N.I. cockup by payroll Dept. Help Reqd.

Any

poopyfish wrote: »

Freddie: I agree with your first comment, hang them by their short and curlies and give em a good flogging....even that would be too good!

but your 2nd.....ermm how do i say this without it coming across as too offensive....
I apologise for not being an accountant and knowing the ins & outs of a ducks !!!! in regards to tax codes... Sorry i design buildings for a living, i dont often have to work out their tax codes, i also thought that this forum was for advice not being told im a numptie coz i dont understand a topic you do.

Sorry mate, but I don't understand where my council tax goes but I still need to know my council tax banding and make sure that it is paid. There is no excuse. This is your money and your tax and it is in your best interest to understand the basics. Noone is asking you to know the ins and outs of NI and TAX as such, but to know what current "normal" tax is and what "BR" tax is and read the letter you get from HMRC is not a rocket science. And to question when your tax code changes why it changed is not going to take much time.

As for payroll making the mistake - this all sounds very weird. Are they doing this manualy? How big is the company? If it is done by the system then I can't see how there could be any mistakes made.

The only mistake that could be made would be in issuing your OH with wrong tax code on the beginning of her employement - but after that they would only change that if the government told them so. And then youw wife would get letter from HMRC. The system wouldn't allow the payroll just to change the NI contributions or tax manualy. It just doesn't work like that.

poopyfish

Any: i agree with what yoru saying, maybe i should know more about it, but ive never had any issues with tax codes in my 20 odd years working neither has my wife...until now. And of course i will now look more closely so it doesnt happen again but i dont need telling im a numptie.
It just gets my back up that a company with a large payroll dept who and i quote
" provide local services to 10,000 customers in various parts of England.
We have 1,500 members of staff delivering a range of care and support services, such as support in the community and homecare services, retirement living accommodation, together with residential care homes and nursing care homes, and foyers" can balls it up so much......

As for what system they use manual, automated....i dont know, all i can tell you is my wife fills in a timesheet/rota for the month which gets signed & sent by the manager to payroll who i presume must input this data and hey presto she gets paid by bacs...

below is a quick summary of amounts she has been paid & taxed from her wage slips that i have on a spreadsheet...

Tax periodDATEGrossTaxNINet130/04/09878.4175.64.02698.78229/05/09679.27133.41.91543.96330/06/09909.26179.44.21725.65431/07/091395.232799.191107.04528/08/09925.831854.5736.33630/09/091042.99208.45.67828.92730/10/091926.97385.214.511527.26830/11/091261.82252.27.861001.76931/12/091604.5320.811.281272.421029/01/091394.43287.89.181106.451126/02/101123.9219.668.5835.81231/03/101917.61233.8799.75884.06


see what you think....?

Any

What happened there? I can't make out which number beggins where and where it ends.

poopyfish

sorry im trying to upload info.....but im newbie and it wont let me upload a picture

heres a quick run down



Tax Period DATE GrossTax NI Net

1. 30/04/09 Gross: 878.4 Tax: 175.6 N.I: 4.02 Net: 698.78
2. 29/05/09

   ---

   679.27

   ---

   133.4

   ---

   1.91

   ---

   543.96
3. 30/06/09

   ---

   909.26

   ---

   179.4

   ---

   4.21

   ---

   725.65
4. 31/07/09

   ---

   1395.23

   ---

   279

   ---

   9.19

   ---

   1107.04
5. 28/08/09

   ---

   925.83

   ---

   185

   ---

   4.5

   ---

   736.33
6. 30/09/09

   ---

   1042.99

   ---

   208.4

   ---

   5.67

   ---

   828.92
7. 30/10/09

   ---

   1926.97

   ---

   385.2 ----14.51

   ---

   1527.26
8. 30/11/09

   ---

   1261.82

   ---

   252.2

   ---

   7.86

   ---

   1001.76
9. 31/12/09

   ---

   1604.5

   ---

   320.8 ----11.28

   ---

   1272.42
10. 29/01/09

    ---

    1394.43

    ---

    287.8

    ---

    9.18

    ---

    1106.45
11. 26/02/10

    ---

    1123.9

    ---

    219.6 ----68.5

    ---

    835.80
12. 31/03/10

    ---

    1917.61

    ---

    233.8 ---799.75

    ---

    884.06

---

Totals

---

15060.2 --2860.2 --17920.4 --11268.4

Any

I take it you rung the tax office and you are getting new tax code issued?

I don't understand how they screwed up the NI, but it definitely looks like it is wrong. They must have set her up wrong or something

I read again your first thread and do I understand it correctly:
They gave your wife extra £700 odd on top of her wages (money that she didn't earn) and then they took it off again in NI?

And now they say they will want this £700 odd back?

I wonder how they are proposing to do that.

However, yes, it looks like they screwed up big time. How did they manage this, that is beyond my understanding. Unless they had her as "opted out" from NI system or something... that is all just speculation at this moment.

The fact is that it has to be paid. Yes, they have made a mistake, but thad doesn't hide the fact that you owe this money to the government. You are not "paying for their mistake", you are just paying later then you should have done... it doesn't cost you penny extra.

And to watch out your tax code from now on is good idea - HMRC screws up tax code on regular basis. You need to be on look out for those human mistakes.

poopyfish

thats it you got it, they gave her the £700 as an odd payment on her wage slip, then took it back as an NI contribution to make sure her NI total was correct for the year. So the govermnet has their share.

We now owe her employer the £700 which we have to pay back at same rate as she will pay in the months going forward eg, £70 NI. she'll pay £70 back to them - Double payment.

I know people will say, "well youve had this money already so stop complaining" but its the inconienience to us now for the next 12mths paying it off when it wasnt our fault but a error that the Payroll dept should have picked up as thats their job! well at least youd think so....


however as ive discovered today, if my wife leaves her job, which has been considered i can assure you, They will have to forfit the payment and we wont pay a penny more for their mistake... god love the HMRC!

Her tax code has been changed, we are told, although we havent had any letter yet from HRMC to confirm. Now we have the battle of trying to claim back the PAYE Tax overpayment to the sum of approx £1300...
They tell us, because we are in new tax year we cant do anything till the End of year P60 has been issued and thats not likely till the end of the month... Joy!

chrisbur

It looks like table J was used for NI contributions for most of the year, this would apply to someone who has another job in which they were paying the maximum NI up to the upper earnings limit. In these circumstances then tax code BR might also be used, so I wonder if they got your wife confused with another employee.

One thing to keep an eye on is if the money they added to cover the extra NI is included in the gross earnings for the year end then tax will be paid on this figure. If they then take back the money to cover the NI underpayment then 20% extra will be paid back.

poopyfish

good call on the tax, ill check that out tonight...ill check the codes too....!

Any

I see Poopyfish that you have never ever made a mistake in your life.
Good on you.

However mistakes CAN easily happen to other humans, I understand it is annoying and I would be annoyed as well, but the company was reasonable in offering 10-12mths to pay it off.

I wonder how did they assume that your wife had 2 jobs. Has she bothered to complete P46 or gave them P45?

CLAPTON

if your wife continues working there then the lessons to be learned would appear to be
1. work out her own hours and then work out her gross salary
2. check her tax code is correct.. if she has one job only it should be 647L or very similar
3. check the tax is correct
4.check the NI is correct
5. work out her holiday entitlement


although tax is a bit tricky, if you can design buildings for a living you should, with a bit of help from boards like this, be able to get it approximately correct