how to dispute credit card fraud

sundance12

Hi I have suffered just over £3000 of credit card fraud whilst in South Africa . During the trip my card was barred a number of times and I had to call up to clarify certain transactions. The first few times this happened the transactions they flagged were all genuine. I did however have two calls to unbar my card which included genuine and fraud which I did not spot at the time and inadvertantly confirmed some small value fraud items which I should not have confirmed. By the time I next checked my statement online I realised there was a huge problem and called in on 6 Feb to terminate my card and request that many transactions be recognised as fraud and investigated. I was out of the country from 15 Dec to 11 March.

CC company (egg) have just advised that they will not refund any of the fraud on the basis that I agreed to some of the fraud transactions when they did two of the security calls.

Its a hard lesson but I guess I can see their point as they could have terminated the card on the 24 Jan if I had been more prudent.

It is however not always easy to reconsile every transaction x days after they were made especially as I was giving it heavy usage and the name of the place/ store / shop / hotel / backpacker / restaurant / tour / trip does not always relate to the name used on the statement does it. If you are being asked about lets say 5 transactions and 3 are ok and 2 are small value fraud then it is easy to think that yes that sounds right and agree them.

Anyway my point was that the first security call where I made an error was 24 Jan and had nothing to do with 4 transactions which were fraud before that date. I asked them why they were not at least paying those out as they were fraud and I only realised there was fraud when I looked at my statement on 6 Feb and notified them as soon as I could. None of their security calls referred to the first 4 fraud transactions in any way. Its only around £300 for these 4 transactions but some refund is better than nothing I guess.

They are treating all the transactions as one fraud case and declining all not just the ones occurring post my really stupid error by not listening properly to the security check they did on 24 Jan which asked me about 3 transactions . They gave no specific answer apart from they were declining the case on the basis that I had made a mistake with the calls on two occasions having agreed to genuine and fraud transactions at the same time and I should go via ombudsman.

Unfortunately from my point of view the fraudsters had made 26 transactions from 24 Jan to 5 Feb with an on line South African flight company - thats 26 transactions to the same company for flights. I am pretty sure that if egg had called and asked if I had made 3 or 4 or 5 purchases with the same company I might have twigged. Anyway by the time I was in front of a PC it was 6 Feb and the damage had been done.

Anyway I am really surprised that my CC company have not been able to get refunds from any of the providers - can they not do a cashback thing within 60 days and then get the company to provide proof that they have all the correct details etc etc .

I dont really know if I have a leg to stand on but it was a real problem being able to confirm small value stuff in amongst genuine transactions. I am going to ask for a copy of the telephone calls and hope to be able to get these.

Can anybody advise my best course of action or do I put it down to a hard lesson learn't?

CannyJock

Raise a complaint and escalate to FOS if no satisfaction from Egg - inform Egg you're wanting the amounts refunded, plus interest @ 8% as you've paid the fraudulent amounts from your own funds, plus your cost of dealing with the complaint and an amount of compensation for the inconvenience (ask for £200 and let them offer you £0 and hopefully agree somewhere inbetween).

Make sure you pay the Egg balance while you're disputing the transactions or you'll just open up a different can of worms.

INT1

Just a misunderstanding and I am sure you can get it resolved.

The CC company only has a certain number of days to complete a chargeback thats been done fraudulently and I know that they are still within time.

Call them back and speak to the fraud department/chargebacks department and request they send you a disclaimer so they can raise a chargeback.

sundance12

Aldo fraud department has advised they will not refund and are sending a letter they have never mentioned anything regarding how they have attempted to get the money back or chargeback. I was told I am getting a letter explaining they wont pay and how I can go to the ombudsman. I have not had any disclaimer sent by Egg CC although originally they advised that I would have one when I came back from holiday. I will call them to see about the chargeback issue just now cheers

sundance12

CC has agreed to do a chargeback but the various merchants have 90 days to come back against it. Aparently the FOS gave advice to CC company that due to the fact that I had inadvertantly confirmed a couple of the fraud transactions as genuine when they called to check combination of genuine and fraud transactions that it was a valid reason for denying the fraud claim. So it sounds that if I had tried to complain and go to FOS that I would have got nowhere.

It really does sound that if you go abroad and have heavy use of a card and there is fraud you need to have some method of checking things when they call. Answer is, it would appear, to let the block stay on it until you can get to a PC terminal to look at transactions (although some transactions take a few days to get to the statement stage).

The fraudsters have it in their court if they are clever and you are not very very careful with keeping records and they use lots of small transactions.

It has been and still is a big worry to lose so much money.

Dunno will see what happens but have a 90 day wait after forms go off and will just have to keep my fingers crossed. Given what has happened I am never going to use CC abroad again unless for car hire and flights where you have to pay by credit card and will keep a written list of all my transactions and check statements at least every week in internet cafes.

INT1

Unfortunately the country you travelled to is typical for compromising card details.

There are many claims from south africa, some genuine claims and some not so genuine, the credit card c.o are just being cautious in this instance.

The chargeback though will show further details about the transaction that the credit card company can validate against the details they hold on your account, I am pretty confident you will be reimbursed if it's a genuine claim.

sundance12

thanks the bulk of the transactions are to SA flight company 1time. multiple purchases for flight tickets over a very short space of time. They dont appear to ask for proof of credit card or copy of card at point of ticket pick up or check in so its clearly an obvious loophole that fraudsters can use. I am flabbergasted that they cannot at least trace the name of person flying on the flight unless they have forged ID with my name on it but that sounds a bit sophisticated and unrealistic to me. Dont you need ID to fly on planes internally in SA I know I had to show my passport when I went from Cape Town to Joburg but I dont know what locals need to show. It just sounds crazy that so many tickets can be bought without the flight company at least becoming suspicious or having more details apart from card basic data. I have no idea how tickets were dispatched whos name used how collected how used where flown to what ID used what email used if any. I even have that extra security thing where you have to put in a password when you use your CC on line but not all merchants use this feature as I now understand. I suppose these fraudsters are capable of anything if they are clever at it. Whilst all the transactions are genuine fraud I am still worried as I cannot afford to lose over £3000 and I now have a 90 day wait to find out if everything is ok with the chargeback. My CC company said that if the chargeback fails then my claim will be over and that will be it! They gave the impression that I would have no further comeback - how can this be so ?????

This sounds very ominous surely I have rights to dispute anything that the flight company comes back with and surely I have the right to know what details they have about the transactions and how the tickets were passed on and to who and where and what times they flew so I can dispute or prove it couldnt be me because I was elsewhere re other bank transactions I may have that proves locations and times etc etc.

Surely fraudsters are clever people and have ways of hiding their trails but that surely must also prove that it was not me too.

It is a all very worrying and considering how very very careful I was with my card at all times this just proves that you can easily be at the mercy to fraud and potentially be left with a big bill plus all the worry and stress that comes with it. On reflection its just simply not worth it for the benefitrs of using a CC.

I am no longer going to use CC abroad and if I do I will be keeping a detail log and will be looking at statements at least 2 a week and more if possible but as you go on holiday to have fun I would simply use cash or one of those visa electron passport card thingys that seem to be ok. Considering the cost I have suffered so far in all the mobile calls I had to make when abroad plus the potential of not getting the fraud refunded it would have been cheaper taking cash out using normal debit cards or cash from credit cards and simply suffering the withdrawal charge. At least you would only ever use a hole in the wall machine fior transactions and reduce chances of card details theft.

Dunno but the whole thing sucks it would be good to be able to find out what a merchant has to be able to prove to successfully avoid a chargeback and my rights to any appeal if they manage to do it in my case.

Fraud sucks!

hansi

I know it's after the event and I'm very sorry for what happened, but did you not keep receipts for your transactions, and then reconcile them on your statement? Did you advise Egg that you were travelling in South Africa, and did you let your card out of sight when you paid in restaurants etc? also do they have chip and pin for extra security?

sundance12

Yes I kept receipts I have about 90% of them.
Yes I advised Egg I was traveling to SA and asked them if there was any extra risks or extra things I should be aware of and no they did not say anyhing about extra risks and just the usual - dont let card out of sight dont show pin, keep receipts
No I never let my card out of my sight
I checked statements regularly
I kept receipts
I made the mistake of taking two transaction check calls which included fraud transactions which I though were ok due to small amounts but did not realise the mistake until I checked online and advised fraud problem.

By time fraud investigation was complete 6 Feb to 20 April ( I returned on 11 March and called Egg on 12 March to be advised the claim had not yet started even though I called and advised frausd on 6 Feb) they then advised sorry we wont pay as you made a mistake twice. They also refused to pay out 4 transactions that occurred BEFORE I made the mistake on the first credit check on 24 Jan. I can understand them saying tough on the 26 multiple transactions including and after the 24 Jan to the SAME flight company but to refuse at least the first 4 sounds very unfair and unjust.