New House - Storage Heaters, Economy 7/10 and bill questions

Monkey_Joe

Hi,

I’m moving into a new property next month; 3 bedroom terraced house, 2 living rooms and a Kitchen. There is no gas central heating, everything (including hot water) is via electricity. They have storage heaters. The current occupant claims that he pays on average quarterly bills of around £150 in the summer and £350 in the winter with Southern Electric.

This is my first property and first time I will have lived in a property where everything is electric, prior to this I have been either renting or living with parents and on all occasions everything has been dual, gas and electric.

I am planning to switch to to gas central heating but money is a bit tight at the moment and until I save up the quoted amount (£4 to 5k) I will have to make do with the electric system. Therefore, can someone please explain to me:

(1) How do storage heaters work: I hear that they only actually turn on at night (12am to 8am), store heat and a reduced rate and then release it slowly throughout the day. Does this mean that during the day (9am to 12am) the heaters are off and we have to rely on the heat that had been stored up the previous night and would it be possible to change the times that the heaters come on and store heat? This sound pretty economical to me but many people say its more expensive, can someone explain why?

(2) I hear that since I have storage heaters my only options are either Economy 7 or 10 tariffs. I have been to price comparison sites and these tariffs appear to be a lot more expensive than the regular electrical tariffs, so is there any way I can switch to these normal tariffs?

Premier_2

You are correct that storage heaters heat up overnight (usually) and then give out that heat during the day. They are full of bricks that heat up.

You obviously need to be on a tariff that provides cheap rate electricity. That is typically E7 which gives 7 hours cheap rate electricity overnight (about 1/2 price). There are other tariffs like E10, but unless you are already on them, it may be difficult to get and once you are on it, you may experience difficulty switching to another supplier.

You can't change the times the heaters warm up as they are designed to use the cheap rate electricity. They use a lot of electicity and unless you are getting it cheap rate, you won't be able to afford it.
It is true that daytime/normal rates on a dual rate tariff may be about 10% more expensive than the equivilent single rate tariff, but the cheap rate will be a lot,lot less.(vertainly no more than 1/2 price and perhaps less) and you'll be using a lot of cheap rate electricity. However, as always, shop around for the best deal using the comparison sites to help you.

Although the heaters heat up overnight, if used correctly they'll still be warm before they start to heat up again the next night. You can control how much heat you put into them and usually can also control how rapidly the heat is given out.

I've found the best way to operate them is to keep the output on minimum and learn to control the heat required by adjusting the input. Then if you need a boost, perhaps late evening or on a sudden unexpected cold day, you've always got the option to increase the rate of heat output.

Whilst you can adjust the heat output, storage heaters will even when set to minimum output, give out heat all through the day so don't worry about being cold at 9.00am; that'll be when the heater bricks are at their warmest as it has just finished heating up. The heat output control is essentially just an insulating baffle around the hot bricks that you open up if you want more heat.

You get offered cheap rate electricity overnight because it essentially mops up spare capacity compared to during the day when overall electricity demand is generally higher.

Ada3050

Do a search as there are loads of threads on the use of them.

Some people hate them, some people love them. It all depends on your lifestyle weather they will suit.

I like mine, and factor in the cost of a GCH before you condemn the running costs.

Monkey_Joe

Thanks for both your feedback.

So based on what you told me, it appears that I wont be able to actually turn off the heaters completely? They turn “ON” at night and then turn “OFF” during the day but slowly release the heat that they stored during the “ON” period at night. The only control that we have, is how much they can store and how much they release....is that right? Sorry, if these are stupid questions (I feel stupid asking them) but I am totally ignorant with this type of system.

If we don’t have the ability to completely switch them off, what happens when say we are not at home and dont need heat in the house? I assume I would have to decrease the input completely at night and also decrease the output during the day? :S

Also, I assume the heat that is stored during the night is also used to maintain hot water for showers, baths ect?

Ada3050

You can turn them off, mine have a switch where the flex goes in by the skirting board. This enables you to control what heater charges up and when. I have most of mine turned off now except the bathroom and one bedroom.

If the weather turns cold than I can turn some back on the night before.

Monkey_Joe

Ada3050 wrote: »

You can turn them off, mine have a switch where the flex goes in by the skirting board. This enables you to control what heater charges up and when. I have most of mine turned off now except the bathroom and one bedroom.

If the weather turns cold than I can turn some back on the night before.

ok.

so just to confirm, so that I know for sure I have got my head round this...

(1) Between 9am to 12am, when the heaters are meant to be releasing heat, will we be technically using electricity? since it appears the usage part occurs during the night (12am to 9am) when the heaters are storing heat or do the heaters use electricity to release the heat throughout the day?

(2) Like I said, everything in the house is electrical. There is no gas, so that means cooking and showers ect electricity is used. Will both these come from the heat that is stored during the night or is this seperate. EDIT Just realised this is quote a stupid question! ignore it, obviously its seperate!

dogshome

Hi Monkey_Joe - I fear the present occupier of this house may understating the Electricity bills - £1000 a year is way under what would be expected for a 3 bed/2 reception room house - It does depend on levels of insulation and how you use the system, but he/she may not be using all the rooms and has some of the Storage Radiators turned off

My son is in a 2 bed, well insulated flat with 5 storage radiators and overnight electric hot water heating, and his bills with D/D payments on an Online tariff are running at over £1200 a year - Each Radiator is rated at 2.5Kw and runs for 7 hours, so each one burns 17.5 units of a power a night, with them all on thats 87.5units a night + 17.5 units to heat the water which will cost appx £4.83 a day - £33 a week in winter
But that isn't the full story, whilst the Night units are cheap at 4.6p, the Day units are 50% dearer for the Prime units, and 15% dearer for the Secondary units, than a Standard electricity tariff

The big downsides are that in the evening when you want heat, the Storage radiators are at thier coolest, and if the weather turns mild you have no alternative but to open a window and release the heat you paid for the previous night.

If you are not yet committed to this house:
Look at the walls to see if they are Cavity and can be insulated
Look in the loft to see if the insulation is a minimum of 12 " thick
Look at the Double Glazing - if it's more than 6 years old it won't be to the latest standards

Sorry to be a Jonah, but it's best if you take on this house that you do it with your eyes wide open
Good Luck

JennyR68

Monkey_Joe wrote: »

Also, I assume the heat that is stored during the night is also used to maintain hot water for showers, baths ect?

Your hot water tank should have an E7 timer on it set so that the water heats up during the E7 time frame. Depending on the size of tank / size of your family and when you like to have baths you might find the tank needs to be boosted during the day. There should be a boost switch on the timer unit.

If you switch your heaters off, say your going away for a few days you won't have heat from them again till the morning following your return. It might be an idea to get some back up plug in heaters for times like this. Or when you switch them off completely for summer. Sometimes it gets a bit cold again on the odd evening so if you have standby you can pop it on for an hour or two when needed rather than switch the storage back on.

Ada3050

No, they charge up between 12pm and 7am.

A switch in the meter turns the circuit off, so any heat will be stored heat.
Inside are very dense bricks, these heat up with elements and the heat is released over the day.

Any daytime usage will be at the day time tariff, kettle telly etc. If you have a hot water tank the this will be heated up over night on the night time tariff.

Monkey_Joe wrote: »

ok.

so just to confirm, so that I know for sure I have got my head round this...

(1) Between 9am to 12am, when the heaters are meant to be releasing heat, will we be technically using electricity? since it appears the usage part occurs during the night (12am to 9am) when the heaters are storing heat or do the heaters use electricity to release the heat throughout the day?

JennyR68

Monkey_Joe wrote: »

ok.

so just to confirm, so that I know for sure I have got my head round this...

(1) Between 9am to 12am, when the heaters are meant to be releasing heat, will we be technically using electricity? since it appears the usage part occurs during the night (12am to 9am) when the heaters are storing heat or do the heaters use electricity to release the heat throughout the day?

(2) Like I said, everything in the house is electrical. There is no gas, so that means cooking and showers ect electricity is used. Will both these come from the heat that is stored during the night or is this seperate. EDIT Just realised this is quote a stupid question! ignore it, obviously its seperate!

The heaters will not draw any power during the day unless thet are of the new fangled variety like Dimplex Duoheat which use a combination of stored and direct heat.

Monkey_Joe

dogshome wrote: »

Hi Monkey_Joe - I fear the present occupier of this house may understating the Electricity bills - £1000 a year is way under what would be expected for a 3 bed/2 reception room house - It does depend on levels of insulation and how you use the system, but he/she may not be using all the rooms and has some of the Storage Radiators turned off

My son is in a 2 bed, well insulated flat with 5 storage radiators and overnight electric hot water heating, and his bills with D/D payments on an Online tariff are running at over £1200 a year - Each Radiator is rated at 2.5Kw and runs for 7 hours, so each one burns 17.5 units of a power a night, with them all on thats 87.5units a night + 17.5 units to heat the water which will cost appx £4.83 a day - £33 a week in winter
But that isn't the full story, whilst the Night units are cheap at 4.6p, the Day units are 50% dearer for the Prime units, and 15% dearer for the Secondary units, than a Standard electricity tariff

The big downsides are that in the evening when you want heat, the Storage radiators are at thier coolest, and if the weather turns mild you have no alternative but to open a window and release the heat you paid for the previous night.

If you are not yet committed to this house:
Look at the walls to see if they are Cavity and can be insulated
Look in the loft to see if the insulation is a minimum of 12 " thick
Look at the Double Glazing - if it's more than 6 years old it won't be to the latest standards

Sorry to be a Jonah, but it's best if you take on this house that you do it with your eyes wide open
Good Luck

Wow! thats expensive. I am commited to the house. Its a nive house, good price and the only bad side is the "electrical" heating aspect I have discussed here.

I guess this is a question to eveyone but what are my options? I can not afford to convert to GCH yet but would it be possible to replace the storage heaters with something else? something more economical so that I can switch to a better more "all round" tariff?