Help! Can a builder just come in and do this?

BobProperty

Rimo2021 wrote:

No of course all flat owners have not always parked there for over 12 years. That doesn't matter ......

The whole point is, it does matter. If you can prove you have parked there for over 12 years then you may have a case in law for continuing to do so. "Any flat owner" is a much wider definition.

Rimo2021 wrote:

The point is there has been an established use for over 12 years.....

Again my point is by who has this "established use" been established? You might have a case. The person who buys the flat next door and gets told you can park there will have a hell of a job establishing such a right, and the assumption of that right, with the ownership of the flat.
I'm tending to agree with Hereward on this, what is to stop the owner installing a security post on the land? What happens if he wants to keep half a dozen boats/trailers/caravans on his road?

AMILLIONDOLLARS

"The end of the cul-de-sac is a fence from the back garden of a house that has its address in another street. It has room for 2 cars to park in front of it and two cars to park side by side at the side of it if they dropped the kerb. Currently there are 4 parking spaces at the back of this property that have been and are continuing to be used by the residence of our street as there is not enough room outside each of our houses to park"

I am still of the opinion that he is trying to gain unofficially rear access to his garden without seeking the necessary permission. He'll have to apply for right of way into his property until then they would not be obstructing him!!

BobProperty

AMD - the OP posted this info too:
"The back of the property literally ends with a fence onto a tarmac-ed road, v. unusual aparently but no path or kerb to contend with there. So all he needs to do is replace an old fence and put a gate in, no pp required. He has even got a certificate from the council to that effect."

I don't understand what it is people think he has to comply with? He owns a piece of land. He is changing a fence for a gate on his land. What rules does he have to comply with, apart from planning rules on fence heights?

AMILLIONDOLLARS

Your quite right Bob, I take it your the builder concerned:D

I think its very poor that no consultation was taken beforehand by the Council, before the certificate was issued and permission given, obviously as he is a professional builder, he knows his way around the planning depts:rolleyes:

Rimo2021

Hereward wrote:

The said landowner could put up a gate, with a lock, to clearly mark the start of his property. The owners of cars parked on the lane when the gate is installed would have to get the land owners permission to remove them. One of the car owners would then have to prove that they have parked their car there for the required about of time for the practice to continue.

He could put up a gate of course but the people who own flats which have back gates on to the lane might not be too happy, not might those people who use it as a short-cut etc. There are so many flats in the adjoining 2 streets and lack of parking is such an issue that I don't think running a mini campaign and getting witness statements to the effect that there is a long-established use would be too difficult. The fact that the new 'owner' has done nothing aside from a few notes on windscreens suggestd he has found this out for himself.

BobProperty

AMILLIONDOLLARS wrote:

Your quite right Bob, I take it your the builder concerned:D

I think its very poor that no consultation was taken beforehand by the Council, before the certificate was issued and permission given, obviously as he is a professional builder, he knows his way around the planning depts:rolleyes:

I still don't understand what rules people think he should have complied with. If I was looking at buying a property where access to the front and rear was possibly available but hadn't been made, I would certainly consider doing it to improve the value of the property. I suggest that the "builder" (and it isn't me ) saw this and has a letter off the council to say it's OK. Not planning permission, so there is no need for the council to "consult".

Hereward

AMILLIONDOLLARS wrote:

Your quite right Bob, I take it your the builder concerned:D

I think its very poor that no consultation was taken beforehand by the Council, before the certificate was issued and permission given, obviously as he is a professional builder, he knows his way around the planning depts:rolleyes:

The Council concerned have no obligation to inform local residents that someone has applied for planning permission about a dropped kerb. It is up to the residents to find this out for themselves. As it has been pointed out that the property backs onto the cul-de-sac, then the builder has every right to ask the Council if he can install a dropped kerb on the road.

Rimo2021

BobProperty wrote:

The whole point is, it does matter. If you can prove you have parked there for over 12 years then you may have a case in law for continuing to do so. "Any flat owner" is a much wider definition.


Again my point is by who has this "established use" been established? You might have a case. The person who buys the flat next door and gets told you can park there will have a hell of a job establishing such a right, and the assumption of that right, with the ownership of the flat.
I'm tending to agree with Hereward on this, what is to stop the owner installing a security post on the land? What happens if he wants to keep half a dozen boats/trailers/caravans on his road?

Of course he could park whatever he wanted there himself thus preventing anyone else parking there. I agree that someone or a group of people would have to prove that there existed a right (even if you ignore the other peoples properties which have back gates onto the lane only one of whom would have to object to the gate) but my point is that this could be done and that just by buying a piece of land/road does NOT give you the right to do what you like with it. In this case he has so far (at least 2 years later) been unable to do what he likes with his own lane.

I imagine that in addition to buying the lane he has also had to buy public liability insurance in case anyone has an accident there and he is held responsible.

BobProperty

Rimo2021 wrote:

He could put up a gate of course but the people who own flats which have back gates on to the lane might not be too happy, not might those people who use it as a short-cut etc. There are so many flats in the adjoining 2 streets and lack of parking is such an issue that I don't think running a mini campaign and getting witness statements to the effect that there is a long-established use would be too difficult. The fact that the new 'owner' has done nothing aside from a few notes on windscreens suggestd he has found this out for himself.

I am curious why he bought it. What is the benefit to him? If people have back gates onto this road then there may well be a case for "access" but that's not the same as parking. My concern is a definition of who has the "long-established" use. And, as I said previously, the owner may be able to keep things on "his" land without obstructing "access" to people's back gates.

the_other_mce

Have you spoken to the Highways Department? This is separate to the local council planning dept? In the area where I live we have a district and a county council. The district deal with planning issues but the County have responsibility for the roads and pavements - i.e. the district council may not have an objection but the County councils Highways department might.
Good luck with this ( have you thought about getting your own kerb dropped so you can park easily instead of paying for him to have his done?). It is also true that you CAN block an EMPTY driveway without breaking the law......