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Elephant. Is this a scam??

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  • MarkyMarkD
    MarkyMarkD Posts: 9,912 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    My wife has just been NIP'd for speeding; I am interested that elephant have that wording! I shall check the Ts & Cs before we 'fess up to both of our two insurers and (possibly) incur additional premiums.

    Hmm. Esure state "you must tell us as soon as possible if ... you or any other driver covered by your policy are convicted of a motoring offence other than fixed-penalty parking offences". :(

    And More Th>n state "We may reassess your cover, terms and premiums when we are told about changes in your circumstances. If you do not tell us about any changes, or supply information which is not true ..., this may result in your policy being invalid."

    I'm very surprised by your Elephant wording - can you quote what they say, exactly, as they sound most generous?
  • lynsiloo
    lynsiloo Posts: 269 Forumite
    MarkyMarkD wrote:
    My wife has just been NIP'd for speeding; I am interested that elephant have that wording! I shall check the Ts & Cs before we 'fess up to both of our two insurers and (possibly) incur additional premiums.

    Hmm. Esure state "you must tell us as soon as possible if ... you or any other driver covered by your policy are convicted of a motoring offence other than fixed-penalty parking offences". :(

    And More Th>n state "We may reassess your cover, terms and premiums when we are told about changes in your circumstances. If you do not tell us about any changes, or supply information which is not true ..., this may result in your policy being invalid."

    I'm very surprised by your Elephant wording - can you quote what they say, exactly, as they sound most generous?

    What they say is you must tell them 1. Before, you change your car, modify your car etc
    2. Immediately, if you are involved in an accident, or change address etc.
    3.When you renew your policy, of any motoring convictions or fixed penalties.

    I can find nothing else in the t&c's similar to what Esure have in theirs. I agree, Elephant t&c's do sound generous compared to Esure's.

    However, having said all that, I phoned Elephant yesterday to confront them with my findings only to be told that the extra money they wanted was nothing to do with having been caught speeding and not telling them (as I had been told the other day). It was infact because during my policy I had had an accident that they said I had not told them about. I then politely explained to them that I had indeed informed them of the accident and that their solicitors were still dealing with the claim. At this point the phone went silent for a few seconds followed by "erm oh right well- I'll have to speak to my manager, could you hold". After about five minutes of waiting they came back on the line to tell me it was all their fault, their records had not been updated and I did not owe them anything. Success.:j
  • Bossyboots
    Bossyboots Posts: 6,757 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    Great news lynsiloo.

    I should perhaps point out that the policy t&c's I directed you to were not the most up to date but covered the period you took out your insurance. For policies started since January 2006 there is a more up to date policy which I did not look at so it could be that the terms have changed.


    Edit: I have just checked their subsequent policies and their most up to date one and it still says that you only need notify driving convictions (other than those resulting in a ban) or pending prosecutions when you renew your policy.
  • MarkyMarkD
    MarkyMarkD Posts: 9,912 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Thanks all for clarifying.

    I find Elephant's wording incredible, TBH.

    They are saying that someone could take out a policy with no points at all, and then get 2 or 3 serious convictions for motoring offences taking them up to 12 points at the maximum, without having to update the insurer, as long as they are not banned.

    Amazing!
  • Bossyboots
    Bossyboots Posts: 6,757 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    MarkyMarkD wrote:
    Thanks all for clarifying.

    I find Elephant's wording incredible, TBH.

    They are saying that someone could take out a policy with no points at all, and then get 2 or 3 serious convictions for motoring offences taking them up to 12 points at the maximum, without having to update the insurer, as long as they are not banned.

    Amazing!


    When you put it like that, it does make me wonder whether they have actually thought it through because that is exactly what they are saying. Perhaps they don't want the admin work involved in processing the info and trying to recover additional premiums.

    I would imagine that on renewal if/when you declared the offences the premium would be so high that most people would be priced out of Elephant or they would refuse to re-insure you.
  • ArchieB_2
    ArchieB_2 Posts: 293 Forumite
    Not uncommon in my experience for companies to re rate at renewal rather than through the policy year. Same goes for NCD - if you have an accident they won't make you pay the increased premium due to your loss of NCD. They will simply knock your bonus down and quote on that bonus come renewal.
  • MarkyMarkD
    MarkyMarkD Posts: 9,912 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Archie,

    NCD is completely different. NCD is something you have to have at the time of underwriting to qualify for a reduction in premium. Any subsequent claim only affects the level of NCD at next renewal, and there's no way it would affect the current year's premium.
  • MarkyMarkD
    MarkyMarkD Posts: 9,912 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Bossyboots wrote:
    I would imagine that on renewal if/when you declared the offences the premium would be so high that most people would be priced out of Elephant or they would refuse to re-insure you.
    Yes, but meantime they will have continued insuring some customers that most insurers would refuse to cover or would charge a huge premium increase for.
  • ArchieB_2
    ArchieB_2 Posts: 293 Forumite
    MarkyMarkD wrote:
    Archie,

    NCD is completely different. NCD is something you have to have at the time of underwriting to qualify for a reduction in premium. Any subsequent claim only affects the level of NCD at next renewal, and there's no way it would affect the current year's premium.

    I thought I did say you wouldn't have your bonus stepped back mid policy year??:confused:

    Anyway, you only get a discount because you are perceived to be a lower risk so why is it completely different to getting an SP30 in the middle of a policy year? If you have an SP30 you are higher risk, if you claim you are more likely to claim again and thus a higher risk.
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