Re-roofing materials and supply- Welsh slate questions

j_lo_co

Hi there,

I have a few specific questions relating to Welsh slate vs. man-made fibre cement slates that I haven't been able to find answers to or concerns about having searched the 'In my Home' forum. I wonder if anyone out there could please comment if relevant to any of your own experiences? A bit of backgound:

I am re-roofing a 40 year old property in the Scottish Highlands, on which the original concrete roof tiles have become unsightly and porous; although with no water ingress to the house as yet, the loft space is musty and the boards quite mouldy. The joist etc are all fine but I require new boards, breathable membrane, battons, etc. and outer roofing material. The roof is a straight, gable to gable design of 162sqm.

For the outer roof material I have been looking into fibre cement slates, such as the Marley Eternit Melbourn (sorry, can't post link because I am a new user on here).

These are said (by Marley!) to have a lifespan of >60yrs. However, a family friend today said that he has heard that they do not last well and that they are far inferior compared to Welsh Slate, which is confirmed in various places, including within this forum. Of course, the prohibitive issue here is the cost of new Welsh Slate (~£5/slate) and therefore he suggested looking into reclaimed slates, which I have been doing. Looking around on the internet, I have seen recalimed good / excellent quality (not sure of the exact grade though) Welsh slates for between 50p-£1.50, making my roof slate cost around £2500-£4000; this seems very good since a roofing supplier has quoted me approx. £4000 for the Marley Melbourn fibre cement slates (£1.49/slate) (excluding boards, membrane, battens, fixings, etc).

Q1) Basically, I am concerned as to whether this reclaimed Welsh slate price too good to be true?!

Q2) I would be really keen to hear from anyone who knows or has experience of whether obtaining reclaimed Welsh slate over the internet (either by delivery or organising collection) is reputable and reliable?

Q3) Also, I am slightly confused as to the lifespan of Welsh slate itself- I've seen 100years but what if it has been taken off of a building in its 90th year- does this mean I would only get effectively 10 good years out of it?

Q4) I saw somewhere on here that installing real slate can bump the roof price up again due to the labour; I have been quoted £4800 for labour (inc. scaffolding, no VAT to pay) for fitting the roof with the Melbourns but not sure what to expect for fitting real slate?

Any advice on any of these issues would be much appreciated, many thanks

heating-eng

j_lo_co wrote: »

Hi there,

I have a few specific questions relating to Welsh slate vs. man-made fibre cement slates that I haven't been able to find answers to or concerns about having searched the 'In my Home' forum. I wonder if anyone out there could please comment if relevant to any of your own experiences? A bit of backgound:

I am re-roofing a 40 year old property in the Scottish Highlands, on which the original concrete roof tiles have become unsightly and porous; although with no water ingress to the house as yet, the loft space is musty and the boards quite mouldy. The joist etc are all fine but I require new boards, breathable membrane, battons, etc. and outer roofing material. The roof is a straight, gable to gable design of 162sqm.

For the outer roof material I have been looking into fibre cement slates, such as the Marley Eternit Melbourn (sorry, can't post link because I am a new user on here).

These are said (by Marley!) to have a lifespan of >60yrs. However, a family friend today said that he has heard that they do not last well and that they are far inferior compared to Welsh Slate, which is confirmed in various places, including within this forum. Of course, the prohibitive issue here is the cost of new Welsh Slate (~£5/slate) and therefore he suggested looking into reclaimed slates, which I have been doing. Looking around on the internet, I have seen recalimed good / excellent quality (not sure of the exact grade though) Welsh slates for between 50p-£1.50, making my roof slate cost around £2500-£4000; this seems very good since a roofing supplier has quoted me approx. £4000 for the Marley Melbourn fibre cement slates (£1.49/slate) (excluding boards, membrane, battens, fixings, etc).

Q1) Basically, I am concerned as to whether this reclaimed Welsh slate price too good to be true?!

Q2) I would be really keen to hear from anyone who knows or has experience of whether obtaining reclaimed Welsh slate over the internet (either by delivery or organising collection) is reputable and reliable?

Q3) Also, I am slightly confused as to the lifespan of Welsh slate itself- I've seen 100years but what if it has been taken off of a building in its 90th year- does this mean I would only get effectively 10 good years out of it?

Q4) I saw somewhere on here that installing real slate can bump the roof price up again due to the labour; I have been quoted £4800 for labour (inc. scaffolding, no VAT to pay) for fitting the roof with the Melbourns but not sure what to expect for fitting real slate?

Any advice on any of these issues would be much appreciated, many thanks

My brother is a roofer and he says for you to go with the reclaimed slate as this will last much longer but not only that it looks much better.

He said he worked on a roof that had Marley on and after 6 years it looked a mess and the customer wanted them taking back off. so go for the old reclaimed ones

ormus

my cousin was a slater/roofer/paver. he used reclaimed slates a lot.
however be aware there are good and bad ones. choosing a good supplier is vital.
welsh slates are excellent, hence they are expensive.

and re life spans, they are just a guide.
too many factors can affect what one house gets compared to another.
good welsh slate can last well beyond 100 yrs.

MX5huggy

There is a 3rd option of foreign slate. Spanish, Chinese etc. I would go for these over fibre.

If you have a South East to South West face to your roof I would also look at solar slates the produce electricity with the New feed in tariffs paying 43p a unit that you produce it may be worth it.

daveyjp

Do not go down the foreign slate route. Especially Spanish, Portuguese (often fraudulently brought in from Brazil and stanmped as Portuguese) as they aren't the same quality as Welsh and won't last. I'm aware of a property built in 1991, Spanish slates were used and it had to be reslated in 2005 as all the slates had started to crack.

The reclaimed slates will last years. Most of the time they fail due to the nail hole becoming larger due to movement and the nails failing, this causes the tiles to slip and crack around the nail hole. Once removed and trimmed they are good as new.

j_lo_co

Hi all,

Thanks for all the helpful comments. Yeh, I agree, I haven't heard great things about the foreign slates so have been wanting to choose between the fibre slate or reclaimed. I guess reclaimed makes more sense

Thanks!

itsakidsworld

Hi,

reclaimed slates can be great- but please note the word can!!! If you do not know what you are looking for you will get a supplier giving you the pile of rubbish which they have been looking to get rid of for a while. They may be too thick, porous, crumbling and not welsh!!

It may be a better option to ask the roofer who is doing the job to get you some quotes for reclaimed slates as 1. They should get it cheaper than you and so even with their mark up you should save. 2. Most important this is that they will check out the slates and as (hopefully) they know what they are doing, they will be able to source the best quality slates. This is also important because they will then be comfortable with the job as a bad slate can and will make a poor job.

knowloads

slate does become porous over 90-100 years. There are some new nano-tech sealants for slate, but this just adds more costs. Re-coating concrete tiles that are on there is an option (approx £3500-3600 for a roof that size). Many SH slates are supplied in crates and 20% useless in my experience. Fibre slates..... pretty useless.'foreign ones.... not the best Do it so it outlasts you and yours. Sorry if this just adds to your choices. 80(

thehairybuilder

Personally I`d avoid `reclaimed` slate at all costs. Reclaimed = 2nd hand , obviously which come with absolutely no guarantee and ,as stated by itsakidsworld, you`ll need to be VERY carefull not to get lumped with a pile of rubbish.
New Welsh slates are not too expensive , Penrhyn blue black Celtic grade can be had for £1.50 per 400x250mm slate. At 25 per m2 that`ll be £37.50 per m2 or just over £6000 for your roof for the absolute best slate available bar none
Spanish slate are a good option now too. In the early days of import lots of Spanish quarries simply dumped all ungraded rubbish that france germany etc wouldn`t take to UK , nowadays they`re party to stringent quality assurances. Check these available for 89p each , £22.20 per m2 , £3600 for your roof with a quarry backed written 100 year guarantee http://www.cupaheavy3.com/ I know for fact that Stewart Milne used these on his own house at Aberdeen last year and that was a building where absolutely no expense was spared on buying the best material available
Either of these options would be suitable for you
HTH

a_j_mair

I havent read all the replies so this may have been said or not

the difference in cost between tiles and slates is generally in the labour. material costs are very similar only slates take alot longer to install.

concrete tiles are ok. if they are claiming 60 year life span i would imagine it to be nearer 40year especially in the highlands with more severe weather

the other thing to remember with tiles is they stop producing tiles and update with new styles so in 15 years time if you have storm damage you may not be able to get the same tiles to replace them

As for slates i would stay well clear of any spanish or chinese slate.

We have recently used new welsh slate and were very impresssed by the quality. Good quality slate will outlast any tile

Second hand slates can often be more expensive than first seem. All slates will require to be re dressed and re holed which takes a considerable time. There is also more waste with reclaimed slate

On saying all the above, a roof that has been slated with reclaimed slate will have bags more character and is far more pleasing to the eye than a tiled roof.

Personally if it was me i would go with slate every time

a_j_mair

also worth while checking with local planning authority to see what they will accept