Made Redundant or not? - Do I have a Claim?

ABARKIE

Hi
Here is a chronology of events that I wonder if my father is entitled to a redundancy settlement or an unfair dismissal claim
He is 80 and for 15 years has worked for 3 days a week for his employer until recently.
On 22nd June 2010 he was invited to an impromptu meeting where he was told by his MD and manager that the order book had declined and my father was being laid off.
He asked if this meant his employment was being terminated and he was told that it was a shame to let good people go, but that was the way it was.
He was given no notice of the meeting and was not allowed a witness to attend.
He said he had a job to finished and they said fine, if he could do that would be great and they would like to be able to call upon him in the future for his technical skill but he could not continue after fininshing his current task.

Next day he attended work and finished his jobs and left once completed as his washer flooded the kitchen at home.
The following week he called requesting his final remuneration, payslip and P45 and if it contained redundancy.
He was then telephoned by the general manger and told that he had not been made redundant as this would cost the company a fortune.
The general manger said he was only prepared to pay £21 a day for the foreseeable future.
My father stated that he was unhappy with chain of events as he clearly understood he had bee made redundant at the meeting of 22nd June 2010.
The general manger then stated that if he was not happy he could always retire.
The following day my father rung and said he would retire to which the general manager said he needed this in writing.
My father went to work and wrote a letter as requesting resigning, but stating he was clear he had been made redundant.
He went to collect his wages this Friday and was offered 3 days pay at £21.
He left after collecting this money.

In summary does he have a claim for redundancy or unfair dismissal or nothing?
I believe he has been coerced into resigning into avoid paying him his rightful redundancy

Thanks for any replies / help in advance

RobertoMoir

Consult ACAS and a solicitor. It's pretty clear this isn't a case of crossed wires or misplaced paperwork. You might get some interesting and even useful opinions here, but something like this needs to be placed into proper hands as soon as possible.

LittleVoice

Some points:

1 Does he get a company pension from this job - does that follow a resignation to retire?

2 The £21 was for not working (if I understand it correctly) - otherwise he would not have been receiving NMW (if the days were full days) and that would not be lawful. With fifteen years' service, he was entitled to 12 weeks notice. That notice should be paid at whatever his normal rate was - and he would accrue holiday during that period too.

3 Though he is over 65, he would be entitled to statutory redundancy pay. To avoid this, the company could make him retire - but an employer needs to give six months' notice if they are forcing a retirement.

ABARKIE

LittleVoice wrote: »

Some points:

1 Does he get a company pension from this job - does that follow a resignation to retire?

No he does not

LittleVoice wrote: »

2 The £21 was for not working (if I understand it correctly) - otherwise he would not have been receiving NMW (if the days were full days) and that would not be lawful. With fifteen years' service, he was entitled to 12 weeks notice. That notice should be paid at whatever his normal rate was - and he would accrue holiday during that period too.

They are saying the £21 is lay off pay per day

LittleVoice wrote: »

3 Though he is over 65, he would be entitled to statutory redundancy pay. To avoid this, the company could make him retire - but an employer needs to give six months' notice if they are forcing a retirement.

So he would have a claim for redundancy then?

getmore4less

Does the contract allow for lay off?

description here.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Understandingyourworkstatus/Temporarylayoff/DG_10026693

LittleVoice

ABARKIE wrote: »

re another company pension - No he does not

So there was no point in their suggesting he "retire", they were actually inviting him to resign, not retire.

re pay rate - They are saying the £21 is lay off pay per day

re redundancy pay - So he would have a claim for redundancy then?

The claim would be on the company to pay: he would have to prove that the company had dismissed him on the grounds of redundancy. The problem is that he resigned rather than getting a letter from them dismissing him. Redundancy pay is when a company dismisses on the grounds of redundancy, not when an employee resigns because he understands he is redundant. However, if he had been laid off for four weeks because there was no work, then he could have insisted the company make his position redundant and pay accordingly.

He needs to see an employment lawyer and take the copy of the letter that he wrote and any contractual documents he has.

Ewarwoowar2

There are specific provisions in the Employment Rights Act 1996 to prevent an employer from avoiding liability for redundancy pay by laying off an employee rather than dismissing him (see Employment Rights Act 1996 s.135(1)(b), ERA 1996 s.147 and ERA 1996 s.148 ). So even though he has not been dismissed an employee who is laid off or put on short time may be entitled to resign and claim statutory redundancy pay.

Lay off is made an exception to the normal rule that there must be a dismissal before a person can claim redundancy pay. Employees with two years qualifying service whose pay is directly linked to hours worked or output achieved may be able to claim redundancy pay even though there has been no dismissal. To do so they must serve appropriate notices and must resign (ERA 1996 s.135(1)(b) combined with ERA 1996 s.147, ERA 1996 s.148 and ERA 1996 s.150).


You can see it's a bit complicated. Your father could check to see if he has employment tribunal litigation insurance as part of his home contents insurance. Alternatively, see what ACAS or the CAB say. My concern for him is that these rights are not that well know. Therefore, a CAB or ACAS advisor might not know how to make these claims. You might need a proper employment solicitor or do a bit of research yourself and present the claim for him.


Here's a useful leaflet to get you started:


http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=814

Googlewhacker

if he is 80 could the company not just have retired him or do they only get the one chance of this at 65?

Ewarwoowar2

Googlewhacker wrote: »

if he is 80 could the company not just have retired him or do they only get the one chance of this at 65?

They should have. They would have had to go through the proper procedure: six month's notice of retirement date, opportunity to request working beyond retirement date, etc... They haven't done this, so retirement is not at issue.

Googlewhacker

Ewarwoowar2 wrote: »

They should have. They would have had to go through the proper procedure: six month's notice of retirement date, opportunity to request working beyond retirement date, etc... They haven't done this, so retirement is not at issue.

It was more for my interest than anything. Thanks.