Quinn Insurance in administration

36square

Oscar_The_Grouch wrote: »

Quinn got greedy, just like the banks, and tried to grow too quickly. They've moved into areas of insurance that they do not appear to have adequate knowledge of, just like the banks, and as a result, you will all pay for their folly.....

Presumably you're referring to health insurance where they acquired the establsihed BUPA business in Ireland. They didn't start from scratch.
There is no evidence to suggest that Quinn's insurance businesses are loss-making as a whole although certain books such as UK motor may be. That is why several potential buyers have already expressed interest according to reports.

Oscar_The_Grouch

36square wrote: »

Presumably you're referring to health insurance where they acquired the establsihed BUPA business in Ireland. They didn't start from scratch.
There is no evidence to suggest that Quinn's insurance businesses are loss-making as a whole although certain books such as UK motor may be. That is why several potential buyers have already expressed interest according to reports.

I'm referring more to their activities within the UK market. One of the other forum members posted in the thread that I've highlighted:

I'm just surprised that this has taken so long to unravel, as (at least in motor) if you analyse their underwriting month on month they are all over the shop with no rhyme or reason behind their rating changes.

Quinn appear to have followed a (let's be polite) flawed underwriting philosophy across a number of their non-life markets. They seem to have dabbled in high risk markets when they have not managed to bring in the required expertise (buying a book of business doesn't mean that the writers of that book will remain, expecially if they get wind of a take-over and make arrangements to jump ship early).

Despite the "value" placed on the UK motor account by press releases, the UK and Irish regulators have been concerned enough to pull the plug. As usual, the UK taxpayer will pick up the tab for this if the case goes against Quinn on 12 April.

36square

Oscar_The_Grouch wrote: »

As usual, the UK taxpayer will pick up the tab for this if the case goes against Quinn on 12 April.

No he won't. If Quinn is unable to meet it's UK liabilities in full, any shortfall will be met by the FSCS funded by a levy on other insurers but since Quinn's UK market share was small, this should not be very onerous. It's premium income outside Ireland was €410m (£326mn) in 2008 and not all of that was in the UK. I think they also had business in Holland and Belgium.

shaz77_2

Hi All

Just to update you, it appears that holes have been discovered in some of the regulators original findings, it is hoped that by Friday the UK wing of the business will be open again.

Artytarty

I'm cynical, they have lost customer confidence = doomed.

dmxdave

Has this not been rumbling along since the Anglo Irish bank fiasco?

The catalyst for the change in fortunes for the Fermanagh-born entrepreneur is a massive gamble he took on Anglo Irish that has backfired in spectacular fashion.
The €715m stake in the troubled bank the Quinn family bought last summer is now worth €220m, thanks to the turmoil in the financial markets that has seen Anglo's share price tumble by 90% in a year.
That investment was part-financed by a loan from Quinn Insurances of €288m. And that loan resulted in the unprecedented fines because the company had a duty to alert the Financial Regulator before moving money from the insurance group, as insurers are required to have enough funds in place to deal with unexpected claims.

Read more: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/quinn-may-face-euro1bn-loss-14016898.html#ixzz0kRONZBlb

tara747

Investing (i.e. high risk gambling) with money BORROWED from his own company... the mind boggles!!!!!!!!!!!! I always thought Sean Quinn was a decent enough man but this just beggars belief. Shame on him.

dacouch

Quinns senior staff are not very reliable when it comes to financial dealings http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/record-fine-for-billionaire-quinn-14016057.html

A senior manager was nearly charged with contempt of court for what the judge described as continually changing his story, the judge stopped short of accusing him of lying but did question a sworn affidavit that turned out to be incorrect.

They were rumoured to be about to go belly up in 2008 but were bailed out by the Anglo Irish bank (Who Sean Quinn had purchased a large amount of shares in...see above).

Most brokers have refused to place business with them due to the lack of quality in their products but mainly due to concern over their financial stability.

Eyebrows were raised when Quinn withdrew from supplying data to the credit rating agencies which people placing business with an Insurers should check to ensure they are placing business with a stable company.

Didier_Donkey_Kong

Quinn Insurance are a long-running joke for us who work in the Insurance Industry. We always laugh at their absolutely terrible underwriting, anything untouchable Quinn pickup at bottom rates. Their underwriters must be morons.

chunter

Apparently it makes a profit, but it has huge debts to Irish banks. The people running it seem to have been engaging in some Enron-style accounting.
(very Anglo Irish Bank - ish)

The administrators moved in because they saw some ridiculously dodgy accounting.

The fact that the amount needed to keep the business going has went from 100 million to 700 million in a week suggests that this onion has a few layers on it.

For Quinn Group, think Enron...