right of passage or a way of life - in a way its just an extension of school. 3 (or 4) years and your out of there with a piece of paper saying what you got.

Good luck. I hope whatever happens you can be happy with whatever you get.

Thanks, I know really when all is said and done a 2.2 will not be the end of my life and I probably be able to have just as good career with a 2.2 as 1st, do a masters and get something like the jobs I would want.
Best of luck to you too!

talksalot81

BigBouncyBall,

You should beware of your words because you are almost giving the impression of 'putting down' those who are 'finding it easy'. You must remember that there will be people who are highly intelligent and any normal person will see them as 'finding it easy'. Anyone thinking a third is good enough and disliking derrogative remarks should not in anyway be putting down those who are at the very top of their subject! That will simply perpetuate the cycle! If you want a bit of credit for your third, you should be giving a barrel load of credit to those who get a first!!!