Gold Prices Rally on Safe Haven Buying. gold hit a new record of £767

RDB

nollag2006 wrote: »

Sadly for gold speculators, they will be stung much harder by the proposed rise in CGT to 40%. No way for gold speculators to "flip" their asset.

Oh dear...

That is true for any fools gold paper investments.

If you buy real gold and silver you can sell it quietly on the open market and no one ever needs to know.

Thats the beauty of real physical bullion, its private.

nollag2006

RDB wrote: »

If you buy real gold and silver you can sell it quietly on the open market and no one ever needs to know.

Thats the beauty of real physical bullion, its private.

What you are talking about here is tax evasion, or theft, as it is more commonly known.

Are you stupid enough to think that HMRC don't monitor these markets, or track movements in large sums of cash that appear unrelated to any visible form of income?

RDB

Not true at all.

Gold and silver are real money. If there is a currency crisis they can be used as money of last resort.

You could use them to buy a car for so many ounces for example no cap gains.

Or in a few years if they carry on going up at the same rate you can buy a house with a few hundred ounces of gold or maybe a thousand ounces of silver.

If it goes back to historical average of 10 parts silver worth 1 part gold.

In 1980 you could buy an average house in London for 1000 oz of silver.

Now 1000 oz of silver costs about 10K, its dirt cheap. Its 65 times cheaper than gold.

dopester

RDB wrote: »

Now 1000 oz of silver costs about 10K, its dirt cheap. Its 65 times cheaper than gold.

I don't know what to make of silver. There is so much conflicting info out there... that most of what is mined gets used up, unlike gold. That compared to gold, there is less silver above ground in stores than gold?! WTH? That can't be true can it? Can you show me a source for 1000 oz of silver coins for £10K? Or even fewer but at the same £10 per oz? Not that I'm saying that's a good price or not. I don't know.

There were 6 bars of gold found around my way not long back (well one in the 1960s, three in 93, one in 97.. and the other don't know) - or at least 6 gold bars which were turned in. First one was found, then hunt was on for more. Pre-historic gold. It reminds me of how it really has been.. held precious throughout time, and among so many different cultures around the world. There might be more gold mined out in the world today, but there are many more people than in times of antiquity.

Adds a bit of charm to the legend that of the legend of the Wizard, and the army said to King Arthur and his 1000 sleeping knights, waiting to decide the fate of a great battle and save England in it's darkest hour of need.



Strangely quite a couple were found at the side, and one even under, a rock known as long as anyone can remember as the golden stone.

Another: The moment that gold bar 3 was found in Waterfall wood. The stone in the photo was on top of where the bar was buried and had sunk into the ground for 5 inches the bar was 14 inches from the surface



http://www.alderley.org.uk/Aldtre.html

From what I gather, prehistoric gold held about more value back then than it does today - or likely to be less today. I like gold - there is something comforting and physically attractive about it - but just think it is very expensive. If we do see financial collapse then of course it could fly to new levels. Miserable world if we did see financial collapse though.

Cleaver

dopester wrote: »

If we do see financial collapse then of course it could fly to new levels. Miserable world if we did see financial collapse though.

That's the point that always gets me. Let's say I put all my money in to gold, the financial world collapses and I get twenty times my investment back. If all my friends and family have lost their jobs, my neighbourhood has become a crime-ridden swamp, I have no job, everyone around me is depressed and I can't travel anywhere because airlines have all gone bust... etc. etc. then how am I meant to enjoy my new found wealth?

Very interesting story about the found gold, thanks for that dopester. Can you imagine Asheron coming across an ancient gold bar in his back garden? Not sure he'd survive the excitement.

RDB

dopester wrote: »

I don't know what to make of silver. There is so much conflicting info out there... that most of what is mined gets used up, unlike gold. That compared to gold, there is less silver above ground in stores than gold?! WTH? That can't be true can it? Can you show me a source for 1000 oz of silver coins for £10K? Or even fewer but at the same £10 per oz? Not that I'm saying that's a good price or not. I don't know.

Sorry I was quoting what was said a few months ago in Feb. Then silver was less than 10 quid an oz, now its over 13.50 spot price and rising fast.

But your doing well do buy an oz for less than 20 quid actual silver bullion.


But the other things you say are true. More silver gets used up in industry than comes out of the mines. This has been the case for years, so stockpiles have been getting used up. Now there is hardly any silver left in the world and consumption is going up as the world wants more electronics. Hence the rising price of the little silver left on Earth.

It is a fact there is now for the first time ever more Gold than silver. It is estimated 95% of gold is still in the world because its not consumed but 95% of silver has already been used up.

To top it all, the price has been suppressed by selling future paper promises of silver that dont exist as much as 100 to 1. Now they are being investigated and are going to have try to get hold of the physical silver but there is not enough left on Earth.

On top of that you have the rapidly expanding currency supply all around the world. All that paper has to try and land on the same small amount of precious metals on planet Earth. It means one thing, much higher prices.

lvader

You lose aboout 25% of the value of silver the day you buy it. (VAT plus trading costs)

RDB

lvader wrote: »

You lose aboout 25% of the value of silver the day you buy it. (VAT plus trading costs)

Ivader this is a common held misconception. Been through it a few times already on here. The fact is in the UK silvers value is the same or more than it costs to buy new with VAT on top.

Ivader you are wrong about an instant 17.5% loss against real value with buying new silver. Once you buy it with VAT, that is then what its worth if you sell it in the open market. But if you sell it to someone 2nd hand you dont have to pay VAT.

I have some more examples to show the private silver market and the new silver market with VAT are about the same, usually if you buy new and pay VAT you can sell for more and not have to VAT. In the private market prices are more with no VAT involved. It must be the shortages of silver all over the world.

This is for all those who think that if you buy silver you have to wait for 17.5% gain before you make a profit.

Private market dont need to pay VAT these 1kg Metalor bars are all around £600 to £700. This is a private sale no one knows you are buying silver.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SILVER-BULLION-BAR-1KG-32-OZ-1000-GRAMS-NEW-SWISS-MADE-/280504289148?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Coins_Bullion_Bars_SM&hash=item414f5bc77c#ht_2179wt_1165

To buy the same bar new you have to pay VAT and the Government now knows you are buying silver bullion.

QTY Net* VAT* Gross*
1+ £490 £85.75 £575.75

http://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/silver-bars/1kg-silver-bar/metalor-1-kg-silver-bar/


Its basically the free market working itself out. If buying silver bullion in the private market was cheaper than new, then not many would buy new. Then prices of the private market would go up as silver becomes more rare. So the free market evens things out.

I challenge anyone to find the same silver bullion cheaper in the private free open market than it is new and have to pay VAT.

MrEnglish

The best advice right now is -

Silver Bullion: BE CAREFUL!!!!! Don't sell to Coin Shops or cash for Bullion Buyers!!

All these companies cash for bullion, they know prices are going way higher. They know there are shortages.

Its actually very very easy to sell bullion because more and more people are trying to buy and yes you can sell for more than the dealers sell who charge V.A.T on top. These days people like the privacy of buying private instead of from a dealer where they record their personal details.

So Im sorry to disagree with you Really2 maybe you know more about the complexities of V.A.T than I do. But in this case with silver bullion the truth is you can easily sell your bullion with no V.A.T for more than what you paid including V.A.T.

I have just done some comparisons myself. Its easy to compare the prices of new silver bullion to buying the same thing private where there is no V.A.T and the prices are very similar.

NEW with V.A.T from your company you quoted 1kg silver bullion bar

http://www.cooksongold.com/Gold-and-Silver-Bars/

Net Price £507.16
Postage & Packing £11.50
VAT £90.77
Total Price £609.43

2nd hand private sale no V.A.T £797.00 Postage £6.49 same bar no V.A.T but over £200 more.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FINE-SILVER-BAR-1kg-investment-collector-gift-/170128967390?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Coins_Bullion_Bars_SM&hash=item279c7a06de#ht_500wt_956

Thats silver bullion Im interested in, not sure about scrap silver. I stay away from it myself.

Is the scrap silver you are talking about REALLY2 the same as silver shot? like this

https://www.ukbullion.co.uk/productDetails/391

Or is it more like silver nuggets? How can you test it? The usual electric or acid test wouldnt work because you would have to test each tiny nugget!

Jonbvn

nollag2006 wrote: »

Sadly for gold speculators, they will be stung much harder by the proposed rise in CGT to 40%. No way for gold speculators to "flip" their asset.

Oh dear...

No CGT on Sovereigns & Britannia's. All perfectly legal and above board (unless they change the law).

http://www.taxfreegold.co.uk/capitalgainstax.html

However, I saw a piece on Sky News this morning regarding gold. Surely a contrarian indicator, if there ever was?