UK Retail Sales up massively

Conrad

Blacklight wrote: »

I'd agree with this. Most people don't give a shіt about any of it

They've switched off and are thinking about buying that big TV with the money they saved when the bank mysteriously started taking less money for the mortgage every month.

And it is this that is lost on the prema pessimists, because thier reality tunnel is so utterly different.

The herd just carries on grazing regardless and slowly but surely the recession dwindles away.

doire_2

Quick! Go buy that house before you miss the boat

Conrad

nearlynew wrote: »

That's because it was paid for with even more debt.

And????????????

Life went on - we didn't all lose our homes, we didn't fall into a cycle of dispair.

So every person 'owes' a few grand to repay the national debt, so bloody what. We wont starve like unfortunate Africans, it will be paid, end of.

Life really will go on.

Conrad

doire wrote: »

Quick! Go buy that house before you miss the boat

You already missed it - last spring when the uber bargains were available.

Graham_Devon

Conrad wrote: »

Graham as I've pointed out to you many times, millions of people do not get hung up on doom and gloom in the way others might, they just don't. Life goes on, it really is that simple. One day you ought to try thinking more positively and not be anchored down by national debt and all the other nasties.

For the thousanth time - we paid for WW2 after 10 years of depression. We then built motorways and hospitals and all those 1950s schools and colleges DEPSITE THE DEBT.

Look at all the 1930s - 50s houses all over the place - vast swathes of London from Enfield to Wembly covered in them ALL BUILT DURING DIRE ECONOMIC TIMES

Do you get this?

The Human will does not lay down and die - we will overcome, it's that simple

I get this. You want to apply the blinkers to me aswell as anyone you possibly can, so that you can keep harping on about the economy smelling of nothing but roses, and how well labour are increasing your asset wealth.

Well sorry, i don't wear blinkers

You seem to have got a little annoyed that I pointed out debt was rising? Why is this? It wasn't doom, it was true, and it co-incides with more spending. Were back to normal in terms of the last decade.

Really2

If debt is rising is that not also a sign of it becoming more available and in slightly higher demand?

Just a thought but if debt was falling when in recession and rising coming out it is it not a sign that things have actually got slightly better?
I would not say personal debt rising is a bad economic sign as people must be spending.
When it falls it means people are paying it off= bad for economy as less is being spent.

Graham_Devon

Conrad wrote: »

And it is this that is lost on the prema pessimists, because thier reality tunnel is so utterly different.

The herd just carries on grazing regardless and slowly but surely the recession dwindles away.

Reality "Tunnel"?

So hang on. Firstly, you apply a label to everyone who disagree's with your thoughts.

Secondly, you attack for actually looking into the other side of the figures. In this case, spending is up...so is debt. They correlate.

So you literally want to say spending is up, forget everything else, it's up, life goes on, no one give's a damn.

And after labelling anyone who wants to look into the situation as a perma pessamist, you then went to say THEY are tunneled into their thoughts?

Woah. That's quite some contradiction you got going on there conrad....what do we class your thoughts as then? The definition of open mindedness perhaps?

mbga9pgf

Conrad wrote: »

And it is this that is lost on the prema pessimists, because thier reality tunnel is so utterly different.

The herd just carries on grazing regardless and slowly but surely the recession dwindles away.

I suppose they all are going to not notice the 12.5% cut in public expenditure over the next 4 years then?

System

Anyone hear a ticking noise?

Graham_Devon

Really2 wrote: »

If debt is rising is that not also a sign of it becoming more available and in slightly higher demand?

Yes.

Just a thought but if debt was falling when in recession and rising coming out it is it not a sign that things have actually got slightly better?

Completely depends on how you want to percieve a situation.

One person could say that it's good, showing the economy is stronger than before.

Another could quite simply say, hang on, wasn't debt part of the problem before...how does more debt solve a debt problem?

I would not say personal debt rising is a bad economic sign as people must be spending.
When it falls it means people are paying it off= bad for economy as less is being spent.

People are spending yes. But, as we have seen from the various indicies (bankrupcies, the collosal amounts of various debt agencies, bad debt banks etc) it has a knock on effect later down the line. They are spending the money they don't have to spend.

It literally means spending today means that person has less in their pockets for ALL of the following months, until that debt is paid off. As the debt will eat into their monthly income for each and every month until it is paid off.

In my mind, it's a "quick fix" good for the economy. People spend today. But what they spend today, they can't spend tommorow, unless they can secure more debt. It's also costing them more to spend that money today, due to interest. So today's spending has cost even more and there is even less for tommorows spending.

The situation can literally go on until it get's to boiling point, and then we experience what we just have. Next time however, there may not be the scope to force lending from the government and print money to save everyones butt.

This isn't doom and gloom. It's merely fact. When debt is rising, until that debt is paid off, the nation has less and less each month to spend....UNLESS they can get more debt, which allows them to re-spend.