Think the unthinkable - let's help the coalition with some blue-skies thinking...

Kohoutek

ninky wrote: »

we are the one of the first generations where birth control is an option and there is no longer a moral or religious imperative to reproduce for the majority. if people feel they can't expect a certain standard of living for their children they will increasingly choose not to have them. this is already happening among large sections of the middle class where birth rates have fallen significantly.

That's a shame though, because it seems that if you're a member of the workless class in today's society, then procreating is what people do to fill their time, but if you work, despite the fact that you would probably be a better parent, many people choose not to have children or can't afford a family.

ninky wrote: »

but i think there is a very real chance some will be priced out of having children. i personally feel i have been. of course i could scrimp and save and we could live like paupers. but why should we?

i plan to enjoy life as much as possible and leave anything to my niece and nephew in the hope this will help them rise above becoming wage slaves themselves.

Well, I think for some people, having children is so important that they would rather scrimp and save than get older and regret not having children later in life. I suppose it depends how important material wealth or going out a lot is to people's lives compared to parenthood. There's definitely been some big changes in lifestyles like you say in recent times.

fc123

princeofpounds wrote: »

There's a lot of truth in this. Labour ............(the upper working class, so to speak)............

Love it...I feel Lower Middle but I think we are more middle (without the granite worktops, hols every year) by other things we choose to spend on.....but upper working class sounds more correct and is absolutely perfect.
Thankyou..I have learnt a new word today.:)

fc123

ninky wrote: »

!!!!!!? sorry don't employers have a responsibility to make sure their employees can feed, clothes and house themselves etc on their wages??? or are they just planning on letting them starve or get sick and die and then get a fresh batch in?

..not really. Employers have a responsibilty to pay the employee the correct rate for the job in full at the end of each week, ensure a safe working environment and to abide by the current employment laws.

The pay rate for the job is set by the market.

Same as houses on a street...a set of semis. 1 on at more ££ as DINKies, next door at less as STAHM with 2 kids and 1 wage earner?? They are priced the same and at the market rate.

Doesn't stop one as an employer feeling responsible for everyones livelihoods though.

Out of interest have you ever employed anyone directly Ninky? Not subby, but employed for a long period of time?

fc123

ninky wrote: »

so no one native born has got a job in the last 10 years????

i agree that immigrants are an important flow of wage slaves. not only that but they don't need the expensive state paid for child health care or education required of native born ones.

so would you suggest then that the native population should rightly be priced out of reproducing and we just import workers from now on?

It may just happen anyway...if people like yourself choose not to have children, less babies, less future citizens. I know lot's of people like yourself.

chucky

Snooze wrote: »

Whatever you want to dress it up as it's still the truth. People with kids think that everyone else (incl those without kids and have no desire to have any) should subsidise the upbringing of their own kids and that is so unbelievably selfish. But then this is what this country has become where everyone thinks that they 'deserve' something. Thank the stupid lefties for that one as they were the ones who created this mess, as per usual.

politics and having children - a great link you've established there, a really well thought out logical assumption. pmsl :T

Aspiring_Writer

chucky wrote: »

politics and having children - a great link you've established there, a really well thought out logical assumption. pmsl :T

No, he meant that the Labour Govt created an environment where people thought
they had a right to anything and everything, often without any merit at all. There was and isnt any link between children and politics, just circumstance and perception.

chucky

Aspiring_Writer wrote: »

No, he meant that the Labour Govt created an environment where people thought
they had a right to anything and everything, often without any merit at all. There was and isnt any link between children and politics, just circumstance and perception.

i doubt if the Labour government or the conservative did anything of the sort.

society has changed, it's not something exclusive to the UK or to a Labour Government or a Conservative. it's happened in Spain when they had a right wing government.

blaming a political party or government is a poor attempt at understanding reality and is ignorant.

A._Badger

chucky wrote: »

i doubt if the Labour government or the conservative did anything of the sort.

society has changed, it's not something exclusive to the UK or to a Labour Government or a Conservative. it's happened in Spain when they had a right wing government.

blaming a political party or government is a poor attempt at understanding reality and is ignorant.

And why do you think society has changed, Chucky? Was it the fairies?

chucky

A._Badger wrote: »

And why do you think society has changed, Chucky? Was it the fairies?

it must have been the fairies if A.Badger says it is.

can we blame these 'lefties' for similar things happening in Spain when a right wing government was in place?

go on Badger - leave the sound-bites and urban myths behind.... see if you can answer that one.....

Aspiring_Writer

chucky wrote: »

i doubt if the Labour government or the conservative did anything of the sort.

society has changed, it's not something exclusive to the UK or to a Labour Government or a Conservative. it's happened in Spain when they had a right wing government.

blaming a political party or government is a poor attempt at understanding reality and is ignorant.

My last line was, circumstance & perception. That means people perceive they have a right to anything and everything and the incumbent Labour Govt provided the circumstances to make it happen, i.e lax benefit & welfare system.

Bringing a child into this world when you know full well you can't afford to feed or look after it without state help is ignorant and makes no attempt at understanding reality...