Fined by Dentist

DrGrimson

A friend of mine was recently fined £30 by her dentist for turning up 30 mins late...
Well, a bit harsh, I thought: it was a genuine mistake.
And the dentist doesn't pay you when you end up waiting for them.

So is this reasonable, do you think?
Should she pay, or not?
And more to the point, is it legally enforceable?

Toothsmith

Dentists run late for many reasons.

Unexpected things happening during treatment - Would you like the dentist to say "right that's it, time up" whilst a tooth was still only half out?

The previous patient being late

Unexpected emergencies being slotted in
etc etc

If the 30 min slot your friend had wasn't used, then another 30 min slot would have to be used, so a treatment that should have taken half an hour ends up needing an hour. That extra time has to be paid for by somebody.

You can either charge everybody a little bit more to account for the wasted time that occurs, or just charge the people who do the wasting in the hope that if they're charged too often, they'll get the message and go and bother somebody else.

The charge may or may not be enforceable.

If she doesn't pay it, the dentist can refuse to see her again though.

This is unless she's an NHS patient. Charging for missed appointments was banned by the new contract, but if a patient misses more than a couple of appointments, they can be de-registered.

donna-j_2

Toothsmith wrote:

That extra time has to be paid for by somebody.

How about the dentists that charge about £180 an hour pay it? That's considerably more than my hourly rate but denists can waste MY time keeping ME waiting.

DrGrimson

Toothsmith wrote:

Dentists run late for many reasons.

Unexpected things happening during treatment - Would you like the dentist to say "right that's it, time up" whilst a tooth was still only half out?

The previous patient being late

Unexpected emergencies being slotted in
etc etc

If the 30 min slot your friend had wasn't used, then another 30 min slot would have to be used, so a treatment that should have taken half an hour ends up needing an hour. That extra time has to be paid for by somebody.

You can either charge everybody a little bit more to account for the wasted time that occurs, or just charge the people who do the wasting in the hope that if they're charged too often, they'll get the message and go and bother somebody else.

The charge may or may not be enforceable.

If she doesn't pay it, the dentist can refuse to see her again though.

This is unless she's an NHS patient. Charging for missed appointments was banned by the new contract, but if a patient misses more than a couple of appointments, they can be de-registered.

Yes, of course.
We all have busy lives.
Let's say my friend has an important job too, and had to cutail some activity
in order to attend the appointment in the first place, thus inconveniencing herself and someone else.

Fair enough to lose your slot if you are late or whatever.
The dentist can treat someone else, or maybe is over-running anyway.
So they end up making money (if that's what it's all about).
How about the dentist gives my friend a cut of the money they made
during her appointment, when they were treating someone else?

It seems a sad life if we all start fining each other for being late.
And in this case, not very good for "customer retention".

Toothsmith

donna-j wrote:

How about the dentists that charge about £180 an hour pay it? That's considerably more than my hourly rate but denists can waste MY time keeping ME waiting.

How many people do you pay the wages of out of your hourly rate? Are you also responsible for the bills?


A £30 fine for a half hour appointment does not equal £180 per hour.

Therefore the dentist IS paying part of it.

I think the £30 is a slap-on-the-wrist token fine.

If the patient is genuinely sorry for missing the appointment and respects the dentists time then she will pay it.

If the patient thinks the whole world should revolve around her, and the fact she sometimes forgets things is a price people pay for the honour of actually treating her, then it is probably time to find a dentist who agrees with her.

Voyager2002

For once I agree with Toothsmith!

Dentists are highly skilled, and provide an essential service. They deserve respect. And missing appointments, or turning up late, is not only rude but costs money: it can result in several people, as well as expensive equipment and premises, standing idle.

Of course, something unavoidable may happen to the patient, resulting in a missed appointment. In this case an apology and explanation is in order, and depending on the reasons it might be reasonable for the dentist to waive the charge. But this is not something that the patient should expect. Really, no patient should miss an appointment, and having a plicy of charging for missed appointments should merely emphasise to patients that this situation should not arise.

Toothsmith

For once? I thought I was Mr Agreeable!!!:rotfl:

donna-j_2

But then surely if you make an appointment at a specific time then the dentist is also responsible for keeping to it. Why shouldn't we fine them?

DrGrimson

Voyager2002 wrote:

For once I agree with Toothsmith!

Dentists are highly skilled, and provide an essential service. They deserve respect. And missing appointments, or turning up late, is not only rude but costs money: it can result in several people, as well as expensive equipment and premises, standing idle.

Of course.
Everyone deserves respect.

As I said, it is not a case of being rude.
It is a case of a genuine misunderstanding.
And I really doubt that the dentist was standing idle.

DrGrimson

Toothsmith wrote:

How many people do you pay the wages of out of your hourly rate? Are you also responsible for the bills?


A £30 fine for a half hour appointment does not equal £180 per hour.

Therefore the dentist IS paying part of it.

I think the £30 is a slap-on-the-wrist token fine.

If the patient is genuinely sorry for missing the appointment and respects the dentists time then she will pay it.

If the patient thinks the whole world should revolve around her, and the fact she sometimes forgets things is a price people pay for the honour of actually treating her, then it is probably time to find a dentist who agrees with her.

I am assuming that you are a dentist...
and that you have some sort of axe to grind over this issue.
Nevertheless, I don't think it is appropriate to make rude comments
about someone that you don't know, and have never met.

Personally I would prefer to be treated by someone is naturally sympathetic,
rather than hostile. Someone who might be prepared to think that I was
late for some genuine reason rather than immediately assume that I am a nasty person who gets everything I deserve.

But I think you're right about finding a new dentist.

I posted this question because I wanted some genuine unbiased advice
about a fine which I thought was unfair and draconian.
(Maybe not all dentists are pefect, after all)
Instead I just get abused by a self-righteous dentist.
Such is life.

Debras_Angel

Toothsmith wrote:

Dentists run late for many reasons.

This is unless she's an NHS patient. Charging for missed appointments was banned by the new contract, but if a patient misses more than a couple of appointments, they can be de-registered.

Hi Toothsmith,

My husband missed an appointment totally by accident he forgot, it was to have work done for a new crown. They phoned him at work and he did genuinely forget (we live approx 50 miles from the dentist so he couldn't get there after the call). He was charged £90 for missing the appointment as they said he was booked in for 3 appointments back to back due to the time it takes to get the work done.

He accepted this with good grace as he was the one who forgot, but when I phoned to ask who to make the cheque out to they reduced the charge to £60 which we payed.

Neither of us has missed an appointment before.

However from what you say above they shouldn't have charged us under the new rules, is that right...this was the 5th June this year?

Debs