Forced to leave joint tenancy by ex - where do I stand?

a_gerbil

I signed a 6 months joint tenancy with my ex-parter (same sex relatonshionship) with her mum as a guarantor starting 1st Feb 2010.

Things were a bit iffy from the start then in May she started getting violent towards me, constant head games and by the end of May it was getting to the point where she was periodically taking my keys off me forcing me to spend nights with freinds.

At the begining of June I couldnt cope with it anymore, and I took what I could fit in my car when she was at work and left. A few days later I went back to the property when she was at work with my parents to collect the rest of my stuff only to find she's locked all the doors so I cant get in anymore, even with my keys.


What I need to know is


1) I'm going to pay my half of the rent till the end of the 6 months,
but i've been told by the agency that she is staying on after the 6
months and she will only has to gives 1 months notice after the 6 months if she wants to leave. So will I be liable if she stops paying the rent after the 6 months period?


2) My ex says she will not let me enter the house but will put all my
stuff in the garage for me to collect, as I don't trust her I would
like to have a check around the house with my parents to make sure shes not kept anything of mine. I've spoken to the agency and they say its nothing to do with them and cant help me get in. So how do I get back in to the house without having to break in, which I dont want to do anyway?


3) At the same time my ex on a few occations has said she's going to dispose of all my stuff. Is this illegal ?


4) The deposit was paid into a deposit scheme of which I am the lead tenant. After the 6 months is up am I going to be able to get my half of it back?


Any advice would be greatful
A

BitterAndTwisted

a_gerbil wrote: »

What I need to know is


1) I'm going to pay my half of the rent till the end of the 6 months,
but i've been told by the agency that she is staying on after the 6
months and she will only has to gives 1 months notice after the 6 months if she wants to leave. So will I be liable if she stops paying the rent after the 6 months period?

You should consider giving notice in writing before the 1st of July. One person on a joint-tenancy giving notice is giving notice for both parties. That way, should your ex-partner wish to continue living in the property she will need to sign a new AST as the sole tenant rather than going onto a rolling, periodic tenancy with the same terms and conditions as before, and with you on the agreement. In general, should one party fail to pay their half of the rent the landlord will generally chase the party who is easier to find and in this case that's your ex. Who also has a guarantor.

2) My ex says she will not let me enter the house but will put all my
stuff in the garage for me to collect, as I don't trust her I would
like to have a check around the house with my parents to make sure shes not kept anything of mine. I've spoken to the agency and they say its nothing to do with them and cant help me get in. So how do I get back in to the house without having to break in, which I don't want to do anyway?

The agency are correct, they are not in a position to help you now that your ex has changed the locks. As you are still on the tenancy agreement you would have the right to break in but as you don't want to there is nothing you can do legally to gain access if your ex is intent on preventing you doing so.


3) At the same time my ex on a few occasions has said she's going to dispose of all my stuff. Is this illegal ?

I'm sorry I can't advise you on this.


4) The deposit was paid into a deposit scheme of which I am the lead tenant. After the 6 months is up am I going to be able to get my half of it back?

You will if you give notice to end the agreement at the end of the six month AST but you need to be quick. As you're the lead tenant all of the monies should be returned to you, not half, IF the property is returned in exactly the same condition as at the start of the agreement. Have you received notification from your landlord about which deposit protection scheme your deposit is held in?


Any advice would be grateful

I suggest you use the return of your ex's half of the deposit as leverage to ensure you have all of your stuff returned safely and that the property is returned in tip-top condition, even if you have to go back there and help to clean it.

I'm assuming that there was a full inventory which you signed at the start of the tenancy.

a_gerbil

Many Thanks for the advice

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

You should consider giving notice in writing before the 1st of July. One person on a joint-tenancy giving notice is giving notice for both parties. That way, should your ex-partner wish to continue living in the property she will need to sign a new AST as the sole tenant rather than going onto a rolling, periodic tenancy with the same terms and conditions as before, and with you on the agreement.

If thats the case I'll walk in the and hand my notice it in by hand before the 1st July. Do you know if there's any internet sites that confirm the law in this area as I couldnt find anything regarding the exact wording of the law. My ex's mum who is the guarantor rents her own propertys and knows the law so I have to make sure everthing is 100% correct, and I can't afford solicitors.

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

The agency are correct, they are not in a position to help you now that your ex has changed the locks. As you are still on the tenancy agreement you would have the right to break in but as you don't want to there is nothing you can do legally to gain access if your ex is intent on preventing you doing so.

Apparantly she's not changed the locks, shes put the lock/catch on the front door and using the back door which I don't have a key for. I surgested to the agency that I get a locksmith to open the door but apparantly that will involve changing the locks which is not allowed under the terms of the agreement. I also want to be there to make sure the place is clean prior to the inventory but I can't see how I can if she refuses to let me in.

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

Have you received notification from your landlord about which deposit protection scheme your deposit is held in?

I've got a copy of the inventory and the deposit is held by The Deposit Protection Service.

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

I suggest you use the return of your ex's half of the deposit as leverage to ensure you have all of your stuff returned safely and that the property is returned in tip-top condition, even if you have to go back there and help to clean it.

That's a good idea I think I'm going to need to use that.

BitterAndTwisted

a_gerbil wrote: »

Many Thanks for the advice




If thats the case I'll walk in the and hand my notice it in by hand before the 1st July. Do you know if there's any internet sites that confirm the law in this area as I couldn't find anything regarding the exact wording of the law. My ex's mum who is the guarantor rents her own properties and knows the law so I have to make sure everything is 100% correct, and I can't afford solicitors.

I don't believe there's any formal wording required as long as your notice in writing is clear and unambiguous. Something along the lines of: "The six-month AST for the property at X address is coming to an end on 31st of July and I would like to give formal notice that we wish to vacate on or before that date. Please contact me on telephone number XXX to arrange the final check-out and return of the keys". Don't forget to keep a copy of this letter for your own records. You might need it.




Apparently she's not changed the locks, shes put the lock/catch on the front door and using the back door which I don't have a key for. I suggested to the agency that I get a locksmith to open the door but apparently that will involve changing the locks which is not allowed under the terms of the agreement. I also want to be there to make sure the place is clean prior to the inventory but I can't see how I can if she refuses to let me in.

I agree, I can't see a simple solution other than threatening to hold her share of the deposit to ransom.




I've got a copy of the inventory and the deposit is held by The Deposit Protection Service.

What you're seeking to do by giving formal notice is to prevent your ex from trying to get the tenancy to go onto a periodic one with you tied to all the terms in the original agreement and tied to continuing to pay the rent after the end of July until the tenancy finally ends. Whenever that may be.

a_gerbil

**** Update ****

Firstly thanks for all the advice.

I've been allowed to collect some of my stuff from the house but refused entry to check it and she still has a small amount of electrical items of mine.

I wrote to the letting agency advising I wished to vacate at the end of the 6 months period, which they accepted. However, I spoke to them today and they told me they only intend to release half of the deposit and use the other half for my ex to continue to live in the house!! can they do this??

Many Thanks

DVardysShadow

a_gerbil wrote: »

**** Update ****

You have a fight on your hands and a difficult legal point to prevail on. Now, I believe that as the tenancy is a joint and several agreement, by giving notice, the whole tenancy is ended. It is reasonable to me. But you need to be able to win this point and I cannot back it up.

From that, it follows that the deposit in its entirety is returnable- to you as lead tenant. Your ex must stump up a new deposit while waiting for you to return her share.

pinkshoes

a_gerbil wrote: »

The deposit was paid into a deposit scheme of which I am the lead tenant. After the 6 months is up am I going to be able to get my half of it back?

a_gerbil wrote: »

However, I spoke to them today and they told me they only intend to release half of the deposit and use the other half for my ex to continue to live in the house!! can they do this??

If you only paid half the deposit, then I'm not sure what the issue is if you'll be getting your half back. I presume they'll ask your ex to top up the other half if she wishes to stay??

nembot

If you have proof of tenancy, any decent locksmith will get you in without the necessity of changing locks. Unless that is it's the registered key type, which would require the buildings owner for a copy to be made (pretty rare for a house/flat).

Easiest way, without being charged for a callout fee is take a picture on your phone, go to the local locksmith and let them have a look - they'll give you a yay or a nay on the spot.

Generally, these will be almost half the price of the mobile guys (sorry if any are reading, it's MSE) but they may have to do it after hours, say 6pm'ish.

Depend how much your remaining items are worth, good luck!

Fire_Fox

a_gerbil wrote: »

**** Update ****

Firstly thanks for all the advice.

I've been allowed to collect some of my stuff from the house but refused entry to check it and she still has a small amount of electrical items of mine.

I wrote to the letting agency advising I wished to vacate at the end of the 6 months period, which they accepted. However, I spoke to them today and they told me they only intend to release half of the deposit and use the other half for my ex to continue to live in the house!! can they do this??

Many Thanks

Do you think the house is in good or poor condition? If your ex is staying on and your half of the deposit is being returned she will end up liable for any damage, only you know if that is in your favour. If it is I'd get EVERYTHING in writing.

I agree with the others that the entire tenancy *should* be ended by you serving notice to quit. BUT if your ex does not vacate then the tenancy does not end, you could technically still be liable for half the rent until a court order to evict. Under those circumstances I'd be inclined to accept half the deposit and written confirmation that you are off the AST.

a_gerbil

pinkshoes wrote: »

If you only paid half the deposit, then I'm not sure what the issue is if you'll be getting your half back. I presume they'll ask your ex to top up the other half if she wishes to stay??

The situation with the amount of deposit is when we first moved in we had to pay 2 months rent as a deposit + 1 months rent in advance, which came to £1950. All of it was paid by cash of which I paid 2 thirds (£1300).

The agency have informed me that they have done an inspection and the property is fine. Surely they can only prevent all the deposit going out if either, the rent, bills havnt been paid or there is damage to the property.

Also i've been informed that my ex is going to sign a new agreement.



Many Thanks

Planner

I actually disagree with the information you have been given here on serving notice, in particular - One person on a joint-tenancy giving notice is giving notice for both parties. My view is that it isnt possible for 1 tenant in a joint tenancy to serve notice during the fixed term, because this removes the other joint tenants statutory right to a periodic tenancy to arise after the end of the fixed term (Hiousing Act 1988).

I believe, 'legally' you should have served notice just before the end of the 6 months fixed term to leave at the end of month 7 i.e. the first month of the periodic tenancy.

Luckly the Agents havent spotted this!

To summarise - it isnt possible for one tenant in a joint tenancy to unilaterally end the tenancy at the end of the fixed term for both parties. It is possible for one joint tenant to unilaterally end the tenancy after a periodic tenancy as arisen.