MP,s Granted Legal Aid.....

Malcolm.

To me, it's the system which is broke, MP's being able to claim legal aid simply acts to highlight the issue.

I'm not aware of the inns and outs of it all, however I do know the british legal system is expensive to the taxpayer, by European comparison.

nickmason

drc wrote: »

It's a testament to how morally bankrupt our politicians and the whole justice system has become. They have no moral integrity whatsoever. It's all about money nowadays. Money and power.

Heard somebody on the radio the other day talking about Profumo. How, upon his disgrace, he resigned from politics - including the privy council - and spent the rest of his life in voluntary work on community projects in the east end.

Different times.

nickmason

tomterm8 wrote: »

They are entitled to a fair trial, like any other [STRIKE]criminals[/STRIKE] citizens. Part of that is getting legal aid, if you are in the crown court.

You're right. And to an extent we're all guilty of prejudging them. But it seems to me that their defence is going to be a technical one, and that they should realise that they - who chose to put their lives in the public sphere - are guilty in the eyes of the public, and that they should do the honourable thing.

tomterm8

I don't think we should presume to know what their defence is; at the moment they are not even discussing defences. They are discussing jurisdiction. If their argument is sucessful at court, then I would expect them to be impeached by the house of commons.

It's a chancy business, I would have thought - parliament has a reputation for being ruthless as a court. And, there is no appeal. To the extent the American constitution explicitly prevents this kind of thing.

They would be better off losing their argument.

Malcolm.

nickmason wrote: »

You're right. And to an extent we're all guilty of prejudging them. But it seems to me that their defence is going to be a technical one, and that they should realise that they - who chose to put their lives in the public sphere - are guilty in the eyes of the public, and that they should do the honourable thing.

I am still a fan of innocent until proven guilty. If they get off on a technicality, the law is an !!!, and needs changed.

To me, if the honourable thing was done, Labour and Conservatives MP's would resign, for sending troops to die in (arguably illegal) foreign wars.

nickmason

Malcolm. wrote: »

I am still a fan of innocent until proven guilty. If they get off on a technicality, the law is an !!!, and needs changed.

Agreed. My position is emotive. I like to think that politicians might do the right thing. They damn well wrote the rules, and they've made a living out of talking and - I hope - representing those people who've gone to them as "the advocate of last resort", part of the MPs job description. Can't they represent themselves for once? Or at least call in a favour? Apart from anything else, can't they see how it looks?:mad:

To me, if the honourable thing was done, Labour and Conservatives MP's would resign, for sending troops to die in (arguably illegal) foreign wars.

Oh yes. I'm still conflicted on this - I flit between disbelief that so many people could have been so wrong, and dismay that I'm "naive" to think that we can always work things out nicely, y'know, according to international law etc. I'm reading Craig Murray's autobiography at the moment, and Clare Short has just resigned over Iraq, and it makes me very worried that the world is not a place for idealism.

wymondham

I'm not up on legal aid, but presume they had to prove they were unable to pay the legal costs themselves?? Is it means tested?

tomterm8

No, the case is at crown court there is no means testing. If they lose, the court can order them to pay costs.

wymondham

tomterm8 wrote: »

No, the case is at crown court there is no means testing. If they lose, the court can order them to pay costs.

thanks..

... so they may have been advised to apply for legal aid?

tomterm8

I would have thought anyone going to crown court would be advised to apply for legal aid; most barristers charge at least £1,500 for half a day at the crown court. Top barristers, like the ones necessary for this case because of the complexity, could easily charge £10k-20k a day.